What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Fox666 » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:51 pm

Angelus wrote:If I'm wrong... then where the heck did this Tri Beam insane multiplier info come from? Almost every DBZ forum I go to have Tien's Tri Beam with an insane multiplier.
It doesn't come from any official source. It is just a fan theory to explain how he cornered Cell with the Shin Kikoho.
Angelus wrote:Tien was already very weak for that Tri Beam. Actually, not very weak... dying... or rather near death. That shot was his last breathe of energy left. It wasn't even really a Tri Beam at full power because he only used one-hand. Same thing as the a one-handed Kamehameha from SSJ2 Gohan to SPC.
Even so, Nappa did not get any serious injuries or anything.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Beji » Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:34 am

Fox666 wrote:
Angelus wrote:If I'm wrong... then where the heck did this Tri Beam insane multiplier info come from? Almost every DBZ forum I go to have Tien's Tri Beam with an insane multiplier.
It doesn't come from any official source. It is just a fan theory to explain how he cornered Cell with the Shin Kikoho.
It sounds more like that but that move is also used in the videogames to do a ridiculous amount of damage(Tenkaichi series for sure not sure about the ones later one RB and UT), that may also be why fans thought it had such a high multiplyer.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Piccolo Daimao » Thu Apr 19, 2012 5:05 pm

Angelus wrote:It probably would have been different if Tien right off-the-bat just went Tri Beam on Nappa when he arrived... and it hit Nappa.
He did try to twice, even before Chaozu died, but the first time, Nappa knocked him down and the second time (after Chaozu died), Piccolo suddenly appeared and struck out at him.
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Tekkaman-James » Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:16 pm

Kame-senin's Mafūba didn't miss, Piccolo Daimao was re-sealed and Ma Junior never was:

The 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai would have been much less interesting. Ma Junior would not have been a participant and, therefore, neither would have "Shen". Thus, the finals would probably end up being between Goku and Tenshinhan again, but likely with Goku irrefutably deating Tenshinhan this time.

When Radditz arrives, Goku, Kame-senin and Kuririn would be the ones to face him. Inevitably, whether Radditz is defeated or not, SOMEONE would die in the battle which would lead to one of the survivors mentioning the Dragon Balls (either as a way to wish back a fallen Goku, or how they couldn't be used to wish back a fallen Kuririn or Kame-senin). This would lead to Nappa and Vegeta heading for Earth. If Goku died, he would go off to train with Kaioh leaving Gohan to be trained by Kuririn and/or Kame-senin who would probably not be hard enough on him to get him to improve as much as needed for the coming fight. If Kame-senin or Kuririn died, Goku would end up training Gohan and still probably be too soft on him. Thus, when Nappa and Vegeta arrive, a Goku-less gang won't be able to hold off Nappa long enough for Goku to return OR a Goku-led gang would result in a Goku who doesn't know the Kaioh-ken or the Genki-dama meaning that Vegeta (with or without Nappa) would defeat the gang and force one of the stragglers to help him locate the Dragon Balls and wish for immortality. Side Note: Vegeta, fearing that others might use the Dragon Balls as he did, might end up tracking down Kami and killing him to destroy the Dragon Balls. He would be surprised that the God of Earth is a Namekian, but the only person around to hear him would be Mr. Popo (who, additionally, might end up being killed by Vegeta by trying to protect Kami).

Now, immortal, Vegeta would return to Freeza's ship and lay waste to him and his army as revenge for essentially wiping out the Saiya-jin race. He would then, presumably, take over the operation OR spend the rest of his time tracking down every last remnant of Freeza's forces across the cosmos. Of course, he'd probably make a pit-stop on Planet Namek to kill Saichoro and negate the powers of their Dragon Balls as well.

There would be no Super Saiya-jins. Trunks would never be born. The androids would never need to be created and/or awakened. There would be no Cell Games. Goten would never be born.

Babidi would arrive in his attempt to reawaken Buu. OPTION 1: Due to Vegeta not being on Earth, he could not possess him and gain enough energy to "hatch" Buu. End. OPTION 2: Babidi possesses enough other, lesser powerful Earthlings to eventually "hatch" Buu in a quantity vs. quality approach. Buu still meets Mr. Satan and expels his evil side from his body. After consuming him, Evil Buu easily becomes the strongest person on Earth. With no one to oppose him, he would take over the Earth OR pull a "Cell" and start absorbing any and all Earthlings he comes across in an attempt to make himself stronger in another quantity vs. quality approach.

Eventually, Vegeta would end up defeating Buu either because Buu's power becomes great enough for him to notice and return to Earth to deal with it OR because Buu's hunger for power leads to him leaving Earth in search of more "food". Uub would never be born (or, at least, not with the essence of Buu within him).

Pilaf can't collect the Black Star Balls due to Kami being dead and, therefore, never re-fusing with Piccolo Daimao. He may, instead, attempt to re-release Piccolo Daimao (assuming he was never re-released by someone else to try to deal with the threat of Vegeta or Buu), but with no Dragon Balls, Piccolo Daimao's influence could never spread beyond the decimated planet Earth. And, if it ever did, he would have to deal with the immortal Vegeta.

Bebi would either be straight-up deated by the immortal Vegeta OR he would successfully possess Vegeta, but to no real end as there are no Dragon Balls for him to wish his planet back with. Similarly, the Evil Shenlong would never happen as all of the Dragon Balls have been destoryed. The immortal Vegeta-sama OR the immortal Bebi-Vegeta-sama would live happily ever after. :P
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by OzzyApu » Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:48 pm

Tekka-James, that doesn't sound so bad for an alternate universe, right? :lol:

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Tekkaman-James » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:13 pm

OzzyApu wrote:Tekka-James, that doesn't sound so bad for an alternate universe, right? :lol:
Are you kidding?!? Have you seen my avatar? A world with no Piccolo?!? :cry:
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by OzzyApu » Sun Apr 29, 2012 3:04 pm

Tekkaman-James wrote:
OzzyApu wrote:Tekka-James, that doesn't sound so bad for an alternate universe, right? :lol:
Are you kidding?!? Have you seen my avatar? A world with no Piccolo?!? :cry:
Well I'm looking at it in terms of the fate of the universe. I think sacrificing Piccolo's existence for some shoddy alt. uni like that is probably worth it. :|

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by The Tori-bot » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:30 pm

DB is the kind of series where, if you take just one character out of the equation, no matter how insignificant, everything changes and everyone ends up dead.

E.g. Umigame: no bumping into Umigame = no meeting Kame-sen'nin, no training, no Kamehameha... and the planet is boned when Raditz shows up.

Nail: no distracting Freeza long enough to revive Piccolo, nobody strong enough to fight Freeza even if Piccolo was resurrected, and everyone is killed, including Kami, so everyone stays dead since there's no Earth Dragon Balls, and thus no Namekian Dragon Balls since Saichoro can't be revived teleported off of the planet before Freeza destroys it.

Mouse in pirate cave: no mouse scuttling across the floor scaring General Blue, our heroes lack the distraction needed to make it out alive, and with no Goku, Kuririn and Bulma around, plus no Dragon Radar for anyone else to find the Dragon Balls and wish them back... you get the idea.

Appule:

...

Uh...

... God damn it.
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Fox666 » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:32 pm

Without Appule, Freeza would not find out that Vegeta attacked a village and order Zarbon to check if he was still alive. That would be quite a problem.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by OzzyApu » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:34 pm

Fox666 wrote:Without Appule, Freeza would not find out that Vegeta attacked a village and order Zarbon to check if he was still alive. That would be quite a problem.
That was some yellow dude. Appule was the purple, spotted-headed guy that Vegeta fried after he got beat up by Zarbon and brought back.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Fox666 » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:35 pm

In the manga Appule and Zarbon are the only ones alive besides Freeza...

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by ChahikoDBZ » Tue May 01, 2012 5:12 am

I still think Goku would have found a way to defeat Raditz on his own. Probably would have seeked help from some of his friends though. Such as Tienshinhan or Kuririn.
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Tue May 01, 2012 3:15 pm

Tekkaman-James wrote: There would be no Super Saiya-jins. Trunks would never be born. The androids would never need to be created and/or awakened.
I think #17 and #18 would still have been made since Dr. Gero wanted revenge on Goku. I think they would have been weaker but Goku and the others could still defeated them if Goku and the others don't killed by Radditz. Cell would be a lot weaker too due to him not having cells of Nappa, Vegeta, Freeza and King Cold.
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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Piccolo Daimao » Tue May 01, 2012 4:08 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:Cell would be a lot weaker too due to him not having cells of Nappa, Vegeta, Freeza and King Cold.
Just want to correct you there by mentioning that, in the manga, Cell was only ever said to contain the cells of Son Gokuu, Piccolo, Vegeta, Freeza, King Cold and various other life-forms (probably insects and stuff, judging by his appearance). Presumably, Nappa's not included in that, otherwise he would've been named and/or not lumped with the "life-forms", which isn't what you normally refer to a human as.
Holden Caulfield in [b][i]The Catcher in the Rye[/i][/b] wrote:I hope to hell when I do die somebody has sense enough to just dump me in the river or something. Anything except sticking me in a goddam cemetery. People coming and putting a bunch of flowers on your stomach on Sunday, and all that crap. Who wants flowers when you're dead? Nobody.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Fox666 » Tue May 01, 2012 4:23 pm

It's not presumably, he actually says he didn't use Trunks's cells because he already had "too many saiyans".

This picture shows all of Cell's parts:

Image

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Piccolo Daimao » Tue May 01, 2012 4:27 pm

Fox666 wrote:It's not presumably, he actually says he didn't use Trunks's cells because he already had "too many saiyans".

This picture shows all of Cell's parts:

http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h44 ... _small.png
Yes, that's right, which only further proves my point. So Cell only had the cells of Gokuu, Piccolo, Vegeta, Freeza, King Cold and a bunch of insignificant life-forms, like bugs and stuff. Cell and/or the Cell Juniors using techniques like the Kikouhou is entirely filler, and part of the anime, not the manga.
Holden Caulfield in [b][i]The Catcher in the Rye[/i][/b] wrote:I hope to hell when I do die somebody has sense enough to just dump me in the river or something. Anything except sticking me in a goddam cemetery. People coming and putting a bunch of flowers on your stomach on Sunday, and all that crap. Who wants flowers when you're dead? Nobody.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Tue May 01, 2012 4:38 pm

Piccolo Daimao wrote:Cell and/or the Cell Juniors using techniques like the Kikouhou is entirely filler, and part of the anime, not the manga.
Cell also did Kuririn's Kienzan & Tenshinhan's Shishin no Ken. So Cell additionally has Kuririn's & Tenshinhan's cells in the anime.
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Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Majin Boo » Tue May 01, 2012 4:42 pm

Is the "Kienzan" really from Kuririn? I forget if Goku did, but I'm pretty sure Vegeta used something just like it, and Freeza definitely did.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Tue May 01, 2012 4:47 pm

Majin Boo wrote:Is the "Kienzan" really from Kuririn? I forget if Goku did, but I'm pretty sure Vegeta used something just like it, and Freeza definitely did.
The Kienzan Cell did were Kuririn's for sure. Goku first did Kienzan in Boo arc (and movie #3 but smaller) and Vegeta's was smaller too. Frieza's was purple, not yellow.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: What if Roshi's Mafūba didn't miss?

Post by Piccolo Daimao » Tue May 01, 2012 5:07 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
Piccolo Daimao wrote:Cell and/or the Cell Juniors using techniques like the Kikouhou is entirely filler, and part of the anime, not the manga.
Cell also did Kuririn's Kienzan & Tenshinhan's Shishin no Ken. So Cell additionally has Kuririn's & Tenshinhan's cells in the anime.
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Holden Caulfield in [b][i]The Catcher in the Rye[/i][/b] wrote:I hope to hell when I do die somebody has sense enough to just dump me in the river or something. Anything except sticking me in a goddam cemetery. People coming and putting a bunch of flowers on your stomach on Sunday, and all that crap. Who wants flowers when you're dead? Nobody.

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