The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[shonenhikada]

Isn't vegeta listed at that same PL, which would contradict him thinking he could beat freeza, seeing that he would have to have been stronger than third form freeza to stand a chance, and factor in a proportional power boost from Freeza going from second to third form.

Irrelevant. My power levels aren't official anyway, just a rough estimation. We know his second form is over 1,000,000, so his third form must be over 2,000,000, and Gohan launched a ki attack that pushed this Freeza back.

Anyway, Gohan really is almost 1000x stronger than Tenshinhan during the Freeza arc.

Point is, Tenshinhan should not be able to bridge that gap from simply training with Chiaotzu. Gohan had a super saiyan and Piccolo to spar with, plus he's saiyan.

that makes no sense. Gohan 1000x stronger than Tenshihan during the Freeza saga. On what basis a made up power level on where you think tien would be during the frieza saga. The point is irrelevant because by stating this I put a cap on where Freeza thid form PL, would be, which relevant if you want to start making calculations.

[dprez]

that makes no sense. Gohan 1000x stronger than Tenshihan during the Freeza saga. On what basis a made up power level on where you think Tenshinhan would be during the Freeza saga. The point is irrelevant because by stating this I put a cap on where Freeza thid form PL, would be, which relevant if you want to start making calculations.

You lost me. All I'm saying is that it's obvious Gohan is stronger than Tenshinhan during the Freeza arc. So when they both begin their training, Gohan has a head start, and also better training partners, and saiyan blood.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

The last battle power number we got for (non-raged) Gohan was 200.000 during the battle with Freeza. Tenshinhan's last battle power number was 1.830 during Saiyan arc, and all he did was running through the Serpentine Road for about 10 days, and then training on Kaio for 5 days until the battle with Freeza. I don't think that 10 days running & 5 days training can give a very big boost.

Here are the complete official battle powers, BTW: http://www.kanzentai.com/bp.php?id=list

[shonenhikada]

that makes no sense. Gohan 1000x stronger than Tenshihan during the Freeza saga. On what basis a made up power level on where you think Tenshinhan would be during the Freeza saga. The point is irrelevant because by stating this I put a cap on where Freeza thid form PL, would be, which relevant if you want to start making calculations.

You lost me. All I'm saying is that it's obvious Gohan is stronger than Tenshinhan during the Freeza arc. So when they both begin their training, Gohan has a head start, and also better training partners, and saiyan blood.

Gohan is stronger than Tien during the freeza saga, and so was Goku relative to Vegeta. The gap between gohan and Tien while Gohan is calm was about 2-3x, while that of Goku and Vegeta was 100x+ yet with 3 years of training goku and Vegeta are practically equals by the android arc. Hell Trunks is now inferior to vegeta by this arc and he was 100+x stronger than vegeta. Using past PL to determine someones relation in the following arc is not a good way to go about things.

[shonenhikada]

The last battle power number we got for (non-raged) Gohan was 200.000 during the battle with Freeza. Tenshinhan's last battle power number was 1.830 during Saiyan arc, and all he did was running through the Serpentine Road for about 10 days, and then training on Kaio for 5 days until the battle with Freeza. I don't think that 10 days running & 5 days training can give a very big boost.

When was it stated they took 5 days of training and 10 days of running ?

Also if piccolo could make enough gains on king kai during the same time frame for Nails to be impressed by his power level, and thought he could help change the batle against freeza,why not the humans making similar gains. Then factor in Tien spending 6 more months of extra training on Kai,then factor in having a sparing partner helps boost your power level even higher than if training alone and you've got one hell of a way to close the gap.

Overall
Yamcha spends 130 days on King Kai, factor in he has a sparring partner (tien) would mean he would make serious gains over those days than goku who trained along; reference to their preparation for the saiyans where they all come 5x stronger than Goku did in 1 year, than Goku did in 3 YEARS during the piccolo jr arc.

Tien spends 270 days on King kai, and would have made serious gains as well. Possibly becoming way more powerful and suprpassing Son gohan at this point.

Dragon ball is plot based. Humans get power boost appropriate to the relative gain of other characters so that their relationship is the same unless plot demands it to change. So if Goku = 10, Vegeta=8, Piccolo =7, Tien=6, Yamcha =5, Krillin=4.

--

[Piccolo Daimao]

Tenshinhan vs Son Gohan

Both of them are from Artificial Humans arc. Who wins?

Gohan, obviously. He's a half-Saiyan prodigy who can get stronger through rage and has been training with Super Saiyan Gokuu and Piccolo. Meanwhile, Tenshinhan is an Earthling, is even weaker than Kuririn because he hasn't received the Great Elder's power-up, and his only sparring partner's Chaozu.

[FNF]

All sarcasm aside, I don't see how people can just come to that conclusion based off of Gohan being stronger than Ten almost 5 YEARS before the Android arc.

Well, Gohan was over a hundred times stronger than Tenshinhan during Freeza arc, and Gohan trained hard those 3 years with Super Saiyan Goku & Piccolo, while Tenshinhan was training for 5 years with... Chaozu. Plus, Gohan is a Saiyan. So I think that Gohan wins this.

& @dprez

Considering it's suggested Piccolo had broken the 250,000 mark (at the very, very least >42,000) in the 1st week of Kaio's training, I wouldn't be surprised if Ten was at the level he was in the Ginyu filler (>100,000).
So 100x stronger? I don't see it.
Then when you consider the amount of time he spent on Kaio's on the whole and then training on Earth while Gohan is studying? I REALLY don't see it.

@Piccolo, so you don't buy the suggestion that 2x Piccolo (post 1 weeks training)>530,000?

[Rocketman]

Piccolo post-King Kai was around 10-12 thousand at best.

[Kaboom]

Even plot-inspired power boosts always have some sort of internal logic to them.

If there's actually a "what" given in regards to someone's power, there's always going to be a halfway-believable "how" behind it.

[Fox666]

Considering it's suggested Piccolo had broken the 250,000 mark (at the very, very least >42,000) in the 1st week of Kaio's training, I wouldn't be surprised if Ten was at the level he was in the Ginyu filler (>100,000).

Even if Piccolo was stronger than Nail, why would you think he would be that strong? When he landed on Namek, he sensed Freeza's supressed Ki and called him a "monster". And Freeza power was enough to convince him to merge with Nail, something he didn't wanted to do.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

When was it stated they took 5 days of training and 10 days of running ?

Well, I made a mistake there. They were running for 10 days + a month. Ten days passed from the battle with the Saiyans to the day Gohan, Kuririn & Bulma started their trip to Namek, and it took them 1 month to arrive. The same day they arrived on Namek, Goku took off for Namek too, and at the same day, Piccolo & co. arrived at Kaio. Then, it took Goku 5 days to arrive on Namek, and in those 5 days Piccolo & co. were training on Kaio. The rest of the events happened in one day.

Considering it's suggested Piccolo had broken the 250,000 mark (at the very, very least >42,000) in the 1st week of Kaio's training

When was that again?

[FNF]

@Rocket, Kaboom, Fox, DBZ

Context: the Great Elder reads Kuririn’s mind and learns of God and Piccolo.
Great Elder: “He diminished by half the genius power with which he was gifted at birth!”

As far as Nail knows at least, if he merged with God it would be a 2x boost.


Nail: “I-I’m astonished…I don’t know what kind of training you’ve done, but you’ve acquired unbelievable power…Still, it’s unfortunate…If you had only returned to the original, single Namekian you were, you might have been able to defeat even Freeza…”
Piccolo: “Are you saying that if I merged with God once again, my power would even surpass Freeza!?”
Nail: “Th-that’s right"

2x Piccolo(pre merge)>Freeza (1st form.)

It's quite simple really.

If Piccolo was > 250,000 then Ten could easily be ~/>100,000 as the filler shows.

[Saiga]

Because that couldn't possible refer to splitting into two people at all.

[dprez]

Even plot-inspired power boosts always have some sort of internal logic to them.

If there's actually a "what" given in regards to someone's power, there's always going to be a halfway-believable "how" behind it.

Sounds to me like if Nail was so shocked at Piccolo's power, it had to be something special. Greater than even his own full power, possibly, but Piccolo could've simply had a power higher than any other warrior namekian Nail had ever seen. Piccolo did get much stronger after he died. This is certain. All we know is that he was able to become more powerful than Freeza's second form after he merged with a 42,000 Nail.

[Saiga]

Even plot-inspired power boosts always have some sort of internal logic to them.

If there's actually a "what" given in regards to someone's power, there's always going to be a halfway-believable "how" behind it.

Sounds to me like if Nail was so shocked at Piccolo's power, it had to be something special. Greater than even his own full power, possibly, but Piccolo could've simply had a power higher than any other warrior namekian Nail had ever seen. Piccolo did get much stronger after he died. This is certain. All we know is that he was able to become more powerful than Freeza's second form after he merged with a 42,000 Nail.

And given that we have no idea how Namekian fusion works, he could have been just as strong as he is in the Saiyan arc and still have the same result.

[FNF]

Because that couldn't possible refer to splitting into two people at all.

Yeah because he totally doesn't refer to power

[mysticboy]

Tapion vs. Kibitokai

[FNF]

Tapion vs. Kibitokai

Tapion's ocarina>>>Kaioshin (post merge)

Kaioshin wasn't even that strong so I doubt he'd be able to escape.

[Fox666]

Context: the Great Elder reads Kuririn’s mind and learns of God and Piccolo.
Great Elder: “He diminished by half the genius power with which he was gifted at birth!”

As far as Nail knows at least, if he merged with God it would be a 2x boost.

You are taking it too literally. And fusions don't work like that.

[Kaboom]

Tapion vs. Kibitokai

Hard to tell. We never got good power estimates for either of them beyond a generic "amazing ki" for Tapion and merged Kaioshin still being too weak to be any good against Boo.

But just based on my own estimates, I'd say Kaioshin.