The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[CatouttaHell]

How about.

1. King Cold Vs Android 20 with humans
2. Kibito Vs Android 17
3. Piccolo Fused with Kami Vs Android 18

1. #20 defeats him.
2. Kibito stomps. The Daizenshuu says Kibito is around Base Gohan, and Gohan is way above Trunks who is on par with #18 and #17 in base.
3. Piccolo wins after a very long, close battle.



What about:

1. SSjin 3 Goku (End of Z) vs. Gohan-Boo
2. SSjin 2 Teen Gohan vs. Super Perfect Cell
3. 100% Mecha-Freeza and King Cold vs. Final Form Coola

[Kaboom]

1. SSjin 3 Goku (End of Z) vs. Gohan-Boo
2. SSjin 2 Teen Gohan vs. Super Perfect Cell
3. 100% Mecha-Freeza and King Cold vs. Final Form Coola

1) Nah, the way I figure it, Goku at SSj3 has maybe only just about caught up to Gohan by the end of the manga. Suffice to say that it's not enough to take on Gohan-Boo.

2) They were already supposedly close in power at the climax of the Cell Games. But now that Gohan's gotten weaker (or at the very least, his SSj2 state has), he would probably lose unless he generates more power by getting mad.

3) I have 'Super' Coola as the movies equivalent of Mecha-Freeza, meaning they're similar in power. Having King Cold as backup would probably be enough to tip the scales in Freeza's favor.

[Kirby456]

1. Gohan Boo with ease. But i think by the end of Z Goku would have surpassed Ultimate Gohan. Imo.
2. Id say SSJ2 Teen Gohan >> Super Perfect Cell => Dabura >= Adult SSJ2 Gohan >>>>>>>>> Perfect Cell
3. King Cold and Mecha Frieza without breaking a sweat. Final Form Cooler got destroyed horribly against Super Saiyan Goku well Frieza and him were even for a while in till Frieza began to lose power and i dont believe got that much stronger then he was on Namek and he couldn't even transform at will. Sure by statements Coolers stronger then his brother but by the fights hes way way weaker 4th Form Cooler also got washed by Base Goku, Cooler was just bull shitting him self he was probably talking about Initial Final Form Frieza or that Goku beat one of Freeza's early forms. Imo of course.

[CatouttaHell]

Guess I'll post my own opinion on my versuses too for the hell of it.

1. I believe Boo Arc SSjin 3 Goku > Ultimate Gohan and I have him doubling his power by the End of Z, so IMO he rapes Gohan-Boo every bit as horribly as Vegetto did.
2. Gohan couldn't access his enraged power as a teen but he's stronger than he was as a kid so IMO he beats the crap out of Cell anyway.
3. Coola rips them both into pieces without even trying, unless King Cold has some additional transformations like in Multiverse.

[Kirby456]

Well its your opinion Catoutta hell and i respect it.

[Rocketman]

I don't, because it's completely mad.

How the hell does Goku double his power with Earth training when he couldn't with Afterlife training.

How does everybody going "Gohan was stronger when he killed Cell" mean Gohan was stronger at the 25th WT.

How is Vegeta Goku's equal in movie 6 if Goku's base is over 120,000,000.

[CatouttaHell]

How the hell does Goku double his power with Earth training when he couldn't with Afterlife training.

He told Pure Boo he'd become much, much stronger. He more than doubled his power in Afterlife training, despite the main gains being SSjin 2 and 3. When you consider those, he technically got 24x stronger from Afterlife training.

How does everybody going "Gohan was stronger when he killed Cell" mean Gohan was stronger at the 25th WT.

They say he was stronger, not that he got weaker. Nobody ever said Gohan got weaker. He simply couldn't tap into his rage. Gohan on Namek was at 1,500 and he was at 2,800 on Earth due to rage power. That doesn't mean he got weaker on Namek.

Ki doesn't atrophy, the Daizenshuu states Gohan didn't get weaker and that he isn't as powerful as he was when he killed Cell because he couldn't tap into his rage. There's absolutely no instances of anybody's Ki atrophying in the series, because that's impossible. Ki is spiritual energy, not a muscle.

Vegeta and Nappa spent a year napping in their pods and obviously didn't get weaker. Freeza sits around 24/7 barely lifting a finger and he never got weaker from it. Roshi sat around for decades doing nothing and while his physical body atrophied, he didn't get weaker in terms of Ki. He could still bust even the Moon. When you consider Gohan's teen body is stronger than his chibi body, and the fact that he spent an entire month training with Goten, it makes sense that Teen Gohan would be > Chibi Gohan.

How is Vegeta Goku's equal in movie 6 if Goku's base is over 120,000,000.

I don't believe that anymore, I now go by this, which is a far more reasonable theory IMO.

[Rocketman]

He told Pure Boo he'd become much, much stronger. He more than doubled his power in Afterlife training, despite the main gains being SSjin 2 and 3.

If he doubled his power, his SS1 would be nearly equal to SS2 Gohan.

They say he was stronger, not that he got weaker.

Same thing. If he was stronger in the past, then he got weaker between then and now.

[Kirby456]

That seems crazy theres no way SSJ3 Goku could take Buuhan. Imo. I mean thats Ultimate Gohan + Super Boo it took motherfucking Vegito to do it!. Imo.

Also Base Goku > Fourth Form Coola by a ton Base Goku washed him with utter ease http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQuL31Z_dg i mean Coola landed 1 hit and was getting tossed around like a rag doll. So Coola was probably talking about Initial Final Form Frieza or he was just bsing himself. Then against Final Form Cooler SSJ Goku washed him eve worse Goku powered yuup and sent Final Form Cooler flying and took Coolers full power blast by just standing there like it was nothing he was treating Coola like a weakling who was far weaker then him http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsmGoycKEfc. Imo to. Each to his own though.

[CatouttaHell]

If he doubled his power, his SS1 would be nearly equal to SS2 Gohan.

The non-enraged Gohan of the Cell Arc, yes. There's nothing saying that's impossible. When Gohan experienced a great drop in Yuuki and was unable to tap into his raged power he claimed his power had been cut in half, so the rage boost is a HUGE boost. SSjin 2 Gohan isn't much without it. SSjin 2 Goku was flat-out stated to be above Enraged SSjin 2 Gohan from the Cell Games, and since the manga stated the rage boost was 2x there's no getting around SSjin Goku > SSjin 2 Gohan. I have:

(Theoretical) Enraged SSjin 2 Teen Gohan - 130
SSjin 2 Goku - 110
Enraged SSjin 2 Chibi Gohan - 100
SSjin 2 Teen Gohan - 65
SSjin Goku - 55
SSjin 2 Chibi Gohan - 50
(Theoretical) Cell Games SSjin 2 Goku - 38

Same thing. If he was stronger in the past, then he got weaker between then and now.

So we agree that Gohan got a good deal weaker from the time he was on Earth to the time he came to Namek? He hit 2,800 due to rage on Earth and was only at 1,500 on Namek after all.

Also Base Goku > Fourth Form Coola by a ton Base Goku washed him with utter ease. So Coola was probably talking about Initial Final Form Freeza or he was just bsing himself. Imo to. Each to his own though.

He was using Kaio-ken x10 to fight Base Coola. Base Coola is on par with 50% Freeza at least, and Fifth Form Coola is enough to one-shot the Goku that made Freeza his bitch IMO.

[Nineteen]

I like to keep my power levels nice and conservative. I simply cannot wrap my head around fifth-form Coola being more than twice as powerful as fourth-form Freeza. I don't even have Androids 17 and 18, who are doubtlessly more powerful than Movie 5 Coola, more than three times stronger than Freeza.

My list would look like this:

Freeza: 120
SSJ Goku (Namek): 150
Coola: 180
SSJ Goku (Movie 5): 200

[Kirby456]

Against Fourth Form Coola he wasnt he was in normal base mode he used Kaioken X10-20 against 5th Form Coola not 4th form,i dont think Goku got that much stronger probably around his level on yardrat and from the way he smacked Coola around it seems like Coola should be a ton weaker then him. Plus Goku and Frieza were dead even then Goku started winning but Frieza still landed hits, and SSJ Goku smacked 5th form Coola around like he was nothing and treated him like total trash. I mean he powered up and Coola went flying. And took a full power energy blast grom Cooler and just stood there. Heres when Goku used kaioken to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJE-rGyUu0Y then against Final Form Coola as a SSJ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsmGoycK ... re=related.

My numbers would be.

Goku = 3,500,000
- Kaioken X 20 = 70,000,000
- Super Saiyan = 175,000,000

Initial Final Form Frieza = 3,100,000
- Full Power Buff = 150,000,000
- losing power = 120,000,000

Coola Fourth Form = 3,200,000
- Final Form Coola = 106,000,000

[Kirby456]

I like to keep my power levels nice and conservative. I simply cannot wrap my head around fifth-form Coola being more than twice as powerful as fourth-form Freeza. I don't even have Androids 17 and 18, who are doubtlessly more powerful than Movie 5 Coola, more than three times stronger than Freeza.

My list would look like this:

Freeza: 120
SSJ Goku (Namek): 150
Coola: 180
SSJ Goku (Movie 5): 200

I dont think SSJ Goku and Coola are that close. I mean SSJ Goku sent him flying just by powering up and smacked him around like a joke.

[CatouttaHell]

Yeah Goku tanked Coola's punch without even budging. That should be at least a 1.4x difference right there. If it was really 18/20 then Goku would be grasping his stomach in pain. BTW Kirby456 I recommend rewatching Goku vs. Coola, no offence. Goku clearly makes Kaio-ken noises when attacking Coola, which heavily mimicks the Invisible Kaio-ken x10 from the Anime fight of 50% Freeza and Goku. Base Coola should be in the same general range of 50% Freeza IMO because otherwise why would he not just power up instead of going to the trouble of transforming? Coola being 10x weaker than his weakling brother makes no sense IMO.

[Kirby456]

Yeah Goku tanked Coola's punch without even budging. That should be at least a 1.4x difference right there. If it was really 18/20 then Goku would be grasping his stomach in pain. BTW Kirby456 I recommend rewatching Goku vs. Coola, no offence. Goku clearly makes Kaio-ken noises when attacking Coola, which heavily mimicks the Invisible Kaio-ken x10 from the Anime fight of 50% Freeza and Goku. Base Coola should be in the same general range of 50% Freeza IMO because otherwise why would he not just power up instead of going to the trouble of transforming? Coola being 10x weaker than his weakling brother makes no sense IMO.

I didnt see him using Kaioken against 4th form Coola he looked normal 100% in base to me nor did i hear him say Kaioken or find a red aura i just watched the fight though and its all cool each to his own. I say Coola fourth form was using his max power which was 3.2Mil equal to Initial Final Form Frieza then when he transformed was at 114,000,000 well under Frieza and Goku. I just dont see why he should be stronger then his brother. I mean sure if i went by statments only id believe Coola >>>> Frieza but based of the fights Frieza >>> Coola when you think about it imo.

[Nineteen]

I like to keep my power levels nice and conservative. I simply cannot wrap my head around fifth-form Coola being more than twice as powerful as fourth-form Freeza. I don't even have Androids 17 and 18, who are doubtlessly more powerful than Movie 5 Coola, more than three times stronger than Freeza.

My list would look like this:

Freeza: 120
SSJ Goku (Namek): 150
Coola: 180
SSJ Goku (Movie 5): 200

I dont think SSJ Goku and Coola are that close. I mean SSJ Goku sent him flying just by powering up and smacked him around like a joke.

Fun fact: my rankings for Coola and Goku are further apart than the canonical numbers for Goku + Kaio-ken vs. Vegeta, and Vegeta was able to push Goku around with his aura and smack him around pretty easily himself. I think that a slight advantage in raw power can amount to a tremendous advantage in a fight.

[CatouttaHell]

Goku flat-out stated Coola was above Freeza though. Here's a clip from the movie BTW. There are noticeable Kaio-ken sounds when he attacks Coola. Movie 5 Goku is a Goku that came back from Yardrat and then did a bunch of heavy training. This Goku should be on par with 100% Freeza in just Kaio-ken x20 IMHO, and Coola treated Kaio-ken x20 Goku like a fly. Just my opinion though.

[jackjack]

http://www.kanzentai.com/trans-daiz07.p ... r_saiyan_3

Oh, and Goku said "better".

[Kirby456]

Goku flat-out stated Coola was above Freeza though. Here's a clip from the movie BTW. There are noticeable Kaio-ken sounds when he attacks Coola. Movie 5 Goku is a Goku that came back from Yardrat and then did a bunch of heavy training. This Goku should be on par with 100% Freeza in just Kaio-ken x20 IMHO, and Coola treated Kaio-ken x20 Goku like a fly. Just my opinion though.

I looked at the clip and Goku dsoint say anything about Coola being stronger then Frieza,but i guess Its implied like how Goku is suprised against Coolas power or what Coola says about him being close to Frieza. Which i take as Initial Frieza as no one has seen Freeza's 100% power. Ether way i dont really go by what they say but the fights.

What i think.

Goku takes on third form Coola not using Kaioken (from what i saw he was just in normal base) and beats the @@@@ out of Coola putting Goku at 3.5Mil 100K better then he was on Yadrat and Coola equal to Initial Final Form Coola at 3Mil Coola transforms and goes to 114Mil Goku uses Kaioken X 20 and goes up to 70Mil and then Coola swats him away. Then Goku goes SSj and swats Coola away like a fly or nothing and his power goes to 175Mil. I think it works perfectly but thats just my opinion.

I guess

Based of what they say = Coola

Based of the fights = Frieza

I mean the fight implies Goku wasint using Kaioken against 3rd form Coola but Coolas statements do i guess. The fight impliers Frieza being stronger then his brother but what they say implies Coolas stronger.

I respect your opinion Catoutta Hell and theres a chance it could be right but theres a chance mying could be right to i think both are proably plausible. But I'm not changing this i dont really have much more to say on this battle. Imo.

[Rocketman]

The non-enraged Gohan of the Cell Arc, yes. There's nothing saying that's impossible.

You'd think somebody would comment on Goku nearly matching an SS2 with just SS1.