This Doesn't Excuse The Dub, But...

DOOODGE · Post by **DOOODGE** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:03 am

Our translation is far from perfect, but I am astounded whenever I play a DBZ videogame and how much both the script and the acting have improved in English. The example I'm going to use is the "Super Saiyan Speech," aka the moment where Goku reveals to Freeza just what he is...known to people familiar with the dub as the "Hope of the Universe" speech.

Here it is in the anime:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la8np3hQKHc&fmt=18

Start watching at 7:16.

Here it is in "Burst Limit":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hr31Dcki ... ted&fmt=18

Start watching at 2:57

Whilst I'll never really think Linda Young can pull of an excellent Freeza, I could not help but smile when I saw how well Sean Schemmel did. Thoughts?

TVfan721 · Post by **TVfan721** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:22 am

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Post by **VegettoEX** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:28 am

In a giant shock of shockingness, I'll be honest and say that I never particularly thought Nozawa's delivery in the original really sold that one particular line. Well... the final line, anyway. The rest of it? Perfect. She's got that almost-creepy delivery down with the very soft spoken dialogue, as if Goku is purposefully thinking VERY HARD about what it is he's saying so he not only delivers it well, but doesn't mess-up in the process

... and he's still totally badass while doing it.

But that final line? "suupaa saiya-jin! son gokuu da!"...? I... actually don't feel anything from it. Huh. I wonder if she'll sell it a little more in Kai...?

On the other hard, the FUNimation dub deliveries in every example for that scene just rub me with disgust. I know Innagadadavida called us out a little bit on a semi-recent podcast episode when we played that Burst Limit clip and Meri found it horrendous. Quite frankly... I do, too. I think it's terrible. I firmly believe that Schemmel grew fantastically into his self-described "happy-go-lucky" version of the character, but any delivery that needs to include some raw emotion from the other side...? Ew. Not so much. I genuinely find it terrible. Where-as his happy-Goku sounds totally normal and a character's voice, his attempting-to-be-firm-and-emotional-Goku just sounds like a dude doing an angry voice. It's not convincing. It's not played well. It doesn't move me. I picture... yep, a guy behind a microphone.

And the original (1999) season three delivery, nevermind the dialogue given? Lordy lordy, don't get me going.

It's truly a shame, because these days I feel like I might actually get myself to a point where I could re-accept "an English voice for Goku"... but there's only half a character there. In the meantime, it will forever be Ian Corlett in my head, but that's a case where the actor just never got the chance to get to a part of the series where he really needed to sell the OTHER side. Goku just isn't as angry in the Saiya-jin arc as he is in the Freeza arc, and by then we had Kelamis... and... then Schemmel (ignoring the alternate-English-dub with additional Kelamis and then Morrow).

Who knows? I might have the same feelings about Corlett that I do about Schemmel if that situation ever played out (destroying the rose-tinted-glasses), but it's something we'll never know.

Did I... uhh... answer the question...?

TVfan721 · Post by **TVfan721** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:39 am

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A-dono · Post by **A-dono** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:46 am

I believe Chris Psaros once said that Sean Schemmel sounded like Doug Funny after puberty when he played Goku, and he's kind of right, but I will concede that Schemmel really has improved.

I understand that Goku's voice, like Freeza's, is very difficult to get down but I don't think FUNimation put enough effort into finding someone that properly reflected Goku. Schemmel's a good VA, and while he can do goofy-Goku quite well, he's only 1/3 of the package for me.

So yeah, he's gotten better, but I never thought he was ideal for the part in the first place.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:51 am

Ok, Goku's voice doesn't matter to me. As a constant target of my RAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE, I'm all for him being subpar. However, what I don't get is why we can't get a decent English Freeza. Linda Young just doesn't do it for me, and quite frankly, turns a great villain into a laughingstock, vocally.

I just don't see how, out of all of Funi's talents, they thought she would be the best Freeza.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:53 am

Saiyavenger2941 wrote:I just don't see how, out of all of Funi's talents, they thought she would be the best Freeza.

They didn't. They (mostly Barry Watson) thought Pauline Newstone was their perfect Freeza, and season three was just a failed attempt to re-capture and mimic all of those voices.

Saiyavenger2941 · Post by **Saiyavenger2941** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 11:01 am

VegettoEX wrote:
Saiyavenger2941 wrote:I just don't see how, out of all of Funi's talents, they thought she would be the best Freeza.
They didn't. They (mostly Barry Watson) thought Pauline Newstone was their perfect Freeza, and season three was just a failed attempt to re-capture and mimic all of those voices.

Well, that explains it. I can't say I was too sold on Newstone either, though. Neither of em really capture what I think Freeza should've been. (Which, honestly, is closer to Ryūsei Nakao's portrayal)

Of course, after a decade with the same actress, I guess we won't be getting something new. It's a shame too.

omegacwa · Post by **omegacwa** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 11:09 am

Although I have no problem with Corlett, Kelamis in World's Strongest still stands as the best english voice of Goku ever.

I'm not really a fan of Schemmel, I could just never really get used to it. It's not "bad acting" like most people might say, it's more about just his personal inflection and voice I don't like.

For some reason, I am completely fine with most of Sabat's voice, maybe he sounds more natural or something, I don't know, he really grew into his roles.

As for Freeza, I'm not sure how his voice should have been handled in English. Certainly not the way it was. No offense to either lady who did the voice, as they were cast and did their jobs accordingly.
I'm just not sure a women should have been used, but a full on man voice wouldn't have been good either. But if it was too androgynous, people would have been crying "gay" in the streets.

I once did a fan dub of a scene with Freeza, and for his voice I kind of did a Babidi voice with a smoother tone and pseudo British accent. It was well liked by some of the people I showed it too.

TVfan721 · Post by **TVfan721** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 11:12 am

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DOOODGE · Post by **DOOODGE** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 11:51 am

tvfan721 wrote:It really sucks that Funimation was too lazy to redub Season 3 for the Remastered Set. They only redubbed part of it even though it all needed doing. They should have at least redubbed Goku's lines. Why didn't Sean redub Goku, does anyone know?

They didn't redub Goku's lines because Sean Schemmel doesn't live in the area anymore (and, therefore, couldn't redub). He now lives in New York where his primary employer (for anime, anyway) is the Dark Empire. Well, that's what I call it. It's referred to by some as "4Kids Entertainment."

Which I'm not blaming him for. As a voice actor myself, I can understand that if 4Kids offered him more money, he made the right decesion in moving there...voice acting is a very tough gig to live off of.

He still comes back to do the videogames because they can be recorded in one or two "cram sessions" for each character. Dubbing the anime itself takes A LOT longer, though, to the point where it wouldn't make any financial sense to fly down to Texas, pay for a hotel room for a few weeks, and then go back.

Too bad, too. He would have been good.

Tyro · Post by **Tyro** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:13 pm

tvfan721 wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFjSMPGKcgE

Did anyone else notice Freeza's magic lips at 1:09 - 1:10?

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:15 pm

I believe he stated his main reason for not coming back to redub the Freeza stuff was because he was proud of it, not to mention those early days were terrible.

Castor Troy · Post by **Castor Troy** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:59 pm

DOOODGE wrote:
tvfan721 wrote:It really sucks that Funimation was too lazy to redub Season 3 for the Remastered Set. They only redubbed part of it even though it all needed doing. They should have at least redubbed Goku's lines. Why didn't Sean redub Goku, does anyone know?
They didn't redub Goku's lines because Sean Schemmel doesn't live in the area anymore (and, therefore, couldn't redub). He now lives in New York where his primary employer (for anime, anyway) is the Dark Empire. Well, that's what I call it. It's referred to by some as "4Kids Entertainment."

Which I'm not blaming him for. As a voice actor myself, I can understand that if 4Kids offered him more money, he made the right decesion in moving there...voice acting is a very tough gig to live off of.

He still comes back to do the videogames because they can be recorded in one or two "cram sessions" for each character. Dubbing the anime itself takes A LOT longer, though, to the point where it wouldn't make any financial sense to fly down to Texas, pay for a hotel room for a few weeks, and then go back.

Too bad, too. He would have been good.

Sean was busy voicing every secondary character in the new TMNT.

rereboy · Post by **rereboy** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:59 pm

tvfan721 wrote:Honestly, the Portuguese Dub had the best Freeza voice, I'm serious. Listen to the voice, the insane Joker style voice fits the character perfectly. I know that dub had tons of problems but I really do think they got Freeza's voice perfectly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFjSMPGKcgE

I agree.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:11 pm

rereboy wrote:
tvfan721 wrote:Honestly, the Portuguese Dub had the best Freeza voice, I'm serious. Listen to the voice, the insane Joker style voice fits the character perfectly. I know that dub had tons of problems but I really do think they got Freeza's voice perfectly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFjSMPGKcgE
I agree.

I do not. I'd go as far as to say I'd take Linda Young over that.

Innagadadavida · Post by **Innagadadavida** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:11 pm

DOOODGE wrote:He still comes back to do the videogames because they can be recorded in one or two "cram sessions" for each character. Dubbing the anime itself takes A LOT longer, though, to the point where it wouldn't make any financial sense to fly down to Texas, pay for a hotel room for a few weeks, and then go back.

Which is why I think if FUNimation were to do Kai, they wouldn't have the same VAs. I also think that they would do an accurate translation for the dub. They obviously listen to us and know what we want (Dragonbox, anyone?), so they're plenty aware that we've want a better dub for Z. And with all the praise they received over their One Piece dub, I'd be surprised if they decided to take any liberties at all with Kai.

I would actually prefer to see a new cast. Even though I like the FUNimation version of Z, it would sound a little odd to have them suddenly play accurate portrayals of the characters. Then again that will cause even more confusion and provide another split in the fan base. Not to mention, which cast would do video games and ext.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:14 pm

Innagadadavida wrote:
DOOODGE wrote:He still comes back to do the videogames because they can be recorded in one or two "cram sessions" for each character. Dubbing the anime itself takes A LOT longer, though, to the point where it wouldn't make any financial sense to fly down to Texas, pay for a hotel room for a few weeks, and then go back.
Which is why I think if FUNimation were to do Kai, they wouldn't have the same VAs. I also think that they would do an accurate translation for the dub. They obviously listen to us and know what we want (Dragonbox, anyone?), so they're plenty aware that we've want a better dub for Z. And with all the praise they received over their One Piece dub, I'd be surprised if they decided to take any liberties at all with Kai.

I would actually prefer to see a new cast. Even though I like the FUNimation version of Z, it would sound a little odd to have them suddenly play accurate portrayals of the characters. Then again that will cause even more confusion and provide another split in the fan base. Not to mention, which cast would do video games and ext.

And thus one of the biggest delimas in English voice cast fandom, to start fresh or not? FUNimation's got 400 voice actors to choose from. If this purged from their memories any of their previous DB work, I'd say a great number of those 400 might get cast in the show.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:15 pm

Innagadadavida wrote:
DOOODGE wrote:He still comes back to do the videogames because they can be recorded in one or two "cram sessions" for each character. Dubbing the anime itself takes A LOT longer, though, to the point where it wouldn't make any financial sense to fly down to Texas, pay for a hotel room for a few weeks, and then go back.
Which is why I think if FUNimation were to do Kai, they wouldn't have the same VAs. I also think that they would do an accurate translation for the dub. They obviously listen to us and know what we want (Dragonbox, anyone?), so they're plenty aware that we've want a better dub for Z. And with all the praise they received over their One Piece dub, I'd be surprised if they decided to take any liberties at all with Kai.

I would actually prefer to see a new cast. Even though I like the FUNimation version of Z, it would sound a little odd to have them suddenly play accurate portrayals of the characters. Then again that will cause even more confusion and provide another split in the fan base. Not to mention, which cast would do video games and ext.

Exactly, I absolutely don't think Funi would replace the current voice cast just because of the outrage that would ensue from the dub fanbase. For the most part I don't mind a lot of the dub voices, they just have to turn it down a notch...or seven. The script is what stops me from watching the dub so if they fix that I'd be one happy camper. It would suck that we'd only get a proper dub on a product I don't care for but I'd take it.

TVfan721 · Post by **TVfan721** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:16 pm

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