Dragon Ball Z: SPARKING "Budokai Tenkaichi"

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 11:30 am

ngnikolaos wrote:My only question is... does Tenkaichi REALLY have only "less than a year of production"? Perhaps it was in development for far longer, but it was hush-hush.

Thats probably just a lot of bullshit, to make the Japanese production company seem "better" at doing the deed than an American one. Most platform games take a year or longer to complete, and then theres some that can take 5 years or more, and piss it all away.
[Note: The five year reference, is for the game Fable, for the Xbox.]
[Brief history: Fable began as "Project Ego" in 1997, and was to be released on the Macintosh. It sat in development till 1999, when Microsoft came, and contracted its release on the Xbox, where it eeked it's development along until 2004, and it's release, as only half the game it was planned to be.]

Anyway, yeah, it might be all ego being that "less than a year" thing, or it might not be, it's hard to say. However, we might be able to tell it's quality upon release, if it's a complete flop.

Also, I just saw the latest video, and I thought it looked pretty neat. It's sad though, that with everything they showed us that they couldn't say whether there will be in-game transformations, or if the transformed states would be seperate characters or not. This makes for heavy handed speculation, which isn't fun to wade through.

denitonis · Post by **denitonis** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:31 pm

Edit: Updated the list with the names as given in the video unless there is a ">" next to them, when there is some text next to the characters inbetween of two -'s it means that it is text under the character name.

They showed 57 characters aligned next to each other in the last interview video at Gamespot, though what is weird is that both Vegeta and Mirai no Trunks are there twice.
For Vegeta we see one next to Goku and one next to Nappa with a scouter on, while Mirai no Trunks is seen twice once with short hair and once with long.
I checked the interview in PowerDVD so I could scroll picture by picture and this is the list you can see then:

??Random Box??

Goku
Vegeta
Piccolo
Krillin
Yamcha
Tien
Chiaotzu
Kid Gohan
Teen Gohan
Gohan
Great Saiyaman
> Mirai no Trunks
> Mirai no Trunks (long Hair)
> Trunks Kid
> Goten
Gotenks
Vegito
Gogeta Super Saiyan
> Gogeta SSJ4
Raditz
Nappa
Vegeta
Saibamen
> Zarbon
Dodoria
Captain Ginyu
> Recoome
Burter
Jeice
Guldo
> Frieza
Android #16
Android #17
Android #18
Android #19
Android #20
Cell -1st Form-
Cell Jr.
Demon King Dabura
Majin Buu (Good)
Majin Buu (Pure Evil)
Super Buu
Kid Buu
Hercule
Videl
Bardock
Cooler -Final Form-
> Brolly
Bojack -Post-Transformation-
Janemba
Baby Vegeta
Super 17
Great Ape
Kid Goku
Master Roshi
General Tao

56 Characters

Offcourse some characters have arrows up/down this would seem to be different transformations, although Gogeta also has 2 listings?
Go see for yourselves.

Edit: does anybody know what the List= button inbetween the List and Img button does, or how to work it?

Jord · Post by **Jord** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:37 pm

Look at this screen:

Does this mean the characters will look more damaged as the fight progresses?

Son Goku · Post by **Son Goku** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:03 pm

Yes, they'll be battle damaged as the fight goes on

(that was actually one of the first things announced

).

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:07 pm

I'm pretty 99% sure it's been confirmed on gamespot that in-game transformations are out, anyone who isn't lazy enough to read a simple editorial, then check this out: http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/drag ... 30926.html . As I'm too lazy to qoute the sentences used to confirm it

. But basicly what's said is 90 characters will be available in Dueling Mode, and I think you all know what that means. How is it 90 characters are playable when only 60 were confirmed? That's right fellow DBZ fans, the Ki forms shall be separate characters in selection, and it has been confirmed as I said that 90 characters will be in Dueling Mode. Two words: This bites

DB_Fan · Post by **DB_Fan** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:13 pm

These pictures confirm Kid Goku, Tao Pai Pai, Oozaro and Master Roshi:
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/7885 ... chi3lg.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/ ... geta01.jpg
Videl and Bardock:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/ ... perbuu.jpg
Saibamen:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/ ... geta02.jpg

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:17 pm

What it confirms is, people jump to conclusions without definitive proof to back them up. Just because GameSpot says 90 characters doesn't mean a thing. All we know is the 60 confirmed characters, and a little about the modes used, and that SS-J will be in it in one respect.
Without attention to detail we know nothing else, and speculating that in-game transformations are out, and that when GameSpot mentions a character sum it confirms it, is just wishful thinking.

Like I said before, we aren't going to get anywhere speculating; it will be easier, and more beneficial to just wait until the game is released. When it releases in November, we can see for ourselves what they kept in, and did not, and how the game feels, and discuss it in detail ad nauseum.

Saiyan · Post by **Saiyan** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:27 pm

From what it looks like from those screenshots, it looks like transformations are separate characters. You can see it from the SS Gogeta and SSj4 Gogeta being right next to each other...

Maybe I'm wrong, but from what it looks like, separate forms=separate characters.

Demi · Post by **Demi** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:39 pm

DB_Fan wrote:These pictures confirm Kid Goku, Tao Pai Pai, Oozaro and Master Roshi:
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/7885 ... chi3lg.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/ ... geta01.jpg
Videl and Bardock:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/ ... perbuu.jpg
Saibamen:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/ ... geta02.jpg

omg Roshi

denitonis · Post by **denitonis** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:39 pm

Well there are also 2 regular Vegeta's and 2 regular Mirai no Trunks' and these do not seem to be separate transformations,
yet there are arrows up/down with characters that can transform so that can most certainly indicate you can choose transformation, though at the same time it is no prove against it.

But probably everybody should just face that in-game-transformations are out, which in my opinion isn't bad at all, anybody still clinging to hope they aren't out will probably set themselves up for a real disappointment.

And while there may be no real prove that IGT are out there certainly is no prove they are in, so you should probably just prepare yourself for it LIT

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:47 pm

Remember, what we've seen is not final build. These builds that get shown off before the product is available, are called "Presentation Builds", and are used to show what the game *should* be like when it goes gold, of course many times the games are entirely different from their presentation (beta) builds, and other than a few small parts of the images, shouldn't be taken for more than a grain of salt.
[This sort of thing in games is done a lot, which makes it hard to place your finger on anything definite. Hell, there were beta shots of things from the Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time that never made it into the game, but were in several shots; it's all just taking things for face value, and not putting much stock into what you see, until you've got the disc in your hands.]

And while there may be no real proof that IGT are out there certainly is no proof they are in, so you should probably just prepare yourself for it LIT

Whats to prepare? I am just waiting till the damn thing comes out, to get over all this speculation bullshit. It's annoying what lengths people will go to to validate information with no proof (hence that forum/email thing,) and other than the beginning of the conversation, my stand, is that transformations are in, whether you are capable of doing it during battle, or you select a character that is pre-transformed, I don't know; but with so many pictures of Goku as a Super Saiya-jin, I just made the point that they aren't entirely out.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:50 pm

As I said, I'm 99% convinced that transformation forms are separate fighters. Here's the probable offical fighter list, all 90 "fighters"

Ladies and gents, Sparking! / Budokai Tenkaichi shall bring you 90 "characters", here's whats been in some forms confirmed:

1: Goku
2: Vegeta
3: Piccolo
4: Krillin
5: Yamcha
6: Tenshinhan
7; Chiaotzu
8: Kid Gohan
9: Teen Gohan
10: Gohan
11: Great Saiyaman
12: Mirai no Trunks
13: Mirai no Trunks (long Hair)
14: Trunks Kid
15: Goten
16: Gotenks
17: Vegito
18: Gogeta Super Saiyan
19: Gogeta SSJ4
20: Raditz
21: Nappa
22: Vegeta-with Scouter
23: Saibamen
24: Zarbon
25: Dodoria
26: Captain Ginyu
27: Recoome
28: Burter
29: Jeice
30: Guldo
31: Freeza
32: Android #16
33: Android #17
34: Android #18
35: Android #19
36: Android #20
37: Cell
38: Cell Jr.
39: Demon King Dabura
40: Majin Buu (Good)
41: Majin Buu (Pure Evil)
42: Super Buu
43: Kid Buu
44: Mr. Satan
45: Videl
46: Bardock
47: Cooler
48: Brolly
49: Bojack
50: Janemba
51: Baby Vegeta
52: Super 17
53: Great Ape
54: Kid Goku
55: Master Roshi
56: General Tao

That's 57, now the probable characters resulting from separate transformation-characters:

1: SSJ Goku
2: SSJ 2 Goku
3: SSJ 3 Goku
4: SSJ 4 Goku
5: SSJ Vegeta
6: SSJ 2 Vegeta
7: Majin Vegeta
7: SSJ 4 Vegeta
9: Super Namekian Piccolo
10: Potential-unlocked Krillin
11: SSJ Pre-teen Gohan
12: SSJ 2 Pre-teen Gohan
13: SSJ Teen/Adult Gohan
14: SSJ 2 Teen/Adult Gohan
15: Mystic Teen/Adult Gohan
16: SSJ Future Trunks
17: Ultra SSJ Future Trunks-Long Hair
18: SSJ Kid Trunks
19: SSJ Goten
20: SSJ Gotenks
21: SSJ 3 Gotenks
22: SSJ Vegito
23: Monster-Form Zarbon
24: Form 2 Freeza
25: Form 3 Freeza
26: Form 4 Freeza
27: #17-Absorbed Cell
28: Perfect-Form Cell
29: Piccolo-absorbed Super Buu
30: SSJ 3 Gotenks-Absorbed Super Buu
31: Mystic Teen/Adult Gohan-Absorbed Super Buu
32: Final-Form Cooler
33: Legendary SSJ Broly
34: Transformed Bojack

And that everyone is all 90 "characters" to an even number.

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:56 pm

Stop it Conan. Remember PRESENTATION (BETA) BUILD!

Games always have those, and what you see isn't always what you get. These appearance almost never reflect 100% to what you see in a gold version of the game, and shouldn't be taken as anything but beta coverage of a game that will probably be a little different than the shots suggest.

Demi · Post by **Demi** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:57 pm

Sounds pretty acurate, has anyone seen any pictures of non-SSJ Broly or Bojack or Coolers first forms? Would be a shame if you can't play as buffed up Roshi.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:05 pm

lost in thought wrote:Stop it Conan. Remember PRESENTATION (BETA) BUILD!

Games always have those, and what you see isn't always what you get. These appearance almost never reflect 100% to what you see in a gold version of the game, and shouldn't be taken as anything but beta coverage of a game that will probably be a little different than the shots suggest.

I suppose, but with the release date so close, I'm thinking Spike has finished it's touches on the game and what Gamespot sampled was a final version, as much as I don't want separate transformed characters (and believe me, I really want in-game transformations), even I'm almost entirly convinced the IGTs are out.

denitonis · Post by **denitonis** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:43 pm

lost in thought wrote:my stand, is that transformations are in, whether you are capable of doing it during battle, or you select a character that is pre-transformed, I don't know; but with so many pictures of Goku as a Super Saiya-jin, I just made the point that they aren't entirely out.

Well I suppose that is without saying that transformations are in, wouldn't that be their gravest mistake to exclude forms of SSJ.
But I see where the problem lies you are fighting the fact transformations are in while any other is going on about the in-battle-transformations, and looking at it that way in-game-transformations is the wrong term.
People say one thing and mean another.

(this was not directed at you L.I.T.)
As long as we are clear on the fact that IGT are in and IBT are to be discussed, right.

Conan the SSJ wrote:9: Super Namekian Piccolo
10: Potential-unlocked Krillin

I don't think so, they pose no real change other than the fact they got more power/speed and whatnot in the show, they don't even look different.
Also it is debatable that Cooler Broly and Bojack have other forms, they did not have arrows pointing up/down when you looked at the profile, this off-course in itself proves neither though you'd better be save not to assume so yet.

Also it could be it is not the final line-up due to the fact that it indeed is a Beta version, or even that characters were not all unlocked yet.
It would be boring if they gave the definitive list so I'm hoping these were not all characters.
I still miss the likes of Androids 13 14 15 Pikkon and off-course Uub and Ii Shenlon.

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:23 pm

Conan the SSJ wrote:
lost in thought wrote:Stop it Conan. Remember PRESENTATION (BETA) BUILD!

Games always have those, and what you see isn't always what you get. These appearance almost never reflect 100% to what you see in a gold version of the game, and shouldn't be taken as anything but beta coverage of a game that will probably be a little different than the shots suggest.
I suppose, but with the release date so close, I'm thinking Spike has finished it's touches on the game and what Gamespot sampled was a final version, as much as I don't want separate transformed characters (and believe me, I really want in-game transformations), even I'm almost entirly convinced the IGTs are out.

Sorry about getting jumpy... I am just in a bad mood today. x.x

Anyway, there's a bit of a long and a short that goes with GameSpot and the way they handle things, that is kinda goofy. GameSpot as a company that gets to play these games before release, rarely ever see final builds before the game hits store shelves; so 90% of the images (which they take themselves,) as well as the 'preview' commentary about them, are based on "Alpha," "Beta," "Post-Beta," and "Pre-final" builds, which are pretty much "presentation" builds, when they get the chance to play them. As well, one thing that touches on this, is that whether they have a final build or not (which is a rare occurance for these sorts of folks,) that they are not supposed to review these pre-finalized builds, instead to wait until the game is actually on store shelves, and they've played that version (they usually recieve such versions a couple weeks in advance, in order to complete the game, so they can write up a decent review of the final product,) because of the differences that are usually abound between pre-final and post-final work. (Post-final being the build that goes gold, and the one you, and I end up playing.)
[Note: The reason the above has any bearing what-so-ever, is that between these builds, sometimes their review team becomes impatient, and reviews non-final builds, and ends up taking flack for it, and it can give the wrong idea to people who want to play the game, when something listed in the review goes a-miss. The most notable instance of this, is with Fable, of course it wasn't GameSpots fault in that instance, instead Peter Molyneux's.]

ngnikolaos · Post by **ngnikolaos** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:31 pm

Just saw the videos of gamespot. The characters seem to have different fighting styles (Raditz seem to attack with his kicks a lot more than Goku, while Goku works with his fists --mostly). Zarbon also seems to use a different fighting aproach. Janemba uses his sword once, when fighting Gohan. So, it's all good.

Oh, and lost-in-thought: don't be so annoyed because people speculate. With your kind of logic, we shouldn't have not even one topic about Tenkaichi until it comes out. Everyone has a right to say what they'd like to see, and what they think that SHOULD be. And I think that screenshots which appear 1 and a 1/2 month before official release are pretty good evidence of character estimation.

Ever saw a picture of Gero in a fight in the previous production-beta screenshots of Budokai 1? Ever saw a Budokai 1 picture that had something which the final version lacked? (the boo vs goku pic was released AFTER the game, thus, doesn't count)

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:43 pm

ngnikolaos wrote:Oh, and lost-in-thought: don't be so annoyed because people speculate. With your kind of logic, we shouldn't have not even one topic about Tenkaichi until it comes out. Everyone has a right to say what they'd like to see, and what they think that SHOULD be. And I think that screenshots which appear 1 and a 1/2 month before official release are pretty good evidence of character estimation.

Uh, I never said they shouldn't say what they would like to see in the game, nor what should be. The speculation I am talking about, is saying things are 100% confirmed based on a few screen shots. It's entirely different, see?!
And no, the time between screen shots has little and no relevance to what it will look like, because in that time things can change (I know I've mentioned it a lot, but Fable was, and still is a prime example) and because of that ability to change things on the fly (which can, and does happen,) these screen shots should be taken with a grain of salt, until we get direct confirmation from... oh... say maybe the Sparking website, for instance.

Ever saw a picture of Gero in a fight in the previous production-beta screenshots of Budokai 1? Ever saw a Budokai 1 picture that had something which the final version lacked? (the boo vs goku pic was released AFTER the game, thus, doesn't count)

I've seen a lot of screen shots that turned out not to be in a game. As well, Budokai 1-3 have no bearing on what will happen with Sparking!, since, if you will notice it was pointed out to me before (as if I hadn't know previously) that it's not a Dimps game, and different developers take different actions towards things. On top of that, even Budokai 3 lacked things that should have been in it. (most notably, some DU's.)

Demi · Post by **Demi** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:14 pm

denitonis wrote:my stand, is that I still miss the likes of Androids 13 14 15 Paikuhan and off-course Uub and Ii Shenlon.

I'd be ok with them leaving those Androids and Paikuhan out, but they can't leave out Uub and Shenron, that's just stupid. =/
Meh, maybe all the characters we aren't going to see in it, like Android 13, uub, Shenron ect will be in a sequal. Since Oozarus' are in this game, i don't see why they don't add Janemba's first form or even Hildeguarn.