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Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
AnimeMaakuo
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Post by AnimeMaakuo » Wed Jan 12, 2011 8:45 pm

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Last edited by AnimeMaakuo on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:42 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Super Saiyan Turlast x4 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:07 pm

I think Goku is about the same, if not slightly stronger than Super Saiyan Gotenks before his rosat training. With that, I still think Gotenks has the advantage because of the Super Saiyan 3 drawbacks. In an extended battle, Goku's Chi would likely begin to plummet after awhile, and that could be an issue. I think Gotenks would be more than enough for Goku at that point.

As for the others, Goku doesn't stand a chance against them. He states that Super Boo is more powerful than himself and Vegeta--and we see Gohan embarrass the same Super Boo like it was nothing. Goku's statement seemed to focus more on Super Boo's power instead of his regenerative abilities. I also doubt Goku had a special trick up his sleeve. Super Saiyan 3 seemed to be all he was capable of at that point, and the most he could do is equal Kid Boo, who was weaker than Super Boo.

So, it would come down to a battle between Gohan and Super Boo in the end, which would be similar to how it was in the Manga/Anime.
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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:19 pm

...

They didn't take action once they escaped because Buu was undergoing a transformation. It shocked them that Buu was getting stronger before he finally settled in the weaker Pure Buu form. Had Vegeta not removed fatty's pod, I'm sure the Saiyan prince would have been trying to punch Gohan awake, so he could save their asses, while Goku tried to tell him that's doing more harm than good. (Ultimate Gohan >>> Evil Buu (Super) = SS3 Gotenks >>> SS3 Goku)
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Post by AnimeMaakuo » Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:24 pm

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Last edited by AnimeMaakuo on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Soppa Saiyjins from Dorgou Ballru Zetto is my favorite transformation everah, especially when Trounksoru did it in front of Seru and when Bejita did it when he faced Jingonigen-hachigo. But for real, I use the FUNi pronunciation. - Soppa Saia People

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Super Vegito » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:06 pm

Vegito planned to take the Z fighters out of Buu, then easily kill him. However, Vegito got split back into two beings (Goku and Vegeta), so both Goku and Vegeta had no choice but to proceed with their plan, then they could refuse or use Gohan, once they made it out. However, Kid Buu was reborn and destroyed the entire planet, along with Gohan, Trunks, and Goten. Since Kid Buu was a lot weaker, they decided to take him on unfused.

So, they never planned to take on Super Buu like that...

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Super Saiyan Turlast x4 » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:07 am

AnimeMaakuo wrote:
TheDevilsCorpse wrote:...

They didn't take action once they escaped because Buu was undergoing a transformation. It shocked them that Buu was getting stronger before he finally settled in the weaker Pure Buu form. Had Vegeta not removed fatty's pod, I'm sure the Saiyan prince would have been trying to punch Gohan awake, so he could save their asses, while Goku tried to tell him that's doing more harm than good. (Ultimate Gohan >>> Evil Buu (Super) = SS3 Gotenks >>> SS3 Goku)
I didn't quite understand this post? "SS3 Gotenks >>> SS3 Goku?" It just doesn't seem logical. Look at my post. It would be a seriously close fight. You have to keep in mind, Gotenks doesn't have near the battle experience at all.
-What I was truly comparing was, "full-powered SSJ3 Son Goku vs SSJ3 Gotenks."
I honestly was thinking about Super Saiyan Gotenks instead of Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks.

That's even more unfair for Goku. And battle experience usually doesn't mean much when the opponent is much stronger than you.

Full-Power Goku is equal to Kid Boo; Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks is stronger than Super Boo. Since Super Boo is stronger than Super Saiyan 3 Goku, that's enough to tell you how he compares to Gotenks at his best.
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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Rocketman » Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:10 am

AnimeMaakuo wrote:BUT LET'S JUST SAY FOR THE SAKE OF ARGUMENT...

Their plan went splendid and they got all the Z fighters out... Well, as shown, Gohan and the others would be knocked out cold right? Well It's then assumed Son Goku would have to charge up to his full potential and fight Super Buu?
No. Their plan was to have Gohan fight. Once they saw Gohan was knocked out, they would've fused with the dance.

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Godo » Thu Jan 13, 2011 6:30 am

FPSSJ3 Goku would simply have been destroyed by SSJ3 Gotenks. Even though SSJ3 Gotenks haven't got battle experience. The reason is: SSJ3 Gotenks would be too fast for Goku to even follow.
And to add, they aren't even in the same league.

Vegetto (God like league).
Gotenks Buu and probably Gokan [Goku + Gohan potara fusion] (Oh My God This Is Getting Ridiculous League).
Ultimate Gohan (Ultimate League).
Super Buu and Gotenks are in the same league (Super Duper Strong League).
SSJ3 Goku, Fat Buu and Kid Buu are in the same league (Super Strong League).
SSJ2 Goku and SSJ2 Vegeta are in the same league (Strong League).


If anyone from a weaker league tries to fight someone from a league above them, they are going to be pummeled worse than a karate amateur vs. Bruce Lee.

This was actually shown more than twice! Majin Vegeta got pummeled by Fat Buu (who was above him), and also by Kid Buu (who also was above him). He had not even a slight chance. And neither Fat nor Kid Buu had a better fighting experience than Vegeta!

So all in all, that's all there is to it.

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Nazi Cola » Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:30 am

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure after Gohan and the others (not Mr. Boo) were pulled from inside Super Boo, Vegeta suggested going out and fighting, to which Goku said that they'd be killed and they needed to weaken him even further.

So Super Boo was still > SSj3 Goku.

I was under the impression he was hoping Boo would turn back into Fat Boo or something.

Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P8.1
Context: Goku points out that if he and Vegeta aren’t merged, Vegeta will have to return to the afterlife
Vegeta: “Hmph…That’s better than being merged with you…Anyway, there shouldn’t be any need for us to merge anymore, right?”
Goku: “We can’t know that! There’s [no] guarantee that we’ll be able to successfully rescue everyone who got absorbed from here and return Boo to the very first one of all…!”
Note: when Goku finds the good Boo later, he calls him “the very first one of all”, so apparently that’s who he means here too.

Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P12.4-5
Context: after Goku and Vegeta revert Boo back to regular evil Boo
Goku: “Hehhe~~eh! With this, Boo’s power should have fallen significantly! We’re almost there! See, see: the size of his ki is completely different than before!”
Vegeta: “Alright! Let’s blast out of here and escape!”
Goku: “Wait! Even though Boo has returned to normal a whole lot, we’re still simply no match for his strength! If we go outside like this, we’ll definitely be done in…!”
CatouttaHell wrote:I guess he's just impossibly powerful and he now gets thrills from letting things go as much to hell as possible before busting out his ultimate power and ending the villain or some shit.

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by rereboy » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:26 am

Nazi Cola wrote:
Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P12.4-5
Context: after Goku and Vegeta revert Boo back to regular evil Boo
Goku: “Hehhe~~eh! With this, Boo’s power should have fallen significantly! We’re almost there! See, see: the size of his ki is completely different than before!”
Vegeta: “Alright! Let’s blast out of here and escape!”
Goku: “Wait! Even though Boo has returned to normal a whole lot, we’re still simply no match for his strength! If we go outside like this, we’ll definitely be done in…!”
Yes, to me, that has always settled the issue. Goku is directly comparing himself (and Vegeta) to Super Buu. It doesn`t get more straightforward than this.

Super Buu is stronger than SSJ3 Goku by a good enough margin to make Goku believe that he and Vegeta don't stand a chance, unlike what happened with Kid Buu. In fact, if Goku had managed to collect all his energy as a SSJ3 like he was able to do when he was dead, Goku would have defeated Kid Buu by himself. Since his inability to do so came as a surprise, Goku always thought he could do it as a living person before he tried it, which means that even that wouldn`t be enough to kill Super Buu in Goku`s opinion.

With that out of the way, and since SSJ3 Gotenks was winning agaisnt Super Buu before he lost his fusion, SSJ3 Gotenks is stronger than Super Buu and stronger than SSJ3 Goku. And Mystic Gohan is even stronger than SSJ3 Gotenks.

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by lonewolf » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:26 pm

rereboy wrote:
Nazi Cola wrote:
Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P12.4-5
Context: after Goku and Vegeta revert Boo back to regular evil Boo
Goku: “Hehhe~~eh! With this, Boo’s power should have fallen significantly! We’re almost there! See, see: the size of his ki is completely different than before!”
Vegeta: “Alright! Let’s blast out of here and escape!”
Goku: “Wait! Even though Boo has returned to normal a whole lot, we’re still simply no match for his strength! If we go outside like this, we’ll definitely be done in…!”
Yes, to me, that has always settled the issue. Goku is directly comparing himself (and Vegeta) to Super Buu. It doesn`t get more straightforward than this.

Super Buu is stronger than SSJ3 Goku by a good enough margin to make Goku believe that he and Vegeta don't stand a chance, unlike what happened with Kid Buu. In fact, if Goku had managed to collect all his energy as a SSJ3 like he was able to do when he was dead, Goku would have defeated Kid Buu by himself. Since his inability to do so came as a surprise, Goku always thought he could do it as a living person before he tried it, which means that even that wouldn`t be enough to kill Super Buu in Goku`s opinion.

With that out of the way, and since SSJ3 Gotenks was winning agaisnt Super Buu before he lost his fusion, SSJ3 Gotenks is stronger than Super Buu and stronger than SSJ3 Goku. And Mystic Gohan is even stronger than SSJ3 Gotenks.
But they didn't bother bringing Gohan, Trunks and Goten to beat Kid Buu.

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by Godo » Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:19 pm

lonewolf wrote: But they didn't bother bringing Gohan, Trunks and Goten to beat Kid Buu.
They did bother bringing them, although there was no time, and Goku decided to bring the closest ones (Mr. Satan, Bee and Dende). Hell, even Vegeta and Goku have an argument about Goku's decision.

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Re: Son Goku Vs Gotenks Vs Super Buu Vs Ultimate Gohan?

Post by rereboy » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:20 pm

lonewolf wrote:
rereboy wrote:
Nazi Cola wrote:
Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P12.4-5
Context: after Goku and Vegeta revert Boo back to regular evil Boo
Goku: “Hehhe~~eh! With this, Boo’s power should have fallen significantly! We’re almost there! See, see: the size of his ki is completely different than before!”
Vegeta: “Alright! Let’s blast out of here and escape!”
Goku: “Wait! Even though Boo has returned to normal a whole lot, we’re still simply no match for his strength! If we go outside like this, we’ll definitely be done in…!”
Yes, to me, that has always settled the issue. Goku is directly comparing himself (and Vegeta) to Super Buu. It doesn`t get more straightforward than this.

Super Buu is stronger than SSJ3 Goku by a good enough margin to make Goku believe that he and Vegeta don't stand a chance, unlike what happened with Kid Buu. In fact, if Goku had managed to collect all his energy as a SSJ3 like he was able to do when he was dead, Goku would have defeated Kid Buu by himself. Since his inability to do so came as a surprise, Goku always thought he could do it as a living person before he tried it, which means that even that wouldn`t be enough to kill Super Buu in Goku`s opinion.

With that out of the way, and since SSJ3 Gotenks was winning agaisnt Super Buu before he lost his fusion, SSJ3 Gotenks is stronger than Super Buu and stronger than SSJ3 Goku. And Mystic Gohan is even stronger than SSJ3 Gotenks.
But they didn't bother bringing Gohan, Trunks and Goten to beat Kid Buu.
When they left Earth in a hurry, Goku had to make a split second decision and couldn't save everyone, so Gohan and the others died.

Later, after they were revived by Porunga, Goku suggested bringing them to the Kaioshin planet to fight Kid Buu but Vegeta replied that it was time for all the Earthlings to help save themselves with a Genki Dama.
This was obviously a choice by the author to make the ending cooler than having Gohan show up and just blow Kid Buu up, which would be very anti-climatic (and also, to have Goku be the one to finish Kid Buu, obviously). If it had failed, Gohan and Gotenks would still be around to try to finish Buu, kind of like a back-up plan. Even though Vegeta didn`t actually mention this last part, I like to think he considered that.

Also, there was always the danger that Kid Buu, being cornered by stronger fighters, would resort to absorption, like Super Buu had done previously. Gohan and Gotenks had already been unable to stop themselves from being absorbed, despite being stronger than Super Buu, so there is nothing to suggest that they would succeed in preventing that from happening a second time. There was no such danger with a Genki Dama.

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