This is pretty dark for Dragon Ball....

Catterix2006 · Post by **Catterix2006** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:32 pm

SonEric84 wrote:It's a nightmare Goku has when he's recovering from his heart disease. I don't remember exactly what episode it's in. It is pretty "dark", but that's the point. I think it was one of the better moments in the series but I wouldn't call it the "best DBZ scene ever."

Yeah, that's just because it's some US fan who loves all scenes of Dragonball that are remotely violent/dark because that makes them feel validated in watching a kid's cartoon, because that way he can pretend it's an adult show.

I remember tracking down this scene, when I was about 12, this was one of my favourites. It's also one of the few scenes I prefer the dub over, I found the music in the Japanese seen to be way over the top, it just made the scene corny. The Faulconer piece actually had some surprising subtlety to its creepiness. The JP version was just too trumpety. But I generally don't like either soundtrack.

There was also that nightmare that Goku had regarding Chichi and Gohan getting killed by Nappa and Vegeta, again, another dream set before he actually sees them

Wojak · Post by **Wojak** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:36 pm

Shiyonasan wrote:Here is the other nightmare you guys talked about that's in the Freeza Arc. I do remember seeing this. This one is much creepier. It's the dub again, because I couldn't find the Japanese version. It's episode 91.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5J7ibuDFICk

First of all, Faulconer was on drugs writing that music

. It sounds like some kind of Goa.
Second of all, that nightmare is FREAKY!

RoarkVegeta · Post by **RoarkVegeta** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:41 pm

Look up "DB: And then...!!" on Youtube. THATS DARK.

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:44 pm

Oh yeah. That scene is pure win (the Artificial Humans nightmare). I used to watch that scene REPEATEDLY on my old tapes when I was a kid. Always stuck out in my mind as a favorite scene, and yet another scene from early on in my fandom that helped draw me heavily into Dragon Ball.

The Freeza one I didn't see until a bit later, and yeah again it's a MUST with the Japanese music and voices. The dub completely murdered that scene. There are few scenes done by the dub that bother me more than this one; the way the tone and mood are destroyed by it is completely fucking indefensible in my view. The dub version of it doesn't even remotely approach anything that vaguely resembles "atmospheric" or "creepy" compared to the Japanese version, which features one of the single greatest pieces of music ever composed for Dragon Ball (the choir piece from movie 3). Instead, it's just obnoxious noise.

Hopefully someone can find a clip of it to link to (I'm coming up empty so far).

Dr. Casey · Post by **Dr. Casey** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:51 pm

Rocketman wrote:Goku giving two shits about ChiChi? What madness is this?!

Too bad he still shows the most emotion about Trunks' death. "You can kill my wife, you can kill my son, you can kill my best friend... but don't you dare touch that kid I spoke with for a few minutes three years ago!"

With that said, it is a very cool scene, though Goku's responses are a little... dry considering the extremely dramatic nature of this scene. The part where he leans down over Chichi is nicely done, but otherwise it's limited to generic anger that's not even that impressive.

Oh yeah, and speaking of creepy scenes... I forget if it's a dream or not, but I like the scene where Gohan imagines that Goku's come home, except he acts weird and creepy before transforming into Freeza. The change in mood from perfect and blissful to strained and cautious to horrible is done very well, and I like everything before the big reveal. Chichi's the prettiest she ever is in the entire series with her hair down like that, and for Christ's sake, it has the orchestral Cha-La Head Cha-La. That's like an easy pass for being a classic scene.

RoarkVegeta · Post by **RoarkVegeta** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:52 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:Oh yeah. That scene is pure win (the Artificial Humans nightmare). I used to watch that scene REPEATEDLY on my old tapes when I was a kid. Always stuck out in my mind as a favorite scene, and yet another scene from early on in my fandom that helped draw me heavily into Dragon Ball.

The Freeza one I didn't see until a bit later, and yeah again it's a MUST with the Japanese music and voices. The dub completely murdered that scene. There are few scenes done by the dub that bother me more than this one; the way the tone and mood are destroyed by it is completely fucking indefensible in my view. The dub version of it doesn't even remotely approach anything that vaguely resembles "atmospheric" or "creepy" compared to the Japanese version, which features one of the single greatest pieces of music ever composed for Dragon Ball (the choir piece from movie 3). Instead, it's just obnoxious noise.

Hopefully someone can find a clip of it to link to (I'm coming up empty so far).

Yeah. That dub clip was hilarious.

And BTW, The choir piece is from Movie 2, not 3.

Shiyonasan · Post by **Shiyonasan** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:54 pm

RoarkVegeta wrote:Look up "DB: And then...!!" on Youtube. THATS DARK.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jCCqxYCcKU

Oh yes, I own that part of the series. I remember this being talked about on the podcast on the Manga Review of Awesomeness in that part of the series and how it was much darker compared to the manga.

EDIT:

Dr. Casey wrote: Oh yeah, and speaking of creepy scenes... I forget if it's a dream or not, but I like the scene where Gohan imagines that Goku's come home, except he acts weird and creepy before transforming into Freeza. The change in mood from perfect and blissful to strained and cautious to horrible is done very well, and I like everything before the big reveal. Chichi's the prettiest she ever is in the entire series with her hair down like that, and for Christ's sake, it has the orchestral Cha-La Head Cha-La. That's like an easy pass for being a classic scene.

Would you possibly be talking about this?

Really, I'm trying to find the Japanese versions, but I can't find them. At least this clip has the Japanese music...

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:07 pm

Bussani wrote:
NeptuneKai wrote:Goku doesn't know what the Cybernetic Humans look like, how could they be in his nightmare?
He's psychic when it suits him. Even in filler I think that's a good enough explanation. :D

Goku is just a fucking walking deus ex machina. Got a super baddie that all of you combined can't beat? "O HAI AI HAZ NOO ATAKK"! About to die at the hands of a bit player? "O HAI SENZU BEEENZ"! Need to create a nightmare fuel-powered scene? "O HAI AI HAZ DREEM AWLTHO AI NEBR C DEEZ GAIZ B4"!

Yes. Goku speaks in lolcatspeak in my mind.

Dr. Casey · Post by **Dr. Casey** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:14 pm

Shiyonasan wrote:Would you possibly be talking about this?

Really, I'm trying to find the Japanese versions, but I can't find them. At least this clip has the Japanese music...

Yep, that's it. :) The music and Hotter Than Normal Chichi are the most important aspects to me, so the dub still works, and Goku's line about taking a wrong turn at Mars is charming in a way.

ToshiMustgrind · Post by **ToshiMustgrind** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:29 pm

I have definitely not seen that clip!
Chi Chi's indeed was the most startling! My reaction to Trunks was like "Oooh!" but DAMN! a neck snap on Chi Chi! Amazing scene

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:33 pm

RoarkVegeta wrote:And BTW, The choir piece is from Movie 2, not 3.

Nope, it is indeed from movie 3. Movie 2 is the one with Dr. Wheelo and and the Bio Warriors and all that. 3 is the one with the Shinsei Tree and Tullece. Movie 2 features a lot of remixed themes from original Dragon Ball. Movie 3 was where that choir piece made its series debut. It gets played a lot during scenes of the planet being drained of Ki/having its Ki restored, as well as during the scene immediately after Goku cuts Gohan's tail off. It's also played in the final standoff scene right at the end between Goku and Tullece just before they exchange their final Ki attacks.

bkev · Post by **bkev** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:37 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote: Nope, it is indeed from movie 3.

The Sleeping Princess disagrees with you... movie 2 from DragonBall. :p

Jackal puFF · Post by **Jackal puFF** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:44 pm

Wow pretty interesting!

Scarz · Post by **Scarz** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:59 pm

Whoa, whoa, whoa hold on a goddamn second here. If Goku was ill and bedridden before he met the Androids, how did he know what they looked like in his dream?! I'm shocked and sicken by this mistake.

Oh and Chichi get's her neck broken. I thought it was pretty neat the way fell back like that. Dark for DBZ funi standards.

thefalseprophecy · Post by **thefalseprophecy** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:53 pm

Catterix2006 wrote: "Yeah, that's just because it's some US fan who loves all scenes of Dragonball that are remotely violent/dark because that makes them feel validated in watching a kid's cartoon, because that way he can pretend it's an adult show."

Some US fan? What does being from the US have to do with anything Catterix2006? I see fans from all the world post videos like this with similar titles.

Amigo Ten · Post by **Amigo Ten** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:06 pm

Shiyonasan wrote:
RoarkVegeta wrote:Look up "DB: And then...!!" on Youtube. THATS DARK.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jCCqxYCcKU

Oh yes, I own that part of the series. I remember this being talked about on the podcast on the Manga Review of Awesomeness in that part of the series and how it was much darker compared to the manga.

In the manga Goku doesn't have that little psychic freak out.

And hey, one of Sarbud's videos. I know that guy.

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:11 pm

bkev wrote:
Kunzait_83 wrote: Nope, it is indeed from movie 3.
The Sleeping Princess disagrees with you... movie 2 from DragonBall. :p

No, not THAT choir piece. That's a different one.

That one is the ones used both in the Shura filler episode in DB, as well as during Piccolo's death during the Saiya-jin saga in Z.

Both choir pieces can be heard in the following link. The one you're talking about is the first one, the one I'm talking about is the second one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qN-PVTS ... annel_page

bkev · Post by **bkev** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:32 pm

My mistake then. Can't believe I didn't think of that one.

kusakun004 · Post by **kusakun004** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:08 pm

I wonder, does anyone remember if this scene was edited on TV/Cartoon Network somehow, or was it shown as is?

KKZ · Post by **KKZ** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:11 am

kusakun004 wrote:I wonder, does anyone remember if this scene was edited on TV/Cartoon Network somehow, or was it shown as is?

The blood on Trunks' sword was edited out, but was otherwise unchanged. I remember saying, "Wow, that's stupid. Wouldn't there be blood?" when I first saw the ep as a kid.

Scarz wrote:Oh and Chichi get's her neck broken. I thought it was pretty neat the way fell back like that. Dark for DBZ funi standards.

I don't understand what you mean. I fail to see how a piece of animation that was (along with every other scene in the series) left untouched from the Japanese version somehow deviates from (uncut) dub/FUNi standards.