Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[Mjb1985]

Well I guess he's going with the logic that

Uub / Base Goku > Good Buu

Which would result in you having a huge number for Goku.

[TheMightyOzaru]

No way Goku has a base power of over 18 trillion.

Its certainly possible. Based on the fact that Goku said Uub was everything he expected I would imagine Uub is just as strong as Kid Buu. If that is the case, base Goku is stronger than Kid Buu since Uub is just as strong as Kid Buu. I also believe Ki gets a lot bigger with time. That theory is certainly supported by the fact that its stated that power levels became immeasurable after Namek. Furthermore almost all of these are calculated with simple formulas. In the Saiyan arc, characters got around a 2.36x boost in a year with training partners. I think Ki gets 2-5x stronger per year of spar training depending on how intense said training was. If its average traditional training you get 1.5-2x stronger every year. If its minimal traditional training you get 1.1-1.3x stronger per year. Now you might be think well fine if you get 2x stronger with say 3 years of training you should only get 6x stronger. Well you would be wrong. Ki growth would actually be exponential. If you get 2x stronger 1 year you are going to get 2x stronger than that the next year. That means you would get 8x stronger. As you can imagine, intense training would yield rather large results.

[Mjb1985]

Personally I wouldn't try to figure out a specific formula for power gains. At the end of the day, they are as strong as the plot dictates. There are numerous examples where one would logically think said character would receive this boost according to previous logic, but it just doesn't happen. And even if you did it that way, you would have to account for the characters reaching their limits for the time period and factor that in as well.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Personally I wouldn't try to figure out a specific formula for power gains. At the end of the day, they are as strong as the plot dictates. There are numerous examples where one would logically think said character would receive this boost according to previous logic, but it just doesn't happen. And even if you did it that way, you would have to account for the characters reaching their limits for the time period and factor that in as well.

Well this has worked for me so far so I dont see why this wouldnt work. Numerous examples? Share them, I have yet to come across any such problem. Furthermore these limit walls are broken through training so I dont see why this would be a problem when calculating power levels.

[Mjb1985]

Well for example Piccolo's gains on Kaio's planet in 6 days would seem to go against all logic.

Also, Vegeta in the Androids Saga mentions limits that he had reached as well.

As you can see they spend a lot of time trying to surpass the Super Saiyan , as if they got stuck for a while. Just regular training isn't going to cut it, they had to find a completely new way.

At least in my opinion of course.

Care to elaborate how your system would work regarding logic based boosts off of training times?

[TheMightyOzaru]

King Kai's training is a special type of training. While Piccolo might have done little training with King Kai himself, the mere sight/knowledge of his training could have helped him out. Furthermore we dont know 100% what his level was after training with King Kai. That limit could very well be pertaining to Super Saiyan not his base limits. Its very clear that they break down these limits all the time. Yes this temporary block could slow down the increase process but only by a little. They seem to be capable of finding a way over the wall within a year at most. Plus a wall could increase training effort eliminating any sort of slow down in the increase. Training times? You are gonna have to be a little more specific. I just have a simple system: Yearly increase with a partner is a 2-5x increase depending on the effort, a yearly increase of average standard training is a 1.5-2x increase depending on effort and a yearly increase of minimal standard training is a 1.1-1.3x increase depending on effort. Yeah you kind of have to guess how much effort a character puts in every year but then calculating power levels is a guessing game anyway .

[Perfect]

No way Goku has a base power of over 18 trillion.

Its certainly possible. Based on the fact that Goku said Uub was everything he expected I would imagine Uub is just as strong as Kid Buu. If that is the case, base Goku is stronger than Kid Buu since Uub is just as strong as Kid Buu. I also believe Ki gets a lot bigger with time. That theory is certainly supported by the fact that its stated that power levels became immeasurable after Namek. Furthermore almost all of these are calculated with simple formulas. In the Saiyan arc, characters got around a 2.36x boost in a year with training partners. I think Ki gets 2-5x stronger per year of spar training depending on how intense said training was. If its average traditional training you get 1.5-2x stronger every year. If its minimal traditional training you get 1.1-1.3x stronger per year. Now you might be think well fine if you get 2x stronger with say 3 years of training you should only get 6x stronger. Well you would be wrong. Ki growth would actually be exponential. If you get 2x stronger 1 year you are going to get 2x stronger than that the next year. That means you would get 8x stronger. As you can imagine, intense training would yield rather large results.

I highly doubt Oob was anywhere near Pure Boo's level, not even remotely close; not even GT with its psychotic battle powers implies that. I highly doubt even Goku's SSJ3 went anywhere near the trillions, billions sure, trillions hell no. There's no set exponential boost for chi, it varies extremely from each character to character, as well as plot devices. You're not accounting for confounding variables.

[dbzfan7]

I have a hard time on the whole Goku and Vegeta (EOZ) thing when they didn't gain much in 7 years besides transformations before Boo. They are described as above SSJ2 Kid Gohan, but not by much. Piccolo even comments on Majin Vegeta being possibly stronger then Gohan used to be. Goku wasn't that far behind Gohan (excluding SSJ2) during the Cell games since Gohan thought he would be stronger. So that means Goku must have been fighting evenly or rather close with Gohan during training. 7 years of afterlife training and Goku only really got stronger through transformations. He is only considered somewhat stronger then SSJ2 Kid Gohan after 7 years. So I would think 10 years without any transformations or special training to give a massive boost would lead to minimal growth.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Didnt gain much? he went from 3,000,000,000 to 50,000,000,000. Goku 10 years later was decided with 75,000,000,000(Zenkai after his fight with Buu) x 1.75^10. This came out to be over 20,000,000,000,000. a difference of 3 years is huge when Goku's power level is as big as it is at the start of the 10 years of training. Now I only did 3,000,000,000 x 1.5^7 when I calculated his Buu saga power level but thats only because Goku probably spent more time with SSJ2 and SSJ3 than he did with actual training. However even if I did make Goku's Buu saga power level bigger it would make everyone elses power level bigger as well. Gohan also recieved an anger boost during the Cell games. IMO, Gohan's power was 10x stronger than his normal SSJ2 form. So Gohan's SSJ2 form was 3,600,000,000,000 and SSJ2 Goku's in the Buu saga is 5,000,000,000,000 so I'm not contradicting anything.

[TheMightyOzaru]

No way Goku has a base power of over 18 trillion.

Its certainly possible. Based on the fact that Goku said Uub was everything he expected I would imagine Uub is just as strong as Kid Buu. If that is the case, base Goku is stronger than Kid Buu since Uub is just as strong as Kid Buu. I also believe Ki gets a lot bigger with time. That theory is certainly supported by the fact that its stated that power levels became immeasurable after Namek. Furthermore almost all of these are calculated with simple formulas. In the Saiyan arc, characters got around a 2.36x boost in a year with training partners. I think Ki gets 2-5x stronger per year of spar training depending on how intense said training was. If its average traditional training you get 1.5-2x stronger every year. If its minimal traditional training you get 1.1-1.3x stronger per year. Now you might be think well fine if you get 2x stronger with say 3 years of training you should only get 6x stronger. Well you would be wrong. Ki growth would actually be exponential. If you get 2x stronger 1 year you are going to get 2x stronger than that the next year. That means you would get 8x stronger. As you can imagine, intense training would yield rather large results.

I highly doubt Oob was anywhere near Pure Boo's level, not even remotely close; not even GT with its psychotic battle powers implies that. I highly doubt even Goku's SSJ3 went anywhere near the trillions, billions sure, trillions hell no. There's no set exponential boost for chi, it varies extremely from each character to character, as well as plot devices. You're not accounting for confounding variables.

First off Goku states Uub was as amazing as he thought he would be and since he is the reincarnation he has been waiting so long to fight I would assume he expected someone as strong as Kid Buu. No dramatic growth? Base Gohan was fighting SSJ trunks and stated Trunks would surpass him in a couple months. Furthermore Goku also makes a statement saying that Uub might beat Good Buu and Goku later replies with the amazing expectation quote implying he is at the very least above Good Buu and Goku was stronger. Actually GT implies Goku is stronger than Majin Buu in his base form. Funnily enough it doesn't specify which form so he could be stronger than Buuhan for all we know. Furthermore Uub is practically Goku's equal so he is definately above Pure Buu in GT. What confounding variables? I've been stufying power levels and Ki growth for quite a while now and my levels don't contradict anything from the Manga.

[Perfect]

First off Goku states Uub was as amazing as he thought he would be and since he is the reincarnation he has been waiting so long to fight I would assume he expected someone as strong as Kid Buu. No dramatic growth? Base Gohan was fighting SSJ trunks and stated Trunks would surpass him in a couple months. Furthermore Goku also makes a statement saying that Uub might beat Good Buu and Goku later replies with the amazing expectation quote implying he is at the very least above Good Buu and Goku was stronger.

'As amazing as he thought he'd be' by no means implies he's anywhere near Pure Boo. Base Gohan from what? The TV Special? Regardless, that means nothing. You're not accounting for confounding variables in any context. The latter of your sentiments has no citation, even though it blatantly requires such. I by no means in any of Z recall Goku ever saying anything of the sort in the context you're implying. Your numbers are too big, face the facts.

Didnt gain much? he went from 3,000,000,000 to 50,000,000,000. Goku 10 years later was decided with 75,000,000,000(Zenkai after his fight with Buu) x 1.75^10. This came out to be over 20,000,000,000,000. a difference of 3 years is huge when Goku's power level is as big as it is at the start of the 10 years of training. Now I only did 3,000,000,000 x 1.5^7 when I calculated his Buu saga power level but thats only because Goku probably spent more time with SSJ2 and SSJ3 than he did with actual training. However even if I did make Goku's Buu saga power level bigger it would make everyone elses power level bigger as well. Gohan also recieved an anger boost during the Cell games. IMO, Gohan's power was 10x stronger than his normal SSJ2 form. So Gohan's SSJ2 form was 3,600,000,000,000 and SSJ2 Goku's in the Buu saga is 5,000,000,000,000 so I'm not contradicting anything.

Those are your own made up numbers, they have no reverence to them actually gaining anything. Infallible logic doesn't work.

Actually GT implies Goku is stronger than Majin Buu in his base form. Funnily enough it doesn't specify which form so he could be stronger than Buuhan for all we know. Furthermore Uub is practically Goku's equal so he is definately above Pure Buu in GT. What confounding variables? I've been stufying power levels and Ki growth for quite a while now and my levels don't contradict anything from the Manga.

GT is illogical and full of plot holes--it has no basis for Z levels. Confounding variables such as plot devices utilized for the sake of getting stronger that revolve around circumstantial mediums.

[TheMightyOzaru]

First off Goku states Uub was as amazing as he thought he would be and since he is the reincarnation he has been waiting so long to fight I would assume he expected someone as strong as Kid Buu. No dramatic growth? Base Gohan was fighting SSJ trunks and stated Trunks would surpass him in a couple months. Furthermore Goku also makes a statement saying that Uub might beat Good Buu and Goku later replies with the amazing expectation quote implying he is at the very least above Good Buu and Goku was stronger.

'As amazing as he thought he'd be' by no means implies he's anywhere near Pure Boo. Base Gohan from what? The TV Special? Regardless, that means nothing. You're not accounting for confounding variables in any context. The latter of your sentiments has no citation, even though it blatantly requires such. I by no means in any of Z recall Goku ever saying anything of the sort in the context you're implying. Your numbers are too big, face the facts.
Nope Gohan was sparring with SSJ Trunks in the manga. It actually does imply he is just as strong as Pure Buu. He expected to fight Pure Buu's incarnate and even has high hopes for him saying he could beat Good Buu. Do I need to provide the quotes? I will if I have to. Excuse me? Who the hell are you to state my levels are wrong when you can't provide evidence against these. These are also just opinions -_-.

Didnt gain much? he went from 3,000,000,000 to 50,000,000,000. Goku 10 years later was decided with 75,000,000,000(Zenkai after his fight with Buu) x 1.75^10. This came out to be over 20,000,000,000,000. a difference of 3 years is huge when Goku's power level is as big as it is at the start of the 10 years of training. Now I only did 3,000,000,000 x 1.5^7 when I calculated his Buu saga power level but thats only because Goku probably spent more time with SSJ2 and SSJ3 than he did with actual training. However even if I did make Goku's Buu saga power level bigger it would make everyone elses power level bigger as well. Gohan also recieved an anger boost during the Cell games. IMO, Gohan's power was 10x stronger than his normal SSJ2 form. So Gohan's SSJ2 form was 3,600,000,000,000 and SSJ2 Goku's in the Buu saga is 5,000,000,000,000 so I'm not contradicting anything.

Those are your own made up numbers, they have no reverence to them actually gaining anything. Infallible logic doesn't work.

Nope Gohan was sparring with SSJ Trunks in the manga. It actually does imply he is just as strong as Pure Buu. He expected to fight Pure Buu's incarnate and even has high hopes for him saying he could beat Good Buu. Do I need to provide the quotes? I will if I have to. Excuse me? Who the hell are you to state my levels are wrong when you can't provide evidence against these. These are also just opinions -_-. Made up numbers? I've calculated training increases in the Saiyan Saga. Piccolo got 2.36x stronger within less than 1 year of his usual training =/. I've basically based the yearly increases off that.
You are gonna have to point out these plot induced increases because I'm not seeing them. I have taken into account these rather large jumps, Piccolo comes to mind in the android saga, and figured out a logical reasoning for his jump in power. Ok... why did you bring GT up if we are just gonna disregard it?

[Perfect]

You should have specified. Granted I still have no idea what you're referring to, by extension to the TV Special there'd be the manga counterpart, which doesn't make a difference. Trunks was extremely weak, but getting stronger. Gohan's base was likely barley above Goku's was on Namek. Goku wasn't on Pure Boo's level, that and Goku's intention was to find a protege to mold and shape. So no, there is no implication he was that strong, it's your own fabrication that's brought you that delusion. I already have provided evidence, your levels are absurdly too high, get over it--it doesn't matter who I am. 75,000,000,000 and 50,000,000,000 are made up by your own whim, so yes you've incited infallible logic by using them as testament to Goku "gaining strength in the gap". Your "yearly increases" do not factor confounding variables, therefore they're not exponential or linear. I only brought up GT to show even its plot hole filled logic wouldn't incite such miserable numbers.

Plot induced increases are simple to find. Look at the training mediums in respect to the threat and current battle power. Factor in the effectiveness that eventually fades as well (i.e. gravity has less and less of an effect).

[dbzfan7]

Didnt gain much? he went from 3,000,000,000 to 50,000,000,000. Goku 10 years later was decided with 75,000,000,000(Zenkai after his fight with Buu) x 1.75^10. This came out to be over 20,000,000,000,000. a difference of 3 years is huge when Goku's power level is as big as it is at the start of the 10 years of training. Now I only did 3,000,000,000 x 1.5^7 when I calculated his Buu saga power level but thats only because Goku probably spent more time with SSJ2 and SSJ3 than he did with actual training. However even if I did make Goku's Buu saga power level bigger it would make everyone elses power level bigger as well. Gohan also recieved an anger boost during the Cell games. IMO, Gohan's power was 10x stronger than his normal SSJ2 form. So Gohan's SSJ2 form was 3,600,000,000,000 and SSJ2 Goku's in the Buu saga is 5,000,000,000,000 so I'm not contradicting anything.

Those are your made up numbers. I ain't using them.

Goku was only a somewhat stronger then SSJ2 Kid Gohan. He was already really close to SSJ Gohan during the Cell Games. That means his base barely went up. Piccolo has a hard time distinguishing Majin vegeta as above Kid Gohan. That puts them not far above him. I don't count Rage boost as multiplying Gohans power but adding some more power. Goku only got transformations because he wasn't going to get many boosts with training like he has before in the afterlife. Goku doesn't even train with anyone on earth. Even when he did, his Power didn't sky rocket compared to his gravity training and zenkai. Getting a little stronger in base makes Goku more powerful when SSJ forms multiply on top of that.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Chapter: 518 (DBZ 324), P6.5
Goku: “…But someone besides us and Boo might win.”
Satan: “Hahhahhah, now really! There’s no way that could happen, right?”
Goku implies Uub might beat Buu.
Chapter: 518 (DBZ 324), P11.6-8
Goku: “He’s the one…While I’ve been training on my own, I’ve been waiting all this time for that kid to enter the tournament…[ ]…10 years ago, when that outrageously bad Majin Boo died, I made a wish…That this time, he be reborn as a good guy, so we could fight one-on-one…Apparently old man Enma Daio heard me, and pulled some strings on my behalf…”
Goku has been waiting a really long time to fight this Kid, He seems to expect someone just as strong as Pure Buu.
Chapter: 519 (DBZ 325), P12.2-5
Context: Oob is surprised by Goku’s Bukujutsu
Goku: “Oh, I see. You still don’t even know how to fly, huh? …I guess there ain’t no helping it. You haven’t had no teacher, and you probably never even considered things like that. Sorry I bad-mouthed you before. Please forgive me. I just wanted to know your true ability. You’re exactly the person I thought you were. As amazin’ as I expected. But you don’t know how to use your power. This is the first time you’ve fought like this, right? I've got it! From now on I'll live with you at your house and teach you!”
Goku states he wanted to see Uub's TRUE ABILITY and it was as AMZING AS HE EXPECTED. Uub's true ability would be that of Pure Buu's since he is his reincarnation.
Furthermore I consider the Trunks special canon. Especially since Herms regarded it in the strength checker.
Chapter: Trunks: the Story, P2.1
Context: Regular Gohan was sparring with Super Saiyan Trunks. With his one arm…
Future Gohan: “You’ve improved a lot, Trunks. You might even leave me in the dust in a few months.”
What are you trying to do? Prove that my opinions arent fact? Well good you succeeded. These are merely my opinions based on early training increases. Dude I have taken into account those large increases. I made these power levels and used logic to figure out why they got so much stronger. My levels, again, DO NOT CONTRADICT ANYTHINHG IN THE MANGA. Aslo where is your proof that characters dont get a lot sronger? Oh yeah you have none, its merely your opinion.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Didnt gain much? he went from 3,000,000,000 to 50,000,000,000. Goku 10 years later was decided with 75,000,000,000(Zenkai after his fight with Buu) x 1.75^10. This came out to be over 20,000,000,000,000. a difference of 3 years is huge when Goku's power level is as big as it is at the start of the 10 years of training. Now I only did 3,000,000,000 x 1.5^7 when I calculated his Buu saga power level but thats only because Goku probably spent more time with SSJ2 and SSJ3 than he did with actual training. However even if I did make Goku's Buu saga power level bigger it would make everyone elses power level bigger as well. Gohan also recieved an anger boost during the Cell games. IMO, Gohan's power was 10x stronger than his normal SSJ2 form. So Gohan's SSJ2 form was 3,600,000,000,000 and SSJ2 Goku's in the Buu saga is 5,000,000,000,000 so I'm not contradicting anything.

Those are your made up numbers. I ain't using them.

Goku was only a somewhat stronger then SSJ2 Kid Gohan. He was already really close to SSJ Gohan during the Cell Games. That means his base barely went up. Piccolo has a hard time distinguishing Majin vegeta as above Kid Gohan. That puts them not far above him. I don't count Rage boost as multiplying Gohans power but adding some more power. Goku only got transformations because he wasn't going to get many boosts with training like he has before in the afterlife. Goku doesn't even train with anyone on earth. Even when he did, his Power didn't sky rocket compared to his gravity training and zenkai. Getting a little stronger in base makes Goku more powerful when SSJ forms multiply on top of that.

I don't care if you ain't using them. I'm merely validating my levels and showing they do not contradict the manga in any way. These are merely opinions. Sparring yields a 2-5x increase IMO. Tradition training yields a 1.5-2x increase IMO. Goku's level went through the roof in the Time Chamber so I don't see what you are talking about. I suppose I should have spedified Gohan's power level when he killed Cell with his Kamehameha. Its 4,800,000,000,000. SSJ2 Majin Vegeta isn't very far above that. Again not contradictory.

[Perfect]

Chapter: 518 (DBZ 324), P6.5
Goku: “…But someone besides us and Boo might win.”
Satan: “Hahhahhah, now really! There’s no way that could happen, right?”
Goku implies Uub might beat Buu.

No, it implies that Goku's messing with him. As evidence previously by stating they'd all let him win, and the fact Goku just smiles in his usual passive manner. This is actually just foreshadowing for Goku Goku easy on Oob, and letting him get in a few hits before leaving.

Chapter: 518 (DBZ 324), P11.6-8
Goku: “He’s the one…While I’ve been training on my own, I’ve been waiting all this time for that kid to enter the tournament…[ ]…10 years ago, when that outrageously bad Majin Boo died, I made a wish…That this time, he be reborn as a good guy, so we could fight one-on-one…Apparently old man Enma Daio heard me, and pulled some strings on my behalf…”
Goku has been waiting a really long time to fight this Kid, He seems to expect someone just as strong as Pure Buu.

There's no evidence there at all for Pure Boo's power to be fully reincarnated.

Chapter: 519 (DBZ 325), P12.2-5
Context: Oob is surprised by Goku’s Bukujutsu
Goku: “Oh, I see. You still don’t even know how to fly, huh? …I guess there ain’t no helping it. You haven’t had no teacher, and you probably never even considered things like that. Sorry I bad-mouthed you before. Please forgive me. I just wanted to know your true ability. You’re exactly the person I thought you were. As amazin’ as I expected. But you don’t know how to use your power. This is the first time you’ve fought like this, right? I've got it! From now on I'll live with you at your house and teach you!”
Goku states he wanted to see Uub's TRUE ABILITY and it was as AMZING AS HE EXPECTED. Uub's true ability would be that of Pure Buu's since he is his reincarnation.

He couldn't even damage Goku's base, that's proof enough he's weaker. His true ability would be like saying Goku would grow up to be a Super Saiyan. Through hard work, because obviously then he was weaker.

Furthermore I consider the Trunks special canon. Especially since Herms regarded it in the strength checker.
Chapter: Trunks: the Story, P2.1
Context: Regular Gohan was sparring with Super Saiyan Trunks. With his one arm…
Future Gohan: “You’ve improved a lot, Trunks. You might even leave me in the dust in a few months.”

I never said it wasn't. I explained already why this doesn't mean anything.

Its 4,800,000,000,000. SSJ2 Majin Vegeta isn't very far above that. Again not contradictory.

Whether you'd like to admit it or not, that's a huge gap.

What are you trying to do? Prove that my opinions arent fact? Well good you succeeded. These are merely my opinions based on early training increases. Dude I have taken into account those large increases. I made these power levels and used logic to figure out why they got so much stronger. My levels, again, DO NOT CONTRADICT ANYTHINHG IN THE MANGA.

Your logic's broken, that's what I've proven.

[dbzfan7]

Didnt gain much? he went from 3,000,000,000 to 50,000,000,000. Goku 10 years later was decided with 75,000,000,000(Zenkai after his fight with Buu) x 1.75^10. This came out to be over 20,000,000,000,000. a difference of 3 years is huge when Goku's power level is as big as it is at the start of the 10 years of training. Now I only did 3,000,000,000 x 1.5^7 when I calculated his Buu saga power level but thats only because Goku probably spent more time with SSJ2 and SSJ3 than he did with actual training. However even if I did make Goku's Buu saga power level bigger it would make everyone elses power level bigger as well. Gohan also recieved an anger boost during the Cell games. IMO, Gohan's power was 10x stronger than his normal SSJ2 form. So Gohan's SSJ2 form was 3,600,000,000,000 and SSJ2 Goku's in the Buu saga is 5,000,000,000,000 so I'm not contradicting anything.

Those are your made up numbers. I ain't using them.

Goku was only a somewhat stronger then SSJ2 Kid Gohan. He was already really close to SSJ Gohan during the Cell Games. That means his base barely went up. Piccolo has a hard time distinguishing Majin vegeta as above Kid Gohan. That puts them not far above him. I don't count Rage boost as multiplying Gohans power but adding some more power. Goku only got transformations because he wasn't going to get many boosts with training like he has before in the afterlife. Goku doesn't even train with anyone on earth. Even when he did, his Power didn't sky rocket compared to his gravity training and zenkai. Getting a little stronger in base makes Goku more powerful when SSJ forms multiply on top of that.

I don't care if you ain't using them. I'm merely validating my levels and showing they do not contradict the manga in any way. These are merely opinions. Sparring yields a 2-5x increase IMO. Tradition training yields a 1.5-2x increase IMO. Goku's level went through the roof in the Time Chamber so I don't see what you are talking about. I suppose I should have spedified Gohan's power level when he killed Cell with his Kamehameha. Its 4,800,000,000,000. SSJ2 Majin Vegeta isn't very far above that. Again not contradictory.

Training can grow from anywhere. Goku training with Kaio made his base 19x stronger, When Goku went to Namek his base became 11x stronger. After 1 zenkai he then got over 33x stronger in base. His Kaioken and Zenkai were what really propelled Goku(then SSJ). I have no set limit or expectation from training. I go by what people say, do, or act. Since Goku is only placed a little above SSJ2 Kid Gohan, and he was already close to his SSJ form, that means his base didn't get that much higher. You could use a theory it was because he focused on developing TF's, but I don't see how that stops him from increasing his base at least 7x during 7 years of traning in a place that reduces strain on your body.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Chapter: 518 (DBZ 324), P6.5
Goku: “…But someone besides us and Boo might win.”
Satan: “Hahhahhah, now really! There’s no way that could happen, right?”
Goku implies Uub might beat Buu.

No, it implies that Goku's messing with him. As evidence previously by stating they'd all let him win, and the fact Goku just smiles in his usual passive manner. This is actually just foreshadowing for Goku Goku easy on Oob, and letting him get in a few hits before leaving.

Chapter: 518 (DBZ 324), P11.6-8
Goku: “He’s the one…While I’ve been training on my own, I’ve been waiting all this time for that kid to enter the tournament…[ ]…10 years ago, when that outrageously bad Majin Boo died, I made a wish…That this time, he be reborn as a good guy, so we could fight one-on-one…Apparently old man Enma Daio heard me, and pulled some strings on my behalf…”
Goku has been waiting a really long time to fight this Kid, He seems to expect someone just as strong as Pure Buu.

There's no evidence there at all for Pure Boo's power to be fully reincarnated.

Chapter: 519 (DBZ 325), P12.2-5
Context: Oob is surprised by Goku’s Bukujutsu
Goku: “Oh, I see. You still don’t even know how to fly, huh? …I guess there ain’t no helping it. You haven’t had no teacher, and you probably never even considered things like that. Sorry I bad-mouthed you before. Please forgive me. I just wanted to know your true ability. You’re exactly the person I thought you were. As amazin’ as I expected. But you don’t know how to use your power. This is the first time you’ve fought like this, right? I've got it! From now on I'll live with you at your house and teach you!”
Goku states he wanted to see Uub's TRUE ABILITY and it was as AMZING AS HE EXPECTED. Uub's true ability would be that of Pure Buu's since he is his reincarnation.

He couldn't even damage Goku's base, that's proof enough he's weaker. His true ability would be like saying Goku would grow up to be a Super Saiyan. Through hard work, because obviously then he was weaker.

Furthermore I consider the Trunks special canon. Especially since Herms regarded it in the strength checker.
Chapter: Trunks: the Story, P2.1
Context: Regular Gohan was sparring with Super Saiyan Trunks. With his one arm…
Future Gohan: “You’ve improved a lot, Trunks. You might even leave me in the dust in a few months.”

I never said it wasn't. I explained already why this doesn't mean anything.

Its 4,800,000,000,000. SSJ2 Majin Vegeta isn't very far above that. Again not contradictory.

Whether you'd like to admit it or not, that's a huge gap.

What are you trying to do? Prove that my opinions arent fact? Well good you succeeded. These are merely my opinions based on early training increases. Dude I have taken into account those large increases. I made these power levels and used logic to figure out why they got so much stronger. My levels, again, DO NOT CONTRADICT ANYTHINHG IN THE MANGA.

Your logic's broken, that's what I've proven.

You haven't proven shit -_-. These are easily some of the most ridiculous responces I've heard. Goku messing with Mr Satan is your reasoning for this? . Where is my proof that the reincarnation is just as powerful? Well lets take a look at the defintion of Reincarnation: 1.The rebirth of a soul in a new body. Hmm a soul eh? Well Ki energy comes from a soul, well more like it is the soul, and since Uub has the soul of Pure Buu he would be just as powerful. Plus if Goku has been anticipating someone for a long time you know he is powerful.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

While I do believe that raged Oob is as strong as Pure Boo (that's what Goku's statements imply), I don't believe that base Goku is stronger than Boo arc SS3 Goku, because it really is crazy and unrealistic for the manga.
But they fought evenly so, they should be equal, right? Not nessesarily. The battle was very short in the manga (only 4 pages).






So, I believe that Oob had not unleashed his full power when he was fighting evenly with Goku, and then he fully unleashed his power when he used the Kiai on Goku.