Stereotyping

[Perfect]

On occasion my Google searches will lead me to the deepest, darkest, unyielding crevasses of the Internet. On my journey I'll see threads and posts that further the stereotypes for many series. So around 3:00 AM I ventured back into some "zomg dbz is all the same, they stare at each other for 20 years, charge an attack for 383 episodes (8 months in dbz time), then get cut off by the narrator who does that annoying NEXT TIME ON DRAGON BALL Z thing. Get into real anime u noobs" type threads, I read on and on. Suddenly a question hit me, so I've come to ask it here.

What form of stereotype for the franchise bothers you the most?

For me well it'd have to be those "scripts to summarize the series", why? I mean generally speaking, I'm very tolerant. Though there's just those few things that tend to go a bit overboard to the point of just being stale or otherwise completely redundant. As to why? They're extremely cliched and repetitive and look at everything from the perspective of four year old, whose main aim in the world is to make sure everyone knows it's their prerogative to express their ignorant opinion on something. To add to that, the people you have agreeing with it are the type of people whose only means of justifying themselves revolves around some ambivalent rant about about why they're right, which is generally taken from the summarized script (talk about being unique).

[Ringworm128]

People saying all the characters have spiky hair when they don't, except for the SSJs and Yamucha in the Android arc.

[gotensottile]

The staring.
I love the staring, because it keeps you anticipating a fight that you know could break out any second.
It's not long at all, at any point. It's not boring, it's suspenseful.

[SuperSaiyan3Goku]

The "groaning and sounding like talking a dump" that fans always bicker about. As far as I can tell, that's only from the early dub, evident in Season 3 of DBZ.

But then the Japanese version doesn't sound like that. Not nearly as forced as the dub's yells and grunts. It's the same with any other Anime. Bleach, Naruto, Soul Eater. They all have fighting, but they don't sound like they have to take a dump 24/7.

[The Tori-bot]

Probably the "dbz is just nothing but muscly blond guys beating each other up!!!", when in fact the only two muscular blonde guys to beat each other up takes up around four chapters near the end of the series. The main point there of course is the unfortunately all-too-prevelant "it's nothing but fighting". Sure, watch the Goku vs Freeza fight and nothing else and you may be forgiven for thinking this due to how long it drags, but people seem to overlook the adventure and sci-fi elements of it. And that's not even going into DB or GT, where fighting takes a backseat to everything else most of the time.

[SHINOBI-03]

I guess... everything exaggerated by the trolls!!

"Everyone sounds like girls in the Japanese version, and if you like them, you're a Japanophile."
"Five minutes = 1000 episodes."
"Yelling and Screaming."
"BROLI IS CANON YOU CAN'T PROVE ME WRONG!!"
"SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY, DRAGON BALL ZEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
"DBZ suks balls go wach Nearudooo dumb f@ck"
"LOLZ evry1 sounds gay LOL"
"LOL V3geta sux over 9000!"
"WHAAAAAA Jap version dont has hAdcore muzik it suk ballz"

[Cipher]

Considering the obscenely large number of hilariously irreverent stereotypes within the series itself, can we really complain about this?

At any rate, I'll stereotype the kinds of people who would say "go watch real anime u noob" in the first place. None of them have ever had sex. Game, set, match.

[SHINOBI-03]

Considering the obscenely large number of hilariously irreverent stereotypes within the series itself, can we really complain about this?

That's what I thought the topic would be about.

[Blue]

I don't really mind stereotypes of the show. The only one that got to me was this half assed list on 4chan that described "every saga" that was very very blatantly wrong. I went through that and debunked it but y'know...4chan.

[LeprikanGT]

I guess... everything exaggerated by the trolls!!

"Everyone sounds like girls in the Japanese version, and if you like them, you're a Japanophile."
"Five minutes = 1000 episodes."
"Yelling and Screaming."
"BROLI IS CANON YOU CAN'T PROVE ME WRONG!!"
"SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY, DRAGON BALL ZEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
"DBZ suks balls go wach Nearudooo dumb f@ck"
"LOLZ evry1 sounds gay LOL"
"LOL V3geta sux over 9000!"
"WHAAAAAA Jap version dont has hAdcore muzik it suk ballz"

I can't say much. I don't like the 'girl voices', I love me some 'hadcore' dub music, and I like Broly.

[Rory]

I can't say much. I don't like the 'girl voices', I love me some 'hadcore' dub music, and I like Broly.

You are the bane of my existence.

Yes, I also hate the "LOL HE SOUNDS LIKE A LITTLE GIRL!!" comments.
Never met a little girl that sounds like Masako Nozawa, and hopefully I never will. It's a stupid comment made by close-minded individuals who want to stay as far away from the original as possible.

[Godo]

Yes, I also hate the "LOL HE SOUNDS LIKE A LITTLE GIRL!!" comments.
Never met a little girl that sounds like Masako Nozawa, and hopefully I never will. It's a stupid comment made by close-minded individuals who want to stay as far away from the original as possible.

They don't like it because of that they are reminded of their own pre-pubescent voices.
I didn't react much when I heard Goku's Japanese voice, to be honest. I thought it was a bit odd, but I didn't think that it sounded like a woman's voice. Maybe a bit like a pygmé's voice.
But when he speaks calmly, it sounds like a very high-pitched man voice, and I have actually met a man who spoke with a similar voice.
He is dead now, though. He drowned when he went out fishing with his son.

[jjgp1112]

Basically, the usual "every fight takes 50 episodes and 10 of those are people staring each other down and screaming like they're constipated"

[VegettoEX]

At the risk of potentially diving into racial discrimination territory, I'm pretty comfortable saying that (for the most part...) every "stereotype" exists for a reason, and usually because at least some element of it is based in reality:

• The stereotype of "everyone sounds like they're constipated" stems from FUNimation's rookie dubbing in 1999 when... well... everyone sounded like they were consitipated.
• The stereotype of "everyone stands around and stares at each other" stems from the fact that there's a good deal of filler material, and branching off of that, many people are not used to watching a show that's constructed in a way where filler material has ever been an entity at all (see: formulaic, weekly, self-contained episodes of any American show).
• The stereotype of "everyone sounds like little girls" stems from people who have never had an opportunity to sit down and listen to another spoken language having their world crash down around them when they find out this one's actually Japanese and there are different norms, expectations, choices, etc.

And honestly, jumping off of an e-mail we received last podcast episode... how many of these "stereotypes" are just from a bunch of barely-teenagers having their first bout of unsupervised independence on the Internet? Is that something to even dedicate some brain cycles to? They're all purposeful exaggerations ("everyone" sounds like little girls, instead of "Goku" sounds like a little girl) to elicit a negative response out of someone (namely, you). By acknowledging and responding to them, you give them credibility.

Can it be and is it annoying? Sure. You only make it worse by giving them any credence, though. Why are these the types of people you want to talk to?

I've told this story before, but a positive example of how this can be turned around was a question I got after finishing up our "The DBZ You've Never Seen" panel at Otakon 2007 (I think that was the year...?). Someone came up to me afterward... and I don't remember exactly how they phrased it... but the long and short of it was something like, "Why is it that you enjoy a show like DragonBall?" It could be taken in a bunch of different directions -- I could have interpreted it as generic trolling and responded defensively, which would only complicate things. What I did, though, was explain some of the themes of the show that I really enjoyed (camaraderie, the drive to become better), and some of the specific story-telling elements (ensemble casts, plot points like time travel). What could have been a "lolz you suck! / NUH UH! in-person play-out of Internet douchebaggery turned itself into a constructive conversation. I don't know if the person legitimately meant to act like a troll of legitimately wondered why it was someone liked the story... but at the end of the day, I guess it's more about your response than anything else.

Didn't mean for that story to come off as, "I act better than you do!"... but... uhhh... hope it helps...?

[Rory]

Didn't mean for that story to come off as, "I act better than you do!"...

Well it did. I hope you're happy LaBrie.

[VegettoEX]

Didn't mean for that story to come off as, "I act better than you do!"...

Well it did. I hope you're happy LaBrie.

Rory, I cannot possibly be more happy than I am knowing that you are sad, ashamed, and ready to toss your pet dog into the river. Mission accomplished.

[Zephyr]

I can't say much. I don't like the 'girl voices', I love me some 'hadcore' dub music, and I like Broly.

You are the bane of my existence.

Yes, I also hate the "LOL HE SOUNDS LIKE A LITTLE GIRL!!" comments.
Never met a little girl that sounds like Masako Nozawa, and hopefully I never will. It's a stupid comment made by close-minded individuals who want to stay as far away from the original as possible.

Now this is a steroetype. ^
From my perspective, its not that they're deliberately trying to stray from the original as much as possible, its simply that it sounds alien and unexpected to someone who is not accustomed to it (the fundamental reason fans of one one version dislike another), Goku's Japanese voice being more high pitched than his dub one is a prime example.

Nothing wrong with the voice in any sense, that's just not Goku to them, the same way that Schemmel isn't Goku to the fans of the Japanese version. The "it sounds like a girl" excuse is just a defense mechanism, put up because they don't know the real reason why they dislike it, and because its the easiest excuse.

Dragging on forever - Read the Manga or watch Kai if you want faster fight scenes

ONLY HARREDKOARZ FIGHTINGZ!!1!! - Watch/read Dragonball

Repetitive Story - This one I don't really have a defense for. The story is quite repetitive.

Go watch a GOOD anime - If Dragonball is bad anime, I don't want good anime. I normally dislike anime with a fucking passion, but I love Dragonball. I don't watch it because its an enjoyable anime, I watch it because the story is simply enjoyable, and I'm not using some damn *Do's and Don'ts of Good Anime* checklist to criticize it. I couldn't really pinpoint the reason for my enjoyment of it, but nostalgia, coupled with the way the different races and organizations inadvertently affect each other throughout the story, must have some weight.

Okay, that last one wasn't really a stereotype, sorry bout that.
[/unintended rants]

EDIT: various little tweaks

[Cowboy Dev]

The Japanese voices sounding like girls stereotype has always bothered me. If Toshio Furukawa and Ryo Horikawa sound like females, I don't know what a man sounds like then.

[Piccolo Daimao]

The form of stereotype for the franchise that bothers me the most is the general assumption of any ignorant non-Dragon Ball fan or newcomer to the series: that all Dragon Ball Z is about are muscly spiky-haired blond guys fighting, making big explosions and yelling like they're constipated. While this stereotype does have some basis, the fact that it's over-exaggerated as if that's all that happens does annoy me a bit, especially when kids at my school ridicule me for still liking it.

Oh, and a stereotype that's more to do with me and the people I hang around with than in the general fandom: that the original Dragon Ball is basically hentai. It's not a good idea to bring in the first volume of Dragon Ball into school with you and let your friends look at Bulma showering naked, especially when, for some, it's their first impression of the series.

[ShonenKnife]

It's not a good idea to bring in the first volume of Dragon Ball into school with you and let your friends look at Bulma showering naked, especially when, for some, it's their first impression of the series.

Tell me about it, Only yesterday I had a friend, and a somewhat fan of the series, over and let him browse through my copy of the first volume. Without describing how ridiculous his reaction was upon finding that particular panel (he's 19) it would do nothing but perpetuate such a stereotype as this one.

Granted, this same person has consistently refused, despite two years of pestering, to watch any of the original Japanese material with me, and so is no greater a credit to our ranks than the average 4chan troll.

Another stereotype more to do with fandom than the franchise itself - that we, as DragonBall fans, give too much credit to what is seen to be nothing more than a kid's series with no depth. I actually argued with one of my English teachers back at school, who knew the series through it's inclusion in our school library (and all the drawings on my folder ) that there were such big issues addressed such as racial profiling and genocide. What he wondered was, why would the author of such a series, with it's "intended audience" in mind, tackle such themes?

We all enjoy taking away the messages that the story and the characters leave us with, whether those messages were intended or not (I realise the ideas I mentioned above are a bit extreme, given the context), and I'm kind of tired of people questioning our analyses on the basis that what's under scrutiny is merely a cartoon.