Super Saiyan 4 Goku...

[daveslaine2770]

Is the best Goku I have ever watched. Part of him kind of reminds me of when he was serious during the 23rd tenkaichi budokai.

Remember that stare between Goku and Piccolo?

SSJ4 Goku to me is the best form of Goku I've seen. Looks wise its amazing, I like it better than the golden hair, and power wise as well, however, the reason I think SSJ4 is the best is because of how he is inside.

SSJ Goku was always angry, worried. FPPSJ was more relaxed, and could get serious.

SSJ3 was cool but pissed me off because of how cocky it made Goku and how he kept provoking Buu which was unlike him.

But SSJ4 turned out to be the best. He was incredibly mature while a SSJ4. His voice deepened, he became more collected, and could sense almost anything, especially during the fight with Yi Xing Long.

This is why I think SSJ4 takes the grand prize of SSJ transformations. Its the maturity and seriousness that comes in the form. Even the Funi dub got Goku's voice right.

The only time where Goku was like a SSJ4 in DBZ was during the Majin Vegeta arc, otherwise, Goku's been pretty soft until SSJ4.

If you have forgotten just go watch the Japanese version of GT episode 35. Goku is fucking awesome there.

[SylentEcho]

I think the best Goku I've ever watched is Kid Goku and Goku kicking Freeza's ass.

However, when I think, "Goku", the first thing that comes to mind is Goku with the nyo-ibo, sitting on Kinto Un with Gohan on his lap. I guess that will always be Goku to me. A really strong, funny & friendly guy who's also being a good dad.

SSJ4 is pretty cool. The main reason I like it, is because it looks really different from the other forms. It's like they actually used their imagination. Instead of just adding hair and sparks, they made a real transformation happen.

[lash]

I always loved the stare down Si(Nuova) Xing Long and SSJ4 Goku had right before they were about to fight. The original music...the earth polluted atmosphere...the wind rolling...the newspaper getting in the vicinity of the dragon and getting scorched...an auraless calm SSJ4 Goku, yet the thought that these two controlled forces potentially have enough force to shatter, yes shatter the entire mortal universe while on little old Earth...

Just pure awesomeness.

Anyway, I enjoyed SSJ4 a lot. I just wish Goku didn't spam it so much at times. He's not as bad as like Bleach's Ichigo and his overused Bankai, but after the Baby Saga for Goku his options pretty much became: Pull some magic in normal state, or go all out in SSJ4, even when the enemy appears to only be a notch better than his normal state. I dunno, I felt it made the Ultimate Super Saiya-jin state slightly less special when he did that. It made his other states absolutely useless too. I know the enemies he fights aren't sine or cosine waves. So they shouldn't be THAT up and down in power.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Yeah, SSJ4 is awesome. It's the perfect Saiyan form, as it beats SSJ, SSJ2 & SSJ3 in every way. It's the strongest and fastest form, it doesn't consume you in rage like SSJ2 & 3, it doesn't spend too much ki like SSJ3, and the power is more in control, as it doesn't make the universe shake just by transforming. It's appearance is cool too.

[JulieYBM]

Anyway, I enjoyed SSJ4 a lot. I just wish Goku didn't spam it so much at times. He's not as bad as like Bleach's Ichigo and his overused Bankai, but after the Baby Saga for Goku his options pretty much became: Pull some magic in normal state, or go all out in SSJ4, even when the enemy appears to only be a notch better than his normal state. I dunno, I felt it made the Ultimate Super Saiya-jin state slightly less special when he did that. It made his other states absolutely useless too. I know the enemies he fights aren't sine or cosine waves. So they shouldn't be THAT up and down in power.

Well hey, Ichigo had a reason to use Bankai all the time. His foes were always stronger than the last. Although it did make his Shikai look a bit weaker, which is a shame since even in Shikai he is above Lt. Commander level.

Although, I do agree that Super Saiyan 4 was probably a little mishandled. Once we got to the Evil Dragons arc Gokuu did tend to use Super Saiyan 4 like it was his only transformation. I wonder if the writers were under pressure to sell Super Saiyan 4 merchandise at that point? It's a shame. Other than The last four dragons I think they should have tried to get around resorting to Super Saiyan 4.

[Haji]

SSJ4 is not a SSJ, it's not a power up, it's a metamorphosis. It's like a new body for Goku, I think SSJ4 is as powerful as SSJ3 but it don't consume energy like a SSJ. I like the "SS"J4 form, but SSJ3 is my favorite.

[Piccolo Daimao]

I think most people know that "SSj4" is named "SSj4" for convenience.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

SSJ4 is not a SSJ, it's not a power up, it's a metamorphosis. It's like a new body for Goku, I think SSJ4 is as powerful as SSJ3 but it don't consume energy like a SSJ. I like the "SS"J4 form, but SSJ3 is my favorite.

This doesn't make sence at all. It's not just a new body. It is a Super Saiyan form since it's called Super Saiyan 4. SSJ3 Goku got rapped by Super Baby 2, while SSJ4 Goku rapped Super Baby 2 and was equal to Oozaru Baby. And it's been officialy confirmed that Goku didn't lose single battle power unit when he became a kid.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

This doesn't make sence at all. It's not just a new body. It is a Super Saiyan form since it's called Super Saiyan 4.

Well, no... GT Perfect Files:

Super Saiyan 4
The form which draws out the battle power which Saiyans posses out to the utmost limits is this, Super Saiyan 4!! It’s distinguished by having a different appearance than previous Super Saiyans, with red body fur and long black hair!! It is called Super Saiyan 4 out of convenience, but due to it being a transformation from Golden Oozaru, it would be no exaggeration to call it a different species from all previous Super Saiyans!! Thinking of it as a different species, you could also name such points as the fact that unlike with 3 he has an adult appearance, despite being a transformation of little Goku.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Again, it's still a Super Saiyan form, but just a different type.

[TRL]

I think it's still a transformation since it's not permanent. For it to be a metamorphosis it would have to be.
In fact that would have been pretty cool and more logical if that became Goku's new base form. That his actual "being" changed.
On top of that new base form it would allow for new SSJ transformations.

Too bad we can't ignore GT into nonexistence though.

[lash]

Too bad we can't ignore GT into nonexistence though.

GT hate gets really old after awhile.

[Perfect]

Too bad we can't ignore GT into nonexistence though.

GT hate gets really old after awhile.

Well I feel Super Saiyan 4 is the most positive thing to come from it, really, if they would have been more unique with the storytelling, then I'm sure people would've liked it more.

[Saiga]

Too bad we can't ignore GT into nonexistence though.

GT hate gets really old after awhile.

GT sort of brings the hate on itself, though.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Just like Justin Bieber, people complaining about the subject tends to become more annoying than the subject. Because everyone always bangs on about it, we've heard it all before and some people are just bandwagonning.

[Hellspawn28]

Too bad we can't ignore GT into nonexistence though.

GT hate gets really old after awhile.

The hate for GT has been old for a long time. It's like hating on Episode I and Batman & Robin, it been has been hated and beaten down to death enough already. No point on hating on a series that ended 14 years ago and still be butt hurt about it.

As for SSj4 Goku, I remember seeing the image of SSj4 Goku 10 years ago and it was the same time when Toonami aired the episode when Goku first turn into a SSj3. I liked SSj4 Goku and Vegeta but I always think that gold fur would look better then red fur.

[Haji]

This doesn't make sence at all. It's not just a new body. It is a Super Saiyan form since it's called Super Saiyan 4.

Well, no... GT Perfect Files:

Super Saiyan 4
The form which draws out the battle power which Saiyans posses out to the utmost limits is this, Super Saiyan 4!! It’s distinguished by having a different appearance than previous Super Saiyans, with red body fur and long black hair!! It is called Super Saiyan 4 out of convenience, but due to it being a transformation from Golden Oozaru, it would be no exaggeration to call it a different species from all previous Super Saiyans!! Thinking of it as a different species, you could also name such points as the fact that unlike with 3 he has an adult appearance, despite being a transformation of little Goku.

What did i say? see there. I know it's called SSJ4 for convenience, but it's not a power up! And SSJ4 has to be a new body, like Ouzaru, thats a new body and SSJ4 comes from that. So they're you go.

And Goku geting beat by Baby, uh lets see, he was in his kid body? If i remember right, Goku said something like "this small body i can't use my power right."

[TheDevilsCorpse]

What did i say? see there. I know it's called SSJ4 for convenience, but it's not a power up! And SSJ4 has to be a new body, like Ouzaru, thats a new body and SSJ4 comes from that. So they're you go.

And Goku geting beat by Baby, uh lets see, he was in his kid body? If i remember right, Goku said something like "this small body i can't use my power right."

It's definitely a power-up based transformation, just not a literal "Super Saiyan" transformation, its something entirely new that powers up the user and gives them a new body as well. Personally I like to dub the form "Hitōzaru", but that's a different discussion. The same book confirms that Goku didn't lose any of his ki by becoming a kid in GT, just stamina. Goku doesn't really display any problems actually using his power while a kid at any point in the series, except when Shunkan-ido is involved, just the ability to use it over time. SS3 Kid Goku got pwned by Bebi Vegeta because he wasn't strong enough to beat him, if Goku was a match for him, he could have fired a full power attack right out of the starting gate and his stamina wouldn't be a factor. SS4 Goku being able to pwn the same Bebi Vegeta, and then even be a pretty good match for him after he transforms again, confirms a power boost. How big of one may be a different story...

[TRL]

Well I was merely pointing out that it's there and we have to deal with it. Even if ignoring it seems justified with Toriyama himself doing it indirectly through Dragonball Online.

To me GT just feels like so many wasted opportunities. For all the good that they have done it's hard to live up to the standards of Dragonball.
There's things I'm willing to accept (like ssj4, bebi as a nicely designed villain, Uub doing something with his buu heritage) and there's things I'd rather have seen differently(Goku turning into a kid, Piccolo dying, adult Gotenks actually being there, some kind of Buu form for Uub, the story and design of the dragons having more connection to the nameks.). I'm sure this has been discussed to death though.

[Haji]

I just meant how Goku used his ki, I didn't mean he lost any. Just that he was used to his adult body so much and then being a kid again he had to get used to using his ki as a kid and could not use it at full potential. I like to think what if Goku was still normal(not a kid) on those adventures and battled Bebi as SSJ3, would he have done better? I think he might have.