Why do Broly fan boys overestimate his power so much ? Can anyone shed light as to why they treat him different than any other sayians sure his psychologically more violent and crazy but that's about it.
Is there any concrete evidence suggesting his better than a regular Saiyan in terms of zenkai and gaining power ?
Overestimation of Broly's power ?
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Monkey D Goku
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Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear Leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering - Yoda
I use to be a adventurer like you,till I took an arrow in the knee - Generic Skyrim Guard
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Simply because he's their favorite character. This is just how many fans act like with their favorite character. They even go as far as making up official quotes from Toriyama (even characters not made by Toriyama) to support their opinion, and this happens everyday.Why do Broly fan boys overestimate his power so much ? Can anyone shed light as to why they treat him different than any other sayians sure his psychologically more violent and crazy but that's about it.
Well by being the legendary Super Saiyan, that makes him more than just that, at least, right? The details of his different power aren't very clear, but he must have some pretty different qualities than just a "regular" saiyan. That was the whole point.Is there any concrete evidence suggesting his better than a regular Saiyan in terms of zenkai and gaining power ?
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Darkprince410
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Three pieces of "evidence" I see people use to suggest that Broly is overly strong are as follows:
1) Misinterpreting the opening scene of movie 8 with the Southern Galaxy being destroyed. I see many that suggest that the destruction shown is instantaneous, that rather than the several years of time that we see that it took for him to destroy the galaxy (as shown in Paragus's flashbacks), Broly wiped it out with a single action. If Broly had indeed done so, that'd put him several times more powerful than Cell's maximum strength, since he only was able to boast the strength to destroy the Solar System.
2) Funimation's changing of the line "My ki is rising! It's overflowing!". After his initial defeat of the Z Senshi (but just before Piccolo's arrival), Broly starts showing signs of increased pain and stress, and in the original Japanese version, he suggests that his body has reached its physical limit but his ki is continuing to increase, threatening to kill him if he didn't expel the excess. In the dub, the line was changed to "Growing stronger! Yes, much stronger!" That line seemingly takes away the limitation of his body established in the original dialogue.
3) The amount of ki Goku takes from Vegeta and the others. A lot of people suggest that Goku took all their Super Saiya-jin ki and Piccolo's ki for his counterattack against Broly, seemingly ignoring the fact that none of the Saiya-jin transform and they were all badly injured at the time, thusly unable to donate anywhere near as much power as some people suggest he did.
1) Misinterpreting the opening scene of movie 8 with the Southern Galaxy being destroyed. I see many that suggest that the destruction shown is instantaneous, that rather than the several years of time that we see that it took for him to destroy the galaxy (as shown in Paragus's flashbacks), Broly wiped it out with a single action. If Broly had indeed done so, that'd put him several times more powerful than Cell's maximum strength, since he only was able to boast the strength to destroy the Solar System.
2) Funimation's changing of the line "My ki is rising! It's overflowing!". After his initial defeat of the Z Senshi (but just before Piccolo's arrival), Broly starts showing signs of increased pain and stress, and in the original Japanese version, he suggests that his body has reached its physical limit but his ki is continuing to increase, threatening to kill him if he didn't expel the excess. In the dub, the line was changed to "Growing stronger! Yes, much stronger!" That line seemingly takes away the limitation of his body established in the original dialogue.
3) The amount of ki Goku takes from Vegeta and the others. A lot of people suggest that Goku took all their Super Saiya-jin ki and Piccolo's ki for his counterattack against Broly, seemingly ignoring the fact that none of the Saiya-jin transform and they were all badly injured at the time, thusly unable to donate anywhere near as much power as some people suggest he did.
Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Toei Punch has infinite power, it pratically uses toonforce.
But I don't really think the animation team took in account whenever they are Super Saiyans or not when they donated energy.
But I don't really think the animation team took in account whenever they are Super Saiyans or not when they donated energy.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
I have heard people saying that Broli is stronger because he is the Legendary Super Saiyan, and well, he is Legendary. So this somehow makes him the strongest being by default, following Vegeta's logic... 
However, I don't get what Broli means by the line "My ki is rising! It's overflowing!". Is he really getting stronger as time passes, or his body is gathering ki automatically, keeping him at full power all the time?
However, I don't get what Broli means by the line "My ki is rising! It's overflowing!". Is he really getting stronger as time passes, or his body is gathering ki automatically, keeping him at full power all the time?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Darkprince410
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
I took it as his body has a set maximum amount of ki it can "hold", whereupon if his ki grows any higher than that maximum amount, he could explode or at least die from the strain. This is hinted at by the fact that, as he was saying the line, he was breathing heavily and the tone of his voice suggested he was in a fair amount of pain. Later, after he rose into the air and released a volley of ki blasts at no apparent target, he seemed to not be in pain anymore, which suggested to me that he had expelled a large amount of that excess and his ki was now back in safe limits.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:I have heard people saying that Broli is stronger because he is the Legendary Super Saiyan, and well, he is Legendary. So this somehow makes him the strongest being by default, following Vegeta's logic...
However, I don't get what Broli means by the line "My ki is rising! It's overflowing!". Is he really getting stronger as time passes, or his body is gathering ki automatically, keeping him at full power all the time?
Think of it like a balloon being filled with water. There's a safe limit to how much water that balloon could contain before it might break, but if you exceed that safe limit, it might hold on for a bit longer, but eventually if more water continues to flow into it, it's going to eventually burst. Expelling those ki blasts would be the equivalent of pouring out a good deal of water once it started reaching that unsafe area, to where it would once again be safe to pour water into it again.
I think his ki intake has no limit, but his body has capacity limitations that keep his strength from just continuing to grow unchecked.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
This could work nicely if Toriyama hadn't say this:
So, according to Toriyama, you can raise your ki by meditating or by doing image training, which increases your muscle power. That's exactly what happens to Broli, but instead of meditation or image training, he was just standing doing nothing but torturing Goku & co.Herms wrote:It also says his image training/meditation was a means to raise his maximum ki, as muscle training has a limit. Toriyama mentioned there being limits to how much training your muscles could do and needing ki to overcome that limit in the book's interview.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
I think he meant that you need Ki to increase you overall strength, not the muscles.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
But isn't the overall strength composed of ki & muscle power (at least mainly)?Fox666 wrote:I think he meant that you need Ki to increase you overall strength, not the muscles.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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CaptainKatsura
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
No, in my opinion, overall strength is composed of three elements of ki (I don't remember how they are called specifically). I think Toriyama explicitly stated that ki is the only way to get stronger after your body reach a physical peak, but correct me if I'm wrong
On topic though. I know movies are so not canon in hurts, but I can handwave something for sheer fun.
I rate Broly between supressed Cell (the one that fought Goku) and full power Cell (powered up to the max, but before Zenkai). If he was at least as strong as the latter, Goku could just grab energy from others and beat his ass, so must be stronger than Broly. And even after Zenkai, Broly is defeated by out of shape Gohan SSJ2 and the kids who are probably not as strong as SSJs suring Cell Games, at least before they entered RoTaS.
On topic though. I know movies are so not canon in hurts, but I can handwave something for sheer fun.
I rate Broly between supressed Cell (the one that fought Goku) and full power Cell (powered up to the max, but before Zenkai). If he was at least as strong as the latter, Goku could just grab energy from others and beat his ass, so must be stronger than Broly. And even after Zenkai, Broly is defeated by out of shape Gohan SSJ2 and the kids who are probably not as strong as SSJs suring Cell Games, at least before they entered RoTaS.
Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Broly is that kind of character..People either hate him, or love him. The problem is that the Broly lovers outnumber he haters..
Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
It's also funny how Broli's power is usually either overestimated OR underestimated. Putting him on par with SSJ3 Goku or something surely isn't good, but calling him weak only because of Toei Punch is just as bad.
He beats everyone to a pulp - he gets overestimated.
He gets beaten in some weird way - he gets underestimated.
Can't he be in the middle?
He beats everyone to a pulp - he gets overestimated.
He gets beaten in some weird way - he gets underestimated.
Can't he be in the middle?
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Personally, I have Movie 8 LSS Broli a little above Cell arc SS2 Gohan, and Movie 10 LSS Broli between Boo arc SS2 & SS3 Goku.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Ketchup_Revenge
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
In the first Broly movie, I don't see any evidence that really puts him much above Pre-Zenkai Cell. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because of his speed, but speed doesn't necessarily mean higher power level, and neither does raw physical power.
Cell transformed to maximize his physical power in the heat of the moment during his fight with Gohan, and Gohan still kicked the crap out of him rather effortlessly, causing him crippling damage. Goku got raped by Broly in movie 8, but I don't think he would've faired much better against buff Cell in the raw power department.
Cell transformed to maximize his physical power in the heat of the moment during his fight with Gohan, and Gohan still kicked the crap out of him rather effortlessly, causing him crippling damage. Goku got raped by Broly in movie 8, but I don't think he would've faired much better against buff Cell in the raw power department.
I wipe it off the tile, the light is brighter this time, everything is 3D blasphemy.
My eyes are red and gold, the hair is standing straight up, this is not the way I picture me.
I can't control my shakes, how the hell did I get here? Something about this, so very wrong.
I have to laugh out loud, I wish I didn't like this. Is it a dream or a memory?
My eyes are red and gold, the hair is standing straight up, this is not the way I picture me.
I can't control my shakes, how the hell did I get here? Something about this, so very wrong.
I have to laugh out loud, I wish I didn't like this. Is it a dream or a memory?
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Monkey D Goku
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
I think his cool but I see some fans say he could easily kill Buu or Cell and in just makes me go crazy as to how they get these ideas in their heads.Dabooyaka wrote:Broly is that kind of character..People either hate him, or love him. The problem is that the Broly lovers outnumber he haters..
Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear Leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering - Yoda
I use to be a adventurer like you,till I took an arrow in the knee - Generic Skyrim Guard
I use to be a adventurer like you,till I took an arrow in the knee - Generic Skyrim Guard
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Haji
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Yes Thank You. Most people don't see it but it is there. In movie 8 Broli was able to easily able to fight two FP SSJ, two grade 2 SSJ and a Super Namekian. Oh and the "Toei punch" was because the movie had to end sometime. See, at the time Toei didn't know Broli would be popular for a 2nd movie I think if they did know they would have had Goku finish Broli with some thing else.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Personally, I have Movie 8 LSS Broli a little above Cell arc SS2 Gohan, and Movie 10 LSS Broli between Boo arc SS2 & SS3 Goku.
And yeah, movie 10 Broli may be that powerful. He took a punch to the face from SSJ2 Gohan like it was nothing.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Yeah, maybe Broli isn't as powerful as YouTubers make him, but he was fucking powerful in his eras.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
I think putting him above SS2 Goku or Vegeta is an overestimation of his abilities. If he could over power Vegeta he probably wouldn't have been left out of the movie. 
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Broli was too much for SS2 Gohan to handle. He couldn't even make him bleed. Besides, I can't imagine SS2 Goku & Vegeta to be powerful by that much. It's way too much.
Besides, when the movie was released, SS2 Vegeta wasn't shown yet, which is probably the reason he was left out. But then again, they had Dende as Kami before it was even revealed in the manga, so who knows why there was no Vegeta?
Besides, when the movie was released, SS2 Vegeta wasn't shown yet, which is probably the reason he was left out. But then again, they had Dende as Kami before it was even revealed in the manga, so who knows why there was no Vegeta?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Overestimation of Broly's power ?
Cause he'd stomp Broli into nothingness. 
Broli got beaten by a pair (or trio) of Super Saiyans, I think it's a stretch to say he's up there with Goku and Vegeta just because he could beat up a rusty Gohan.
Broli got beaten by a pair (or trio) of Super Saiyans, I think it's a stretch to say he's up there with Goku and Vegeta just because he could beat up a rusty Gohan.
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!