Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

[Scarz]

Hm, Trunks seems to be going in and out of his form.

[AquaTeamV3]

Looks like he can go in and out of USSJ at will. Sounds good in theory, but I wonder how much energy he's burning in the process.

[Rostir]

WAT

[JulieYBM]

So, I was...on the point. Hoho~!

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Nice trick, but shouldn't this consume energy just by transforming?

[CaBrPi]

Nice trick, but shouldn't this consume energy just by transforming?

Not if he's mastered the form, which is what it looks like.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Nice trick, but shouldn't this consume energy just by transforming?

Not if he's mastered the form, which is what it looks like.

Yeah, I guess.

[Gyt Kaliba]

Huh. Well that's an interesting strategy Trunks has got. I don't think it'll be enough to take down Vegeta, but it's certainly keeping his father on edge at least.

[batistabus]

It'd be cool if he discovered a Speed form of Super Saiyan. Since the form that Vegeta, Trunks, and Goku discovered leading up to the battle with Cell sacrificed speed for power, I don't think it would be out of the question for a high speed low power form.

[Insertclevername]

Not to sound cynical or over critical but Trunk's movements look really stiff and bland. He looks like he is just failing his sword around like a toy.

[dario03]

It'd be cool if he discovered a Speed form of Super Saiyan. Since the form that Vegeta, Trunks, and Goku discovered leading up to the battle with Cell sacrificed speed for power, I don't think it would be out of the question for a high speed low power form.

That would be cool and if he did that then it could almost make sense for him and Vegeta to have a close fight. Because even if they some how write USS Trunks as stronger/slower than SS2 Vegeta and FPSS Trunks as being close in speed/strength as FPSS Vegeta he would still be quite a bit slower than SS2 Vegeta in either form.

[rereboy]

Nice trick, but shouldn't this consume energy just by transforming?

Has it been ever stated that going in and out of a specific form of SSJ burns a lot of energy? Or that going in and out of a form actually burns more energy than just staying in that form for a while?
As far as I can tell, the only thing mentioned is that mastered SSJ is much more efficient regarding energy than non mastered SSJ. No more than that.

It seems that Trunks probably mastered his SSJ (given the fact that spent 10 years training and that he is not THAT far behind SSJ2 Vegeta) but still uses his USSJ when he needs a boost in power. And by using it only when its convenient and then going back to SSJ right after, he pretty much neutralizes the disadvantages of the form.
I guess that for someone who doesn't have SSJ2, this strategy is the next best thing.

[Saiga]

SS1 Trunks being able to put the pressure on SS2 Vegeta? Yeah, bullshit.

[rereboy]

SS1 Trunks being able to put the pressure on SS2 Vegeta? Yeah, bullshit.

Well, Vegeta said he wouldn't mind holding back and we still don't know if he is actually holding back or not despite being in his SSJ2 (and if he is, just how much).

Also, Trunks in his SSJ1 is attacking only with his sword (and not directly) and Vegeta isn't taking a very offensive posture, just dodging Trunks' sword and attacks.

Btw, in the next pages its still not clear if Vegeta is holding back or not so it will be a while till there is a answer to that question (if there is one).

[Saiga]

SS1 Trunks being able to put the pressure on SS2 Vegeta? Yeah, bullshit.

Well, Vegeta said he wouldn't mind holding back and we still don't know if he is actually holding back or not despite being in his SSJ2 (and if he is, just how much).

Also, Trunks in his SSJ1 is attacking only with his sword (and not directly) and Vegeta isn't taking a very offensive posture, just dodging Trunks' sword and attacks.

Btw, in the next pages its still not clear if Vegeta is holding back or not so it will be a while till there is a answer to that question (if there is one).

Why use SS2 in the first place if he's going to hold back? He should be significantly stronger than Trunks at even levels, as he's had more time to train and he trained harder.

Not to mention being much faster, and it looks like he's having difficulty just dodging him which he shouldn't be.

[rereboy]

Because, if Trunks mastered his SSJ, there shouldn't be much difference between them in their SSJ1 forms.

So, if Vegeta actually only fought with Trunks in his SSJ1, he would be holding himself a lot and turning this fight into a fight between two fighters pretty close in power. One fight that he might very realistically lose actually, if he only limited himself to that kind of power.

Like Vegeta said, he doesn't mind holding back (for his son) but not that much. So, he won't stop himself from using his SSJ2 on his son, but he might not be trying all that hard.

And yes, he should be faster than Trunks in his SSJ1, but like I said we still don't know if he is holding back or if he his trying his very best in terms of speed and power.

[Saiga]

Because, if Trunks mastered his SSJ, there shouldn't be much difference between them in their SSJ1 forms.

So, if Vegeta actually only fought with Trunks in his SSJ1, he would be holding himself a lot and turning this fight into a fight between two fighters pretty close in power. One fight that he might very realistically lose actually, if he only limited himself to that kind of power.

Like Vegeta said, he doesn't mind holding back (for his son) but not that much. So, he won't stop himself from using his SSJ2 on his son, but he might not be trying all that hard.

And yes, he should be faster than Trunks in his SSJ1, but like I said we still don't know if he is holding back or if he his trying his very best in terms of speed and power.

Why? Mastering SS1 doesn't cap you out. Vegeta has been training longer and harder, so there should be a considerable gap between their SS1 forms.

And I don't think he's holding back his speed because it looks like he's actually struggling to avoid his sword at the moment, so logically if he was actually scared of getting cut he'd automatically dodge faster.

[rereboy]

Depends on your interpretation.

You either think that there can be huge gains in power in base and in the SSJ forms and, for example, have a base Goku in the Buu saga that is much stronger than his SSJ self in Namek or himself in the Cell saga, or you think that there aren't gains in power that large in their base forms ans SSJ forms and, for example have a base Goku in the Buu saga that isn't stronger than himself in the Namek saga.

Both opinions are perfectly acceptable.

In DBM, Salagir has already admitted that in his opinion there aren't gains that large and that, for example, Goku wouldn't be stronger in his base than he is in his SSJ on Namek. Therefore, logically, in this DBM fight, if Trunks has SSJ perfectly mastered, Vegeta's SSJ1 shouldn't be much stronger. It should be comparable.

Btw, its pointless to argue which interpretation has more merit. They are both acceptable and that should be enough.

Also, I'm not seeing where Vegeta is "struggling". I'm not seeing him scared, sweating (as in with sweat drops), in panic or anything that could imply as such. We've seen characters (like Goku) actually seem to be struggling much more before actually starting to fight as hard as they can frequently in the manga and anime so...

[Saiga]

That's a huge discrepancy in Strength though. I don't believe Goku surpassed his Namek self, but that he still got much, much stronger (there's a lot of wiggle room between his base and SS1 form, given the 50x increase). And even small gaps in DBZ make a big difference, so there's no way Vegeta should need SS2 against someone weaker than him.

[rereboy]

That's a huge discrepancy in Strength though. I don't believe Goku surpassed his Namek self, but that he still got much, much stronger (there's a lot of wiggle room between his base and SS1 form, given the 50x increase). And even small gaps in DBZ make a big difference, so there's no way Vegeta should need SS2 against someone weaker than him.

Yes, but if we go by the theory that there are no HUGE gains, we can say that Trunks and Vegeta had already pushed their SSJ1 far by the time the Cell games happened since they were much better than they were at the start of the Cell saga.

The only ones even better than them at that time were Goku and Gohan with their completely mastered SSJ1.

So, following that theory of no HUGE gains, they couldn't have become THAT much better than Goku and Gohan at that time, since themselves had already pushed SSJ1 far (because, if they did, since they already had made that much progress themselves by that time, there really would be a huge gain).

So, in the years following the Cell saga, it would make sense for them to hit the limits of SSJ1 by completely mastering it (like Goku and Gohan) and also pushing its power.

So, if both of them reached that upper limit of SSj1 (following the theory), they must be close in power in their SSj1.

This would probably explain the need to actually discover new forms and transformations (to keep getting stronger).

Anyway, it makes sense to me.