Super Saiyan 4 Goku...

[TheDevilsCorpse]

I just meant how Goku used his ki, I didn't mean he lost any. Just that he was used to his adult body so much and then being a kid again he had to get used to using his ki as a kid and could not use it at full potential. I like to think what if Goku was still normal(not a kid) on those adventures and battled Bebi as SSJ3, would he have done better? I think he might have.

I dunno. It took Goku less than a few hours at max to figure out how to use Ginyu's alien body in the Namek Arc, I doubt it would take him more than the year he was in space to figure out how to adjust to his body after he'd become a kid again...

[DBZ Mick]

I always loved the stare down Si(Nuova) Xing Long and SSJ4 Goku had right before they were about to fight. The original music...the earth polluted atmosphere...the wind rolling...the newspaper getting in the vicinity of the dragon and getting scorched...an auraless calm SSJ4 Goku, yet the thought that these two controlled forces potentially have enough force to shatter, yes shatter the entire mortal universe while on little old Earth...

Just pure awesomeness.

Agreed with this. I love that battle. I also love Goku's transformation into it for the first time in combination with the music.

[daveslaine2770]

Why do people on Daizex always go off the damn topic? This thread wasn't about if SSJ4 is a different form, or how much you like Goku in Ginyu's body.

Its fucking about how I think SSJ4 is the best because he is the most adult-like, mature Goku in the entire series. So either post agreeing or disagreeing, or stop crap of steering the thread out of the boundaries, its annoying.

[Perfect]

lol chill out bro. There ain't a such thing as maturity if ya know what I mean.

There is no such thing as maturity. There is instead an ever-evolving process of maturing. Because when there is a maturity, there is a conclusion and a cessation. That’s the end. That’s when the coffin is closed. You might be deteriorating physically in the long process of aging, but your personal process of daily discovery is ongoing. You continue to learn more and more about yourself every day.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Personally I like to dub the form "Hitōzaru"

What does that mean?

I dunno. It took Goku less than a few hours at max to figure out how to use Ginyu's alien body in the Namek Arc, I doubt it would take him more than the year he was in space to figure out how to adjust to his body after he'd become a kid again...

Well, Goku still didn't know how to use his body (not to mention being mortally wounded on top of that); he just realized that the reason he couldn't use his ki well was because he was in a different body, and that the same should go for Ginyu in his body.

But I agree with your point.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

What does that mean?

Its sort of a pun I guess. It combines hito (man; person) and oozaru (big monkey/ape), resulting in "hitoozaru". No idea if it can be combined like that in Japanese with katakana though, Herms would know better than I, but I still like the term. Japanese people seem to name things fairly literally, so as a name, I think it fits well enough. Prefer the macron spelling though; "Hitōzaru". For some reason I don't think the double Os look good with it.

Well, Goku still didn't know how to use his body (not to mention being mortally wounded on top of that); he just realized that the reason he couldn't use his ki well was because he was in a different body, and that the same should go for Ginyu in his body.

Yeah, since this stems from a GT discussion, I was basing this off the anime. Since Goku steps in to help Gohan and Kuririn, I assume he's figured out how to use the body, I just doubt he has much power because he is so badly wounded.

[Piccolo Daimao]

What does that mean?

Its sort of a pun I guess. It combines hito (man; person) and oozaru (big monkey/ape), resulting in "hitoozaru". No idea if it can be combined like that in Japanese with katakana though, Herms would know better than I, but I still like the term. Japanese people seem to name things fairly literally, so as a name, I think it fits well enough. Prefer the macron spelling though; "Hitōzaru". For some reason I don't think the double Os look good with it.

Yeah, I kind of like it too. Because that's what "Super Saiyan 4" kind of is. The Ozaru form contained within his human form. A man-monkey of sorts.

I don't think the double Os look good with it either. In fact, I don't spell "Ozaru" with double Os anymore, because for years, I'd thought that the pronunciation of it was "ooh-zaa-roo", when it's actually "oh-zaa-roo". I think the spelling of "Ozaru" portrays that better than the somewhat misleading "Oozaru".

Well, Goku still didn't know how to use his body (not to mention being mortally wounded on top of that); he just realized that the reason he couldn't use his ki well was because he was in a different body, and that the same should go for Ginyu in his body.

Yeah, since this stems from a GT discussion, I was basing this off the anime. Since Goku steps in to help Gohan and Kuririn, I assume he's figured out how to use the body, I just doubt he has much power because he is so badly wounded.

Oh, OK. I mean, I still think that he didn't figure out how to use his body even in the anime (I think he was just helping Gohan and Kuririn because he didn't want to be standing around doing nothing), but I understand your point and it's valid in this case.

[Haji]

I was also thinking, were Goku was in a small body his power output was different. making it where he wouldn't be as powerful as if he still had his adult body.

[Monkey D Goku]

I though ssj4 was pretty cool back when I was kid watching GT on the television but now that I look at it I don't really like it that much Goku gets magic clothes and a short growth spurt it just seems like something that was rushed on Toriyama part. I know Akira Toriyama had nothing to do with the story of GT but I heard he was involved with some character drawing of some sort. Anyway I think ssj3 is the best and coolest looking and the way goku transformed made it even more epic compared to ssj4 transformation.

[Fox666]

Toriyama had no involvemente in Super Saiyan 4 design. The reason he grow pants if because of non-sensical censoring.

[FNF]

Toriyama had no involvemente in Super Saiyan 4 design. The reason he grow pants if because of non-sensical censoring.

They could have just made Goku have no...you know... when he went SSjin4 like when the Saiyans go Oozaru.

But yeah it would be kind of weird Goku having his junk out after he went SSjin4.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Toriyama had no involvemente in Super Saiyan 4 design. The reason he grow pants if because of non-sensical censoring.

They could have just made Goku have no...you know... when he went SSjin4 like when the Saiyans go Oozaru.

Perhaps they thought that, since he kind of returned to his adult human body, he'd still have his junk showing. But yeah, it would be weird for Goku and Vegeta to be fighting with their dicks flying about the place. The only instances we ever see Goku fight with his dick out is in the very first chapter/episode when Goku fight naked was the brief scene in which he knocked out the fish and when the second part of his battle with Pilaf and his gang. And that was in pre-Z DB.

There actually was a moment where, after Goku had (conveniently) woken up soon after he reverted back to normal from Ozaru at the 21st TB during the final with Kame-sennin, he just shrugged off the absence of his clothing and prepared to fight Kame-sennin anyway. But then the announcer stepped in and advised him to put some clothes on before continuing the match. But perhaps even Toriyama thought it was too ridiculous. Still, it would've been a good opportunity for humour.

[Fox666]

Well, showing naked boys is not unusual in comics and perhaps even cinema. However showing an adult is something completely different, it is considered pornography. Besides Dragon Ball use nudity for comical purposes, so it would kill the mood of certain situations.

[FNF]

Child nudity is more innocent than adult nudity so there isn't the same weird Goku humour involved. It is just an adult, with his junk hanging out. It would just be wrong.

[TRL]

I think they should have either made a kid form of ssj4 or had them return to being adult at some point in the story. It would have made more sense and wouldn't have needed any magical pants.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Well, showing naked boys is not unusual in comics and perhaps even cinema. However showing an adult is something completely different, it is considered pornography. Besides Dragon Ball use nudity for comical purposes, so it would kill the mood of certain situations.

Yeah, that as well. Presumably that's the same reason why we only ever saw Bulma's T&A, but not her vagina (e.g. the scene where she shows Kame-sennin her vagina, but the angle is from behind).

[Hitiro]

SSJ Goku was always angry, worried. FPPSJ was more relaxed, and could get serious.

Goku was serious as a SSJ and he was never worried except from the whole thing of Namek exploding.

SSJ3 was cool but pissed me off because of how cocky it made Goku and how he kept provoking Buu which was unlike him.

I don't recall Goku being that cocky in SSJ3, he took a punch from fat Buu and smiled but I think he was just looking forward to the fight. IMO SSJ4 Goku was really cocky, when he first transformed he was being all arrogant with Bebi saying he doesn't stand a chance against Goku in that form, among other things.

But SSJ4 turned out to be the best. He was incredibly mature while a SSJ4. His voice deepened, he became more collected, and could sense almost anything, especially during the fight with Yi Xing Long.

Pesonally I felt like they played down Goku's base form abilities in GT. Goku's ability to sense shouldn't have changed no matter what form he is in, its an art, not an ability that can be powered up by transforming. In fact I think they played down Goku's SSJ4 form senses in GT because Goku when he was fighting Yakon displayed perfect control of his senses when it was dark and I just didn't feel Goku demonstrated the same level of ability in GT.

The only time where Goku was like a SSJ4 in DBZ was during the Majin Vegeta arc, otherwise, Goku's been pretty soft until SSJ4.

I guess it's just down to preference really, I felt that Goku was fairly consistant across his forms. Like I said up above I felt that SSJ4 was much more arrogant in terms of the other three transformations.

If you have forgotten just go watch the Japanese version of GT episode 35. Goku is fucking awesome there.

I really don't want to go back to watching GT, for me the plot holes are just too annoying to ignore. Even the start of the story contributes to the whole of the series not being possible in the Dragonball universe. For the amount of episodes they did for GT there are so many plot holes and mistakes and they didn't even do that many episodes. Compared to DBZ, which had the most episodes, it makes DBZ seem like a masterpiece. I really feel that Toei were just trying to milk the franchise for all its worth and then, when everyone was fed up, discard it like a carton of bad milk.