Anyone actually like DBE?

[SHINOBI-03]

The plot is vague and dumb

I found no problems with it actually. Everything seemed clear and explained, unlike some parts in DBZ and I wasnt expecting oscar worthy acting either.

Oh really... did it explain how did Piccolo escape from the sealing jar? Or who exactly is Mai and why she works for Piccolo?

[Senzu_Bean]

The plot is vague and dumb

I found no problems with it actually. Everything seemed clear and explained, unlike some parts in DBZ and I wasnt expecting oscar worthy acting either.

Oh really... did it explain how did Piccolo escape from the sealing jar? Or who exactly is Mai and why she works for Piccolo?

How the hell did Bibidi created Majin Buu? Who exactly are Cui, Zarbon and Dodoria and why do they work for Freeza? I never saw anyone bitching about that and the other numerous unexplained events in the original work.

It is funny how much of the complaints are faults that actually exist in the original work, the work most, for whatever, reason wanted the film to be an exact copy off.

[Hellspawn28]

I hope someone will buy the rights to Dragon Ball/Z again, and give us a better movie. .

No one will buy a license that doesn't give profit from the start. Only a lunatic would buy the rights to do a Dragonball film at this point.

Yeah good point. It looks like Fox was the wrong stuido to make a Dragon Ball movie, and they only made DBE since there rights where about to come to a end.

[Senzu_Bean]

It looks like Fox was the wrong stuido to make a Dragon Ball movie...

Why?! Fox being the one who owned the rights to a Dragonball film was never a reason why people bitch about it. You have to realize even before the film went into production, much before the cast, the crew, etc. are assigned to the film pretty much everybody in the fandom disliked the project. How is that even possible, in the realm of logic, I don't know. But if one conclusion can be take from all this is that the fans, not the crew, the studio, etc., doomed this movie from the start.

[SSJSteve]

It looks like Fox was the wrong stuido to make a Dragon Ball movie...

But if one conclusion can be take from all this is that the fans, not the crew, the studio, etc., doomed this movie from the start.

How can you say that? If FOX had put money and effort into the project and the film was amazing I'm pretty sure fans wouldn't be hating on it. You can't blame the fans, blame FOX and James Wong.

[Senzu_Bean]

It looks like Fox was the wrong stuido to make a Dragon Ball movie...

But if one conclusion can be take from all this is that the fans, not the crew, the studio, etc., doomed this movie from the start.

How can you say that? If FOX had put money and effort into the project and the film was amazing I'm pretty sure fans wouldn't be hating on it. You can't blame the fans, blame FOX and James Wong.

Are you kidding me, right? When the fans say the movie sucks cause there is no Krillin, no Tenshinhan, no Vegeta, Goku is smart (like he is for more than 90% of the story) and white, Oozaru is only 10 feet tall, etc., etc. you can clearly see who in reality doomed the movie.

I am still shocked how nobody said the movie sucked cause Piccolo has five fingers, instead of four.

[Hellspawn28]

Well Fox has been to known to screw up movies, for example the X-Men and Alien/Predator movies for example. They where the ones that choose Anderson to direct AVP, and AVP fans today still hate him for screwing up the series. Even David Fincher said that he did not like Fox for not letting him do what he wanted with Alien 3.

I feel like a live action Dragon Ball movie had a great potential, and Fox picking James Wong seem like the wrong choice. I don't think we will see another Dragon Ball movie anytime soon, and if a sequel to DBE was made then it will likely be a direct to video movie similar to "Starship Troopers 2" (2004).

[Senzu_Bean]

Well Fox has been to known to screw up movies, for example the X-Men and Alien/Predator movies for example.

The X-Men movies are pretty good, imo. AVP not that much, specially the second.

[SSJSteve]

Are you kidding me, right? When the fans say the movie sucks cause there is no Krillin, no Tenshinhan, no Vegeta, Goku is smart (like he is for more than 90% of the story), Oozaru is only 10 feet tall, etc., etc. you can clearly see who in reality doomed the movie.

Who should we blame for those characters not being in the movie? FOX.

If FOX had put money into that film I'm sure they could have had more characters, the movie had a budget of $30 million! If fans had seen a trailer with every character in it, and it actually looked good, maybe more people would have watched it.

[the_abberration]

But if one conclusion can be take from all this is that the fans, not the crew, the studio, etc., doomed this movie from the start.

DBE failed as film. It was even panned by moviegoers and critics who were not even fans or familiar with the source material. Fox rested on the laurels that the name was going to be the draw for the fans. But it still had to tell a story for the non fans to follow. A genre movie in the vein of anime or comics has to cater to the non fans as much as the fan. If that movie catered solely to the DBZ fan, even if it was a good movie it would still fail financially. There may be a lot of fans, but not enough to generate the type of ticket sales needed.

Case in point, Scott Pilgram. It was faithful to the source material, catered to the fans, told a story the non fan could follow and meet with great reviews. However, it failed financially for those reasons. I wish Mr. Plinkett of Red Letter Media would do a review of DBE. He has a way of breaking down the failures of a film as a film.

[Senzu_Bean]

Are you kidding me, right? When the fans say the movie sucks cause there is no Krillin, no Tenshinhan, no Vegeta, Goku is smart (like he is for more than 90% of the story), Oozaru is only 10 feet tall, etc., etc. you can clearly see who in reality doomed the movie.

Who should we blame for those characters not being in the movie? FOX.

You don't get it. Nobody should bitch about that. It is fucking ridiculous! You can't expect a movie to fit every character that exists in a 42 volume manga. It is beyond retard. Nobody complains that the first Spider-Man movie doesn't have Venom, Dr. Octopus, etc., etc. cause it doesn't have any logic. It is like bitching about a soccer game that doesn't have naked women running around. It shouldn't have it!

DBE failed as film. It was even panned by moviegoers and critics who were not even fans or familiar with the source material.

Your point is? Transformers, 2012, etc., etc. also failed as films, yet they made a lot bunch of money.

[SSJSteve]

You don't get it. Nobody should bitch about that. It is fucking ridiculous! You can't expect a movie to fit every character that exists in a 42 volume manga. It is beyond retard. Nobody complains that the first Spider-Man movie doesn't have Venom, Dr. Octopus, etc., etc. cause it doesn't have any logic. It is bitching a soccer game doesn't have naked women running around.

I don't think you get it. How can you blame the fans for the failure of the film? How hard would it be to add Krillin, Tenshinhan, Chiaotzu, Oolong, Yajirobe and Piccolo's henchmen? They wouldn't need to be in the film for long. Also they didn't have to add in every character, it was only focusing on the Piccolo stuff.

DBE failed as film. It was even panned by moviegoers and critics who were not even fans or familiar with the source material.

Your point is? Transformers, 2012, etc., etc. also failed as films, yet they made a lot bunch of money.

Those films were actually advertised a lot, and looked good.

[the_abberration]

Your point is? Transformers, 2012, etc., etc. also failed as films, yet they made a lot bunch of money.

True. Transformers was panned by the die hard fans. But it was targeted to the non fans too. Taregeting the non fans of the genre is what helped to make it a success. And to do that, you have to make a good film. Even without the Transformers name, it would have been a good movie.

When you said

"But if one conclusion can be take from all this is that the fans, not the crew, the studio, etc., doomed this movie from the start."

That's not true. Unless you're saying "fans" as a whole. In which case, I will say that Star Trek XI was also doomed by the fans before it came out. But when it did, it was a success. Mainly because it used every formula to be successful with the fans that were not familiar with the source material. And even if you took the name and the connection to Trek away from that movie, it could still stand on it's own.

The fans had nothing to do with DBE being a bad movie. DBE being a bad movie made it a bad movie. Even if it wasn't named DBE it would have been bad (to some people) as a film.

[Senzu_Bean]

I don't think you get it. How can you blame the fans for the failure of the film? How hard would it be to add Krillin, Tenshinhan, Chiaotzu, Oolong, Yajirobe and Piccolo's henchmen? They wouldn't need to be in the film for long. Also they didn't have to add in every character, it was only focusing on the Piccolo stuff.

That is the amazing logic most Dragonball fans have. You honestly can't introduce so many characters and expect it to be more or less accurate with the original work. As an introduction film merging the initial part of the story with the first main enemy isn't not a bad move at all.

Heck, the 10th Anniversary Dragonball movie did that too and nobody bitched about it.

If you want a fair adaptation of the Piccolo stuff then Krillin would be dead. Chaotzu would be dead too. Yamcha won't play any role at all. Bulma wouldn't too. Roshi would die in the first minutes. Etc. Etc.

Like I said only in Dragonball fan logic merging the initial part of the story with the first main enemy is a bad move.

Those films were actually advertised a lot, and looked good.

Advertised a lot? Yes. Looked good? In Transformers case sure, just like DBE does. 2012?

True. Transformers was panned by the die hard fans. But it was targeted to the non fans too. Taregeting the non fans of the genre is what helped to make it a success. And to do that, you have to make a good film. Even without the Transformers name, it would have been a good movie.

Are you actually saying Transformers is a good movie?

That's not true. Unless you're saying "fans" as a whole. In which case, I will say that Star Trek XI was also doomed by the fans before it came out. But when it did, it was a success.

You can't honestly compare Dragonball with Star Trek.

The fans had nothing to do with DBE being a bad movie. DBE being a bad movie mad it a bad movie. Even if it wasn't named DBE it would have been bad (to some people) as a film.

And?! Being a bad movie isn't synonyms of failure. Heck, most failures are great movies and most successes are piles of shit.

[the_abberration]

Are you actually saying Transformers is a good movie?

Yes. As a summer movie, it met expectations. As a fan of the source material, it didn't meet those expectations. As a film, while the plot was weak, it provided a fair amount of action and comedy. But I went in knowing that as a Transformers fan, it was't targeted at me. But I also caught every nod that the target audience did not get as well. I liked it as a film not as Transformers. And it seems others did as well. But I would wager a guess that the majority who did like it, were not fans of the source material.

You can't honestly compare Dragonball with Star Trek.

As a movie that was trying to make it bones by using the name, was doomed by the die hard fans from the start, still is panned by the die hard fans after it came out, and targeted the non fan, I think it's a good comparision. The differences are that while Star Trek did everything right as a film, DBE did not.

And?! Being a bad movie isn't synonyms of failure. Heck, most failures are great movies and most successes are piles of shit.

And I never said it was. Fox did little to advertise this movie. IIRC trailers started showing on TV about a week before it came out. Theaters showed it as a trailer before few movies. The plot was weak. Chow Yung Fat wasn't at his best. Justin Chatwin was a poor fit and looked like he didn't even know where he was half the time. The special effects and backgrounds were spotty at best. And overall Fox cheaply made the movie to pocket most of the budget from the start.

And you think the fans doomed DBE??

[Kaboom]

Senzu_Bean, watch the attitude. Talking down to people and using roll-eye emoticons is not going to "win" you the thread.

Both sides here have a point. Something as simple as mere inclusion or omission of certain characters is not enough to single-handedly doom or save a movie. The film and its plot would have been just fine without Kuririn or Tenshinhan or Oolong... If it were a good movie.

And that's the kicker. Even apart from its differences from the original material, DBE just was a mediocre movie at best. In that vein I view it a lot like I do GT. It had a lot of overall good ideas and some particular elements that really shined, but really just failed in its execution.

[Hellspawn28]

Well Fox has been to known to screw up movies, for example the X-Men and Alien/Predator movies for example.

The X-Men movies are pretty good, imo.

I like them as well, but Fox screw up with X-Men 3 by adding the Dark Phoenix Arc into the movie. In the comics The Dark Phoenix saga was a pretty huge event, and they did a bad job on watering it down. And that they screw up Deadpool badly in Wolverine.

Speaking of Fox and Comic Book movies, they made Galactus into a cloud since they wanted him to be more realistic .

Are you actually saying Transformers is a good movie?

Well the movie had a fresh rating on RT the last time I check, and most fans like myself thought it was a good flick. I wish I can say the same for the second movie since it won worst movie of 2009.

[Raithos]

Transformers 1 was actually a good movie. The story was executed well and there was something for everyone... family comedy, action, and adventure. Overall good time at the movies.

The second one... meh not so much, but I think the new Transformer movies are decent. I'm not going to bash them because Micheal Bay didn't include Optimus' "trailer", or there's no "Hot Rod/Rodimus" etc. I like the new movies just as much as I like G1 Transformers.

[Kaboom]

This is fascinating and all, but I think we're straying a bit too much from the topic now.

[Bardo117]

I saw a trailer a long time ago. It was fake, but it had the most awesome song ever, but now I can't find it. The video had clips from Transformers, and Smallville. Been trying to look for that trailer for 2 years now.