Dragonball Vs. Non Dragonball

[Bussani]

Oh yeah, that's right. Nova (and technically Omega) would gain energy from the heat of a nuke.

I tend to forget everything from GT, but didn't that dragon have a technique where he made a lens to focus light into a death-ray of some sort? I kind of remember Goku using a taiyo-ken through the lens to try and hurt him, but I don't remember what happened. Did he just absorb it?

[caejones]

Gero's creations all had some pretty powerful explosives planted in them.
We don't really know anything about those explosives, but it's implied that they're some sort of bombs, and Cell was pretty worried about #16's.

[Haji]

Ki enhances. If it was not for ki the Z-senshi would be ripped to shreds just by being sent through a building or into a mountain. But for some reason, I guess some people think that a flame could "bypass" ki. I don't get that. If that was true then Goku and Broli should not have been able to come back out of lava. And remember when Vegeta deflected Hirudegan's attack? it didn't just go through Vegeta's shield. And oh, ki don't give off any heat? Vegeta,Pikuhan, and Nova. Thay all seemed to have ki that could give off heat.

[Rocketman]

If that was true then Goku and Broli should not have been able to come back out of lava. And remember when Vegeta deflected Hirudegan's attack? it didn't just go through Vegeta's shield. And oh, ki don't give off any heat? Vegeta,Pikuhan, and Nova. Thay all seemed to have ki that could give off heat.

Filler, movie, and lava is 'only' 1000 degrees. Movie, filler, GT.

Vegeta's bizarre never-used-again fireballs are the sole exception.

[Haji]

I don't care if it is a movie or filler. Toriyama was involved in most of that stuff anyways. I just don't really count GT no more because of DBO. But anyway, It shows that ki can guard against heat. Yeah if one was to weak in ki they would not survive a big bomb like that. But you think that Goku, the one that shock the planet its self just powering up to SSJ3 would not have the power to withstand the heat from a big bomb like that?

[Rocketman]

It shows that ki can guard against heat.

No it doesn't, because it's filler.

But you think that Goku, the one that shock the planet its self just powering up to SSJ3 would not have the power to withstand the heat from a big bomb like that?

Yep. Because they are two different things.

[Haji]

But ki enhances, reinforces. Thats how they're clothes don't get blown away in one hit.

[Bussani]

Gero's creations all had some pretty powerful explosives planted in them.
We don't really know anything about those explosives, but it's implied that they're some sort of bombs, and Cell was pretty worried about #16's.

That's a good point. If we're to assume that they could survive nuclear explosions and dips in the sun...how strong was #16's bomb meant to be?! It must have been able to blow up a quarter of the galaxy...!

But for some reason, I guess some people think that a flame could "bypass" ki.

I think it's more that they question how much heat they could withstand, not that ki can't protect you from heat at all. That said, there are three major methods of heat transfer, and protecting against one or two doesn't necessarily mean protecting against all three. I happen to think that ki can do more or less anything if you care enough to figure out how to use it in a particular way, but no one in the show has ever used it to deflect electromagnetic radiation. Heck, if they could, they wouldn't need sunglasses to avoid a Taiyo-ken attack.

Also, I can't tell if you're counting GT or not (since you mentioned "Nova", but then said you hold DBO above it or whatever), but Goku was hurt by a rather small amount of heat from that dragon (and in this context, "rather small amount" is about the same as the surface of the sun) until he went to Super Saiyan 4. Sure, that was his base form, but how the hell strong was Goku's base form supposed to be in GT anyway? Point is, even Toei--the guys who like to make Goku virtually unbeatable--think that it takes Super Saiyan 4 to withstand a piddly temperature of a few thousand degrees--which is nothing compared to the sort of heat being discussed here. Is it really so strange that there are people here who feel the same way as the anime staff?

[Fox666]

But ki enhances, reinforces. Thats how they're clothes don't get blown away in one hit.

The reason clothes resist attacks is to not increase the show rating.

[rereboy]

Freeza survived an exploding planet bigger than Earth that seemed to be engulfed in a sea of lava and heat with little Ki to protect himself with.

Lava barely tops 1000 degrees C.

It's beside my point, but when was it said that Namek as bigger than Earth?


And I keep saying this and nobody seems to acknowledge it. It does not matter that they can blow up a planet with ki, nor that they can block ki attacks that would do that. KI DOES NOT GIVE OFF SIGNIFICANT HEAT.

Just because you can shrug off a punch to the gut does not mean you could tank the flame of a blowtorch.

lol, I knew you would only just focus on the lava part...

And yes, it doesn't mean that they can tank heat (blowtorch) the same way, but it also doesn't mean that they can't.

I happen to believe that they can pretty much use their Ki as a means of defense against anything (Vegetto even figured out a way of using his Ki as a barrier against Buu's absorption). I don't believe heat would just bypass their defenses, so... It just becomes a question of their Ki being strong enough.

[mysticboy]

Filler, movie, and lava is 'only' 1000 degrees. Movie, filler, GT.

A nuclear bomb would kill anybody from Dragonball/Z/GT.

:/

[Deep Thought]

Yeah, the anime versions of the cast are insanely, ludicrously more powerful than there manga counterparts, especially if you include the movies. For instance, Cooler could withstand the heat of the sun like nothing; indeed, the scene seemed to show that it was the detonation of Cooler's attack that killed him, rather than the sun. I wouldn't say that the anime incarnations of the Z cast are up there with some on the ridiculous feats of other universes, but they're fucking up there.

[Haji]

Freeza survived an exploding planet bigger than Earth that seemed to be engulfed in a sea of lava and heat with little Ki to protect himself with.

Lava barely tops 1000 degrees C.

It's beside my point, but when was it said that Namek as bigger than Earth?


And I keep saying this and nobody seems to acknowledge it. It does not matter that they can blow up a planet with ki, nor that they can block ki attacks that would do that. KI DOES NOT GIVE OFF SIGNIFICANT HEAT.

Just because you can shrug off a punch to the gut does not mean you could tank the flame of a blowtorch.

lol, I knew you would only just focus on the lava part...

And yes, it doesn't mean that they can tank heat (blowtorch) the same way, but it also doesn't mean that they can't.

I happen to believe that they can pretty much use their Ki as a means of defense against anything (Vegetto even figured out a way of using his Ki as a barrier against Buu's absorption). I don't believe heat would just bypass their defenses, so... It just becomes a question of their Ki being strong enough.

Yes, this is what i mean. You would think Goku could survive it. SSJ3 shock the planet. Oh and remember that little kamehameha that Buu shot off? Goku deflected it off over the horizon, And Babidi said it took out around 1/8 of the planet. 1/8! I think he meant the surface though, but still. And that was just a bit of Buu's power. Not like a huge ultimate. Or was that all just anime filler?

[Rocketman]

Yes, this is what i mean. You would think Goku could survive it. SSJ3 shock the planet. Oh and remember that little kamehameha that Buu shot off? Goku deflected it off over the horizon, And Babidi said it took out around 1/8 of the planet. 1/8! I think he meant the surface though, but still. And that was just a bit of Buu's power. Not like a huge ultimate. Or was that all just anime filler? :roll:

Why do you keep bringing up amount of damage like it matters?

[Kid Buu]

Who do you think would win: Android #17, or Wolverwine at equal strength?

One has infinite stamina, the other has healing

[Saiga]

Can't 17 just blow his head off? Wolverine can't fly, either.

[Kid Buu]

I don't remember #17 ever using Ki in the manga, I remember #18 doing a Kiezen though.

[Haji]

17 can use ki, if he couldn't, the Z-senshi would have destroyed him in one hit.

[Hellspawn28]

Who do you think would win: Android #17, or Wolverwine at equal strength?

One has infinite stamina, the other has healing

#17 would knock out Logan with a single punch. Spider-Man was able to take out Wolverine and Spider-Man would lose to Kid Goku.

[Saiga]

He does that energy shield thing.

And Spider-man losing to Kid Goku? His strength isn't always consistent but under Stan Lee (his creator) he could lift 10 tonnes. That's stronger than Kid Goku, isn't it?