Dragonball Kai (FUNimation English) Dub: General Discussion

[DBfan4life]

Nice! Dameon Clarke, huh. He does Scar in Fullmetal Alchemist also doesn't he?

[Metalwario64]

That's actually why I love Willingham. He takes what Clarke put in place which was great, but toned certain aspects down (Namely with Perfect Cell). To me he sounded perfect. But if Clarke can take it down a bit too, I'll be very happy.

Well, I've only heard clips, and it's been a while, but I seem to recall Willingham's voice sounding a bit strained, and you could tell he was trying to make his voice sound like Clarke's, which kinda made me think back to how forced the FUNimation cast started out sounding (beyond their lack of acting capabilities at the time), but not as bad. That's just what I remember, and it's been a while, so I could be misremembering it.

But, if Clarke can sound more natural, then I'm curious to hear his new take.

Nice! Dameon Clarke, huh. He does Scar in Fullmetal Alchemist also doesn't he?

He did in the original series, but was replaced in Brotherhood.

[Fionordequester]

Nice! Dameon Clarke, huh. He does Scar in Fullmetal Alchemist also doesn't he?

Yep, and he also does Younger Toguro in Yu Yu Hakusho.

[MetalMadness]

Oh man it was delayed again?? I guess this pretty much confirms the Kikuchi score in it.

But I'm thrilled to hear Clarke is reprising Cell! Willingham did only an impression of Clarke; why use an impression instead of the real deal? This is great. I can't wait to hear him. Which episode does Cell first appear (in)?

[GotenDaisuki]

Which episode does Cell first appear (in)?

If I remember correctly, episode 68 marks Cell's first appearance toward the end of the episode, walking toward Piccolo, holding the wealthy man, and then it ends. So... not a lengthy introduction. However, episode 69 is the introduction of Cell and all his techniques and secrets.

[KaiserNeko]

Taking a cue from Jacob, who I'm surprised didn't post this here:

From Nebs Twitter:
https://twitter.com/#!/NebsTV/status/72077669298225152
https://twitter.com/#!/NebsTV/status/72077868250841089

"I asked about the BGM controversy in Dragonball Kai. They are changing some of the songs with blessings from Japan. They don't think they'll need to go back and change past volumes already released in the US, but they're not sure."

Changing "some" of the songs. Considering we've already been seeing alterations on the Nicktoons front, I submit that instead of outright replacing the entire score, they're replacing the offending tracks. If FUNimation CAN do this, it's their best bet. If not only because the use of the Kikuchi score in Kai has been disappointing so far.

[JulieYBM]

Dang, I thought I already had. Still, it's...an interesting wording. When somebody in Japan messes up they're blacklisted for a long time. I have to wonder if that is the primary reason Toei didn't just replace the offending pieces. Still, replaced music is still replaced music.

Hmmm...

[ohaimynameiserik]

Taking a cue from Jacob, who I'm surprised didn't post this here:

From Nebs Twitter:
https://twitter.com/#!/NebsTV/status/72077669298225152
https://twitter.com/#!/NebsTV/status/72077868250841089

"I asked about the BGM controversy in Dragonball Kai. They are changing some of the songs with blessings from Japan. They don't think they'll need to go back and change past volumes already released in the US, but they're not sure."

Changing "some" of the songs. Considering we've already been seeing alterations on the Nicktoons front, I submit that instead of outright replacing the entire score, they're replacing the offending tracks. If FUNimation CAN do this, it's their best bet. If not only because the use of the Kikuchi score in Kai has been disappointing so far.

Hmm... does this mean the plagiarized tunes will be replaced by earlier Yamamoto songs? Or by Kikuchi? More than likely the first option, seeing as that's been the case on Nicktoons. Or MAYBE by a different source altogether...

I think it'd be sweet to have whoever did the trailer music for Part 5 compose replacement songs for the plagiarized ones. Stuff was nice.

[Gozar]

Well, I've only heard clips, and it's been a while, but I seem to recall Willingham's voice sounding a bit strained, and you could tell he was trying to make his voice sound like Clarke's, which kinda made me think back to how forced the FUNimation cast started out sounding (beyond their lack of acting capabilities at the time), but not as bad. That's just what I remember, and it's been a while, so I could be misremembering it.

But, if Clarke can sound more natural, then I'm curious to hear his new take.

When he first started out, yeah, he did sound a bit strained in his Perfect Form. But he's really taken it back recently, I think he sounds really good. But I do agree that Clarke will be great it he takes the over the top nature of his Perfect Cell voice back a bit.

I think it'd be sweet to have whoever did the trailer music for Part 5 compose replacement songs for the plagiarized ones. Stuff was nice.

Please no. We're beyond that with FUNi's DragonBall. We don't need to go back to a time where FUNi makes their own music for DragonBall. Even if it is just for certain areas. Let's steer away from that, FUNi seems to have proved they're beyond that with the removal of the Dub Music on the Dragon Boxes. Adding their own music would only result in arguments and another split in the Fanbase.

[ohaimynameiserik]

Please no. We're beyond that with FUNi's DragonBall. We don't need to go back to a time where FUNi makes their own music for DragonBall. Even if it is just for certain areas. Let's steer away from that, FUNi seems to have proved they're beyond that with the removal of the Dub Music on the Dragon Boxes. Adding their own music would only result in arguments and another split in the Fanbase.

Believe me, I understand whole-heartedly. However I don't think it'd do that much damage if only the songs in question were replaced. It's not like there would be arguments over which Kai music was better. There would only be... Kai music. It'd be the same arguments that are already in progress over Yamamoto Vs. Kikuchi.

Anyway, it was just a thought, and there's a 99.9% chance of it not happening.

[ThunderPX]

I don't necessarily like the idea of having even less Yamamoto BGM to choose from (certain pieces were already extremely overused to begin with), but it's better than the abuse of the Kikuchi score we'd otherwise be left with. If they do end up doing the Buu arc, I hope they'd at least get someone to compose additional BGM in the same style, otherwise things are going to get more than a little repetitive.

[ohaimynameiserik]

I don't necessarily like the idea of having even less Yamamoto BGM to choose from (certain pieces were already extremely overused to begin with), but it's better than the abuse of the Kikuchi score we'd otherwise be left with. If they do end up doing the Buu arc, I hope they'd at least get someone to compose additional BGM in the same style, otherwise things are going to get more than a little repetitive.

Word. Since they're able to retain Yamamoto and alter the BGM with "Japan's blessing", it makes it much more likely that they could get the "blessing" to continue the series. New music would certainly be needed. Maybe Toei could get someone if FUNi replacing original music that doesn't even exist would be too much of a sin.

[VegettoEX]

Just because I'm always cautious about this kind of thing, note that nowhere did it say, "Yes, we're keeping Kenji Yamamoto's score except for any potentially infringing pieces of work".

What you're looking at is second-hand information in a tweet re-written from an answer at a convention. It's not very explicit. Answers from conventions have been wrong (or at least partially wrong) before.

It could just mean, "Yeah, with their blessing we're using the Kikuchi score like the rest of the world is." We just don't know, and we probably won't until volume five hits.

[Kendamu]

Not that this clears things up much, but here's an email exchange I had with FUNi several days ago:

"Subject: DBZ Kai Music and Blu-Rays

Considering the somewhat recent issues regarding the score in Dragonball Z Kai's music, are there any plans at FUNimation to re-release the DBZ Kai home releases with the Kikuchi score? I'd love to buy DBZ Kai on Blu-ray but I want to have a consistent soundtrack for the series. I'd rather not have Yamamoto for half the series and Kikuchi for the other half.

Thanks for your time!

--
- Josh -"

"The upcoming Dragon Ball Z Kai Part 5 that is releasing in June will have a revised Kai soundtrack.

Rojas
Feedback Manager"

Take it as you will. Seems we won't get a clear answer on the matter until someone snags a copy of Part 5.

[ohaimynameiserik]

"The upcoming Dragon Ball Z Kai Part 5 that is releasing in June will have a revised Kai soundtrack."

Well I'd say that 90% confirms it. A revised "Kai" soundtrack. Not the Z soundtrack. The 10% that's unconfirmed could just be that this guy doesn't know that the new music could all be entirely from Z.

[Kendamu]

We might end up knowing what's what with Kai on the 30th when Nicktoons airs a new episode (after the marathon)!

Either way, I'm going to trust that FUNi is altering as little of the score as possible. I don't have a logical reason behind it, though, so don't think I have some type of inside info.

[RazorX]

Anyone who thinks the Yamamoto score will stick around in any capacity is living in a dream world.

Not necessarily, remember at the moment we have much more of Yamamoto's music than Kikuchi's music. Funimation continues to supply stock to retailers of their already released Kai volumes 1-4, which means that the rumours 2 months ago about them apparently stopping supplies were untrue.

It appears there were no problems with the Saiyan-Freeza Kai music. The problem started in the Android saga. We know what Toei has done but Funimation's response seems to be just to replace the offending tracks with some of Yamamoto's other work, which is what Toei should've done.

The US Toonzai broadcast used the Kikuchi music as soon as they could but I think that was more to do with 4kids' mentality than Funi's. 4Kids, having been in a court case against the Japanese licensors of Yi Gi Oh, didn't fancy the chance of another court case, no matter how slim that chance was, and were being more cautious than they need to. The US Nicktoons continues to use the Yamamoto music, replacing potentially offending tracks with existing Kai music. I think Nicktoons probably doesn't want to use "outdated" music on DBZ Kai. Interestingly, the Toonzai reruns appear to be using the Kikuchi music where the first run used the Yamamoto music, whereas Nicktoons reruns continue to use Yamamoto's music, meaning that perhaps Funi could supply Nicktoons with the Kikuchi music episodes but Nicktoons don't want it, preferring to keep Yamamoto's fresh and modern music.

in-progress international dubs are in the process of switching over.

The last I heard, the Indonesian and Manderin dubs were continuing to use Yamamoto's music.

We've said it before, and we'll say it again -- it's likely that whatever notification came into Toei was harsh or at least "substantial" (in some way) enough for them to take it so seriously that they immediately removed the score, and removed it completely. There is nothing in Yamamoto's score for "Kai" that can be trusted as non-infringing, so there is no reason to take any chances with keeping some portions and not keeping others. The entire thing has been thrown out, and if you want what ever existed, you need to go out and purchase what soundtracks and home releases are already available. They will not be the archived version of the show.

Toei's reaction is out of the ordinary. I think that they've never been in such a situation before and not knowing what to do, they panicked. They seem to be allowing Funi to continue using Yamamoto's music though. As for the recent information via the tweet, to me it leans more towards keeping the Yamamoto music "with Japan's blessings" but removing the "offending" pieces.

As far as archiving the show, personally I'm not going to put up with the misplaced Kikuchi music, scored by people who probably have no idea which piece is supposed to convey what emotion, randomly grabbing a released CD and playing it alongside the footage, then calling it a day. I'm archiving Kai with Yamamoto's music for myself. I suppose it's a bit of a nod to the 1990s fansub days. I myself wasn't a fan then but I have read about what it was like for those wanting to watch the original version of DBZ. Now so far if we want to watch the original version of DB Kai, we also need fansubs, of course how we obtain the fansubs has changed since the 90s.

[kei17]

in-progress international dubs are in the process of switching over.

The last I heard, the Indonesian and Manderin dubs were continuing to use Yamamoto's music.

Oddly enough, Mandarin dub started using the Kikuchi score from episode 14, but the Yamamoto score suddenly returned in the next episode, then the Kikuchi score got back in episode 17.

[MetaMoss]

The upcoming Dragon Ball Z Kai Part 5 that is releasing in June will have a revised Kai soundtrack.

I could see it being either soundtrack, depending on how the word 'revised' is being used. I looked up "revise" in a dictionary and it came up with two meanings:
1: To prepare a newly edited version of
2: To reconsider and change or modify
So... it gives no definitive answer. I would hope it would be the first case (which would mean a Nicktoons-like solution, but keep the Yamamoto score).

[coola]

If they truly left most of the Yamamoto score, then I can buy rest Kai volumes without worry.