Dragon Ball Z's ending

[Michsi]

But it didn't need to do that. In fact, by continuing the story, Gohan loses his status as Goku's successor.
He gets his moment of glory, then it passes and it's given back to Goku. It ruins the whole idea of father-son legacy.

For the record, I'm not saying I would have liked DB to end, but I admit that Freeza saga would have been a good ending and it makes a lot of sense.

[SylentEcho]

Gohan should have been the one to kill Boo too. Then it would have completed his character.

[hleV]

The ending of DB is fine. Shows that the adventures are not over, even better with the Kanzenban ending.

[Rocketman]

Gohan should have been the one to kill Boo too. Then it would have completed his character.

-goofs off for seven years
-gets super awesome magical powerup handed to him by sitting on his ass for a day
-defeats bad guy, is hailed as hero

Really?

[Michsi]

Big difference between that and magic water and magic ear rings?

[Rocketman]

Big difference between that and magic water and magic ear rings?

Magic water nearly killed Goku.
Magic earrings are only effective because the two parts are so strong from training.

Magic unlocking? Free ultimate power for sitting still.

[Michsi]

Magic unlocking? Free ultimate power for sitting still.

Like the earrings, if Gohan hadn't been strong already , it wouldn't have been as effective.
Yes, it was the cheapest way to get power, sure, but what big difference is there between this and other short-cuts.In the end it was his reward for pulling out the sword.

[Piccolo Daimao]

To be honest, making Gohan defeat the main villain and become the hero would be a terrible decision. He's already proven that he can't cut it as a hero. Even if you forget everything that happened in the Cell arc (i.e. still having to rely on Daddy to finish off the bad guy), once peace returned to Earth, Gohan didn't train at all for seven years, while Goku and Vegeta did and surpassed him. This results in him not being able to defeat Dabra (not even the main villain), not being able to even hold his own against Boo, and being absent (in terms of fighting) for most of the story while Goku takes over and then Goten and Trunks are built up as the next heroes, largely shifting the focus off Gohan.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

being absent (in terms of fighting) for most of the story while Goku and Vegeta take over and then Goten and Trunks are built up as the next heroes, largely shifting the focus off Gohan.

Actualy, Vegeta was more absent in Boo arc, since he was dead for most of the arc.

[Michsi]

To be honest, making Gohan defeat the main villain and become the hero would be a terrible decision. He's already proven that he can't cut it as a hero. Even if you forget everything that happened in the Cell arc (i.e. still having to rely on Daddy to finish off the bad guy), once peace returned to Earth, Gohan didn't train at all for seven years, while Goku and Vegeta did and surpassed him. This results in him not being able to defeat Dabra (not even the main villain), not being able to even hold his own against Boo, and being absent (in terms of fighting) for most of the story while Goku and Vegeta take over and then Goten and Trunks are built up as the next heroes, largely shifting the focus off Gohan.

The biggest part of the Buu arc still build up Gohan as the main hope against Buu. His lack of training in the last seven years was established as a fault on his part, something that he more or less acknowledges when he got berated for it. When you introduce such faults in your characters you tend have them overcome them, meaining that he was not beyond salvation at that point. Since the moment we saw the Kaioshin claim that he was their last hope you knew that the story had somethig else in store for him and he entered the fight after SSJ 3 Goku and Goten and Trunks who were build up as the new heroes. In fact, it was because I knew that Gohan had yet to make his entrance that kept me from believing Gotenks would be the winning the fight. The focus only really shifted away from him at the very end of the story when Goku and Vegeta had been introduced again.

His potential as Goku's successor/next big hero was good and finished the moment he got defeated, but more importantly when Goku came back to stay and the last chapter was the final nail in the coffin.

I don't think Gohan would have been a bad choice for hero, he would have been a boring one. Remember, Toriyama had intended to have him actually become the main character in the last arc, and for most of the arc, you can tell that, but ultimately chose against it.

[Piccolo Daimao]

being absent (in terms of fighting) for most of the story while Goku and Vegeta take over and then Goten and Trunks are built up as the next heroes, largely shifting the focus off Gohan.

Actualy, Vegeta was more absent in Boo arc, since he was dead for most of the arc.

OK, well, just Goku, then.

The biggest part of the Buu arc still build up Gohan as the main hope against Buu. His lack of training in the last seven years was established as a fault on his part, something that he more or less acknowledges when he got berated for it. When you introduce such faults in your characters you tend have them overcome them, meaining that he was not beyond salvation at that point. Since the moment we saw the Kaioshin claim that he was their last hope you knew that the story had somethig else in store for him and he entered the fight after SSJ 3 Goku and Goten and Trunks who were build up as the new heroes. In fact, it was because I knew that Gohan had yet to make his entrance that kept me from believing Gotenks would be the winning the fight. The focus only really shifted away from him at the very end of the story when Goku and Vegeta had been introduced again.

I don't think Gohan would have been a bad choice for hero, he would have been a boring one. Remember, Toriyama had intended to have him actually become the main character in the last arc, and for most of the arc, you can tell that, but ultimately chose against it.

The thing is, Gohan isn't a fighter at heart, so portraying his lack of training as a "fault" is kind of stupid. Having him slack off, then get really powerful again and defeat the bad guy would somewhat...I dunno...give the sort of opposite impression we're supposed to make of Gohan. I realize there's probably a better way to explain than that, but I don't like the idea that this aspiring scholar is being pressurised or feels like he should train just so he can be relied on to save the Earth again if, per chance, an even stronger villain comes up. I mean, yeah, it's better than Goku and Vegeta being the heroes, since they always fuck things up for their own selfish desires, but I just don't see Gohan as hero material.

[Michsi]

The thing is, Gohan isn't a fighter at heart, so portraying his lack of training as a "fault" is kind of stupid.

Countless heroes aren't fighters at heart which is what makes them heroes in the comic book cliche sense of the word, that they don't like violence, that they don't like to hurt, but they do it for the people they want to protect which is completely IC for Gohan and as I already said before, makes him a better choice for a hero. Even the whole Saiyaman gig might have been an allusion to that. I have no trouble believing that Gohan could have very well learned his lesson about slacking off, this is what I meant when I mentioned him overcomming his faults since he knows he made a mistake. Gohan isn't main character material, at least no for a story like DB, but probably the best choice for a hero.

[Rocketman]

Like the earrings, if Gohan hadn't been strong already , it wouldn't have been as effective.

No, it was only so effective because Gohan was weakened. If he had been training his ass off and already using half of that hidden power, then the Ultimate powerup would have less to unlock.

[Kaboom]

Yeah, just because Vegeta's single life goal isn't to kill Goku anymore doesn't mean they can't maintain a more friendly rivalry. Just look at the two of them in the 2008 special, or even in GT.

[hleV]

Gohan is a random pacifist person who happens to have great potential thanks to Goku. He killed Cell because Goku trained him, then he became stronger than nearly everyone thanks to someone else again.
He did nothing to deserve a title of hero, at least when there are folks like Goku around.

[Michsi]

No, it was only so effective because Gohan was weakened. If he had been training his ass off and already using half of that hidden power, then the Ultimate powerup would have less to unlock.

So you are saying that if Gohan hadn't trained a day in his life he'd would have still gotten to be just as strong ?

Then why didn't Guru bring out Chou Gohan right there and then, it's basically the same power.

Gohan is a random pacifist person who happens to have great potential thanks to Goku. He killed Cell because Goku trained him, then he became stronger than nearly everyone thanks to someone else again.
He did nothing to deserve a title of hero, at least when there are folks like Goku around.

Yes, Gohan trained to become strong, like almost everybody else in the story and yes, he inherited power thanks to his parents, like a lot of people did in the story, ex: Piccolo, Vegeta .Why do those reasons make him not deserve the title of a hero?

[SylentEcho]

College Gohan becoming Chou Gohan was a killer transformation. He acted like Piccolo and looked like Goku. How awesome is that?!

I disliked Saiyaman/College Gohan, but when I saw Chou Gohan, I totally forgot about him being a slacker.

Then why didn't Guru bring out Chou Gohan right there and then, it's basically the same power.

Saichouro's power up can't even be half as good as Ro Kaioshin's. Saichouro is just an elder Namekiean , Ro Kaioshin on the other hand, is the god of gods.

[AgitoZ]

College Gohan becoming Chou Gohan was a killer transformation. He acted like Piccolo and looked like Goku. How awesome is that?!

I disliked Saiyaman/College Gohan, but when I saw Chou Gohan, I totally forgot about him being a slacker.

Gohan was going to high school during the Boo arc...

[Rocketman]

So you are saying that if Gohan hadn't trained a day in his life he'd would have still gotten to be just as strong ?

Yup. All that RAGE power Gohan's been tapping into for his whole life, that's what Old Kai brought to the surface with Mystic.

[Saiga]

U. Gohan beating the stuffing out of S. Boo would have been the best ending for the series, making the Boo saga essentially "how Gohan got his groove back." I still love Vegetto/the Kid Boo Saga to bits, but it would be awesome for DB to be about Goku's story and DBZ to be Gohan's story.