What makes the Buu saga so poorly written?...

[JBoogie]

...when compared to other sagas? I've seen some opinions around here about it, but I just don't see it. By the way, I haven't seen all of the original DragonBall, or read it for that matter I'm slacking...

[JBoogie]

You know what...actually, I just realized my main problem with it...how Goku doesn't kill Fat Buu..."he wanted to give someone else a chance to save the world..."

[SSJ YUSUKE]

I personally don't think that the Buu saga is poorly written, though I don't like it that much either.
Not only because of how my favourite character piccolo gets turned into a side character but also because of the fact that Goku ,who was dead, is just brought to beat Buu because his the hero instead of passing on the mantle to Gohan.
I remember back in my funimation days begin extremely disappointed in Buu as a villain, before we had had villians like Freeza and Cell and I was really expecting something big, but instead we got a fat pink blob.
Since then though I have come to appreciate Buu as it was just Toriyama going back to his roots as a gag artist and anyway, Buu's transformations sort of made up for the fact that he was to childish to be a villain.

[MugiMikey]

Probably due to the huge amount of asspulls.

It could also be the fact that everyone that isn't Saiyan (or Piccolo) became pretty much useless. At least Mr. Satan got great development...

[Kingdom Heartless]

I don't think it's particularly badly written... it just felt a little rushed at times. Like Toriyama had been running a race steadily and he's now seen the finish line, so he started to sprint."

[SuperForteX]

You have to wonder... is the Buu Saga really written badly? Or is it our ability to understand it where the inadequacy lies? Maybe, in a higher state of being, the Buu Saga makes sense, and is actually too simplistic to be entertaining.

[SylentEcho]

I think the overall story is simplistic, but the twists and turns are pretty well done.

[Bussani]

I don't have a problem with the Buu saga, really. It didn't feel rushed to me, and no more asspully than some other parts of the story. I liked the idea of fusions, which was rather unique, and I also happened to like how so many of their plans for victory failed before they actually beat the bad guy. I think some people complain that it doesn't make it clear who's stronger than whom when compared to previous arcs, but I don't think I'd consider that a sign of bad writing.

[TonyTheTiger]

For me, the Buu saga is a massive flanderization of the Cell saga. The same kind of stuff applies, just dialed up to 11.

Anybody who's not a Super Saiyan is useless. New wacky forms of Super Saiyans, just not done with near the amount of class that Gohan vs. Cell had. Seemingly random deus ex machina, right down to two different types of fusion and pretty much everything about Goten and Trunks's power levels. A really annoying bait and switch that sent Gohan from "hero of the universe" to "lulz can't catch!" in about 15 minutes. And the villain's final form that doesn't make a lick of sense.

The Buu saga doesn't exactly do anything worse than earlier sagas (or Toei's movies/filler). And many of the "problems" can be attributed to Cell, too. It's just that the Buu saga dropped the pretext of even trying to restrain itself and explain things.

[Michsi]

My biggest aversion with this arc is turning my favorite character into a useless comic relief and how the saiyans were handled. As far as techniques, plot twists , ideas etc are concerned it's actually pretty ok.

I actually like Piccolo's role in the Gotenks vs. Buu fight, I think it's funny to see a generally cool and collected character blow his casket like that, but not have that be his only role in the saga. I like him as a fighter and I wish Toriyama would have stuck with the routine of giving power ups even to those who would have to lose in the end.

As for the saiyans, I shared my oppion of that in several threads, particullary about Goku and Vegeta.

[SSJmole]

I like the saga but it had a lot of problems. Here is my list :

1) Was SSJ3 really needed? - It didn't even do much at all as final fight was not SSJ 3 really.

2) Buu. - I like buu but really he was not threatening till near the end. We literally went from "Saiyans want to prove their dominate" to "Freeza wants to rule the galaxy" to "Andrids destroyed the future, we need to save everyone" to "I want chocolate" really? that's what the last foe of the series is?

3) No members of goku's family were useless. Vegeta needed magic to catch up Gohan , he needed to fuse with goku to do anything really (till the end) Remember how bad ass Trunks was in celll saga? well now little trunks needs Goten to do anything. The rest of the characters were even more useless.

4) Cell saga passed the torch to Gohan, Buu saga the torch is taken back for no reason. Mystic Gohan should have saved the day.

5) People pulled powers and moves out their ass to much. New moves just happened , new powers just appeared.

6) Goku's sacrifice was ruined. Cell saga he had real growth he was staying dead as too many people were after him. It was heroic , it was deep. Then .... he returns for a world tournament, returns to life , acts like his reason is cell saga was non-existent.


7) Uub. Sorry this just seems a slap in face. He is a strong as Buu? So the strongest fighter at the end? a character who appeared for 5 minutes. Great going.

[Bussani]

Was SSJ3 really needed? - It didn't even do much at all as final fight was not SSJ 3 really.

I still don't get this one. What if every author excluded everything and everyone who wasn't vital to the plot? There's such a thing as making a story too streamlined.

[Ussj Future Trunks]

Remember how bad ass Trunks was in celll saga?

No. The most he did was free his future.

I never had a problem with Gohan not being the hero. He's not a fighter after all.

Cell saga passed the torch to Gohan

But did it really? Goku stayed dead so no more villains would come to Earth. So why stay dead if your son is meant to be defending against what you think won't show up?

Uub. Sorry this just seems a slap in face. He is a strong as Buu?

Nope. He could be though, with training. Kid Buu's nothing to Gohan and Gotenks anyway.

Vegeta needed magic to catch up Gohan

Did he? I thought SSJ2 Vegeta Pre Majin > SSJ2 Kid Gohan. And all Babidi did was bring out Vegetas hidden power.

I like buu but really he was not threatening till near the end. We literally went from "Saiyans want to prove their dominate" to "Freeza wants to rule the galaxy" to "Andrids destroyed the future, we need to save everyone" to "I want chocolate" really? that's what the last foe of the series is?

The childish motive I thought made Buu more chaotic evil. The opposite of Goku but yet his equal at the same time. And Buu wasn't as serious as previous arcs, a sign Toriyama was just letting loose with his gag manga style more.

[SSJmole]

Was SSJ3 really needed? - It didn't even do much at all as final fight was not SSJ 3 really.

I still don't get this one. What if every author excluded everything and everyone who wasn't vital to the plot? There's such a thing as making a story too streamlined.

Yes but It was built up and stole focus for it to be ...... nothing. It was pointless for sake of filling the story.

Plus you say everyone who wasn't vital to the plot. They literally got rid of people who SHOULD have been vital for it. It was just lazy writing.

Vegeta needed magic to catch up Gohan

Did he? I thought SSJ2 Vegeta Pre Majin > SSJ2 Kid Gohan. And all Babidi did was bring out Vegetas hidden power.

I thought he stated "Now i'm as strong as your son when he faced cell" to Goku. Maybe filler or dub.

[LeprikanGT]

First off, I LOVE the Buu saga.

Secondly, in the back of my mind ,I've always thought it was because it has nothingto do with anything. All of DragonBall was pretty much Goku pissed people off in the RR Army and then fought in tournaments, although King Piccolo was slightly left field.

All of Z had to do with the Saiyans/Goku in particular, then out of nowhere for no reason to do with anything in perticular, a random wizard is going unleash havoc on the planet, total left field.

Again, I love the Buu saga, it is in my top 3 favorite ones.

[SylentEcho]

Ussj Future Trunks, how can you deny that at the end of the Cell arc, the torch wasn't passed down to Gohan? It's so obvious! Goku even says, "Gohan's a way more reliable guy than I am." He also says, "Gohan say sorry to ChiChi, I've always been so selfish doing what I always wanted."

When they fly off Kami's Temple, Gohan leading the other Super Warriors out of the place looked so right!

I think it's funny to see a generally cool and collected character blow his casket like that, but not have that be his only role in the saga. I like him as a fighter and I wish Toriyama would have stuck with the routine of giving power ups even to those who would have to lose in the end

I strongly agree with this. I feel after Gotenks escaped the ROSAT, Piccolo should have stayed there and trained for some time and then come out and made a surprise appearance with some new attacks or a new form.

I was really disappointed when Goku asked Piccolo if he was entering the last tournament and Piccolo said, "I can't compete with you guys anymore."

[rereboy]

Ussj Future Trunks, how can you deny that at the end of the Cell arc, the torch wasn't passed down to Gohan? It's so obvious! Goku even says, "Gohan's a way more reliable guy than I am." He also says, "Gohan say sorry to ChiChi, I've always been so selfish doing what I always wanted."

When they fly off Kami's Temple, Gohan leading the other Super Warriors out of the place looked so right!

Gohan never had the right mentality to be the main hero. Never. He has the power sure, but not the mentality. Not in the Cell saga or in the Buu saga.

And what happened in the Buu saga? He became the strongest unfused fighter, but he didn't save the day. It was perfect.

[TonyTheTiger]

And Goku does, with his near constant game of Russian Roulette with people's lives?

But, going back to the flanderization I mentioned before, what I think Super Saiyan 3 does "wrong" is that it further compounds earlier problems with the story. We see Goku damn near beaten by Freeza. Then in an instant, after watching his best friend die, he taps into a power that was nigh unheard of, a legend he never knew.

Oh...but then there's a shit load more Super Saiyan stuff after that.

Gohan, after intense training, still can't manage to unlock his inner potential, the potential we've seen glimpses of whenever people he cared for were in dire straights. He fights, bravely enough, but ultimately fails to truely hold his own. Then, after noble words from what was supposed to be a mere machine and his brutal execution, Gohan finally releases all the power he had within and while Goku may have reached the stuff of legend, his son went beyond legend.

Oh, but then there's that Super Saiyan 3 thing after that.

See where I'm going with this? It's not exactly "worse" than what came before. But by that time the routine grew tired. And unlike the Cell saga, there aren't enough justifications for it. Goku reached Super Saiyan 3 essentially through "lulz moar training!" Off-screen training, no less. The same storytelling formula is there, but it doesn't have the same punch anymore. So while they may have been problems even with Cell, they were masked at least a little better. The Buu saga is almost brazen with it's lack of concern.

[Savage68]

That's what I like so much about the Boo arc. All of the lame tropes that had been introduced from the Piccolo arc onward were borderline parodied. SSJ2 couldn't do it, SSJ3 couldn't do it, releasing potential couldn't do it, fusion couldn't do it, etc. In the end, the Boo arc was Toriyama having a laugh instead of trying to bog everything down with melodrama and a forced inheritance, like in the android arc. I think Dragon Ball's final installment illustrated perfectly well that new-fangled transformations weren't supposed to mean much.

[Ussj Future Trunks]

Ussj Future Trunks, how can you deny that at the end of the Cell arc, the torch wasn't passed down to Gohan? It's so obvious! Goku even says, "Gohan's a way more reliable guy than I am." He also says, "Gohan say sorry to ChiChi, I've always been so selfish doing what I always wanted."

I'm saying it didn't feel natural or go along with Gohan's personality and Goku's reasoning for staying dead.