Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

[TonyTheTiger]

Again, that's literally a female Bardock you just described. The name thing is the only hiccup as far as I know. Hardly remarkable. You think she's shitty then call her shitty. Don't use "Mary Sue" as a catch-all. It's not one. When people call blatantly non-Mary Sue characters as if they were it makes their criticisms look stupid. As if they're using "Mary Sue" as a pretense to make it seem less subjective. "Obviously it's bad because Mary Sue." Not "It's bad because I think it's stupid."

[Rocketman]

I don't think I've called her a Sue, but true enough.

[TonyTheTiger]

Yeah, I know. I'm just pointing out that, in general, it was something that's been bugging me.

[dbzfan7]

Still hate that Hanassia crap. Ruins the whole Low level Saiyan who rises above all expectations when she and Bardock (who also shouldn't) are above the King. Seriously imagine the re-write for Goku vs Vegeta.

Vegeta: I am a Super Elite of finer breed even though both your parents were stronger then my dad.

Goku: So wouldn't that make me Super Elite.

I also still hate that bitch Bra. Every time she opens her mouth crap comes out. Hopefully she will get better as the story flows.

[Attitudefan]

Still hate that Hanassia crap. Ruins the whole Low level Saiyan who rises above all expectations when she and Bardock (who also shouldn't) are above the King. Seriously imagine the re-write for Goku vs Vegeta.

Vegeta: I am a Super Elite of finer breed even though both your parents were stronger then my dad.

Goku: So wouldn't that make me Super Elite.

I also still hate that bitch Bra. Every time she opens her mouth crap comes out. Hopefully she will get better as the story flows.

Thank you, you stated exactly what was one my mind. I commend you.

[Saiga]

Hanasia being the strongest Saiyan rubs me the wrong way. By your definition Tony, she would be a Mary Sue, because her ~specialness~ comes at the expense of the other Saiyan characters, since she gets more importance and focus than what makes sense and she's the most powerful Saiyan for no good reason.

@dbzfan7 Nice post, I agree wholeheartedly.

[Scarz]

Hanasia being the strongest Saiyan rubs me the wrong way. By your definition Tony, she would be a Mary Sue, because her ~specialness~ comes at the expense of the other Saiyan characters, since she gets more importance and focus than what makes sense and she's the most powerful Saiyan for no good reason.

Where was it mentioned that she was the strongest saiyan? She just seems to be barking out orders and insults.

[CaBrPi]

http://www.dragonball-multiverse.com/en/page-462.html

She claims that she is, so it's possible she's not, but I think it's proper to take something like this at face-value.

[Saiga]

No, she is. Salagar posted the battle powers for a few people in that special in one of the comment sections and she had the highest of the Saiyans.

Something like 12,000 to Bardock's 10,000. I'm pretty sure they were discussed in earlier pages of these thread, since Dodoria was only given a 18,000 BP.

[Scarz]

... Okay, I'm jumping on the Mary-Sue bandwagon here. There is no reason she should be that strong.

[Saiga]

Okay, so, I found the post retcon battle powers (the ones that corrected Dodoria's battle power and added others). Originally she was given a battle power of 12,000 making her the strongest Saiyan, but in the latest battle powers posted it was revealed that King Vegeta's two guards had battle powers of 12,000 and 12,500 so she isn't the strongest Saiyan - just tied for the second strongest. And it's not a whole lot better since it's still only an another OC that's better than her. But hey, it's something.

Unfortunately, in my trek back through the pages of this thread looking for the battle powers I was reminded of the nonsensical Freeza nerf and other changes he made. Ugh... I wish he was upfront that he was only being accurate to the manga as long as it was convenient for him.

[DNA]

Unfortunately, in my trek back through the pages of this thread looking for the battle powers I was reminded of the nonsensical Freeza nerf and other changes he made. Ugh... I wish he was upfront that he was only being accurate to the manga as long as it was convenient for him.

Not just when it's convenient but also when it's to his tastes. He ignores whatever he doesn't like and changes whatever he feels like. He is not accurate to the original work at all. Although, before anyway chews my head on this, all I can remember is stuff from the movies so you could argue that he is accurate to the manga, but you've just proven that he isn't so... Yeah...

[rereboy]

I don't see anything wrong with Freeza's power in the main comic, so everything is fine with me (I don't really care about extra information or chapters that act basically as filler. Even if they are stupid, as long as they don't really affect the main comic as its own standalone comic, just like that "nerf", I don't really care at all).

Cold, however, should be better explained in the main comic.

[TonyTheTiger]

Freeza's nerf is something I just choose to ignore. There's no talk of it in the actual comic nor does anything indicate he's weaker than usual. The arbitrary change to Bardock's story is what bugged me the most. I'm fine with necessary minor changes to movies in order to force them to fit but something like Bardock's backstory didn't need any changes to justify a different course of events. What's the point in telling alternate universe stories if the main universe itself is different?

Hanasia's power level is wacky but so is Bardock's. That's the reason I'm willing to give it a pass since it's not really something Salagir pulled out of his ass. He's just following Toei's lead.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Salagir ignores everything he doesn't like outside of the manga, and he has even given himself the right to change any of the movie characters that appear in DBM. BUT. His big mistake is that he is using the French translation, and not the original version of the manga, which is why First Form Freeza's battle power is 53.000 and not 530.000.

[Saiga]

Salagir ignores everything he doesn't like outside of the manga, and he has even given himself the right to change any of the movie characters that appear in DBM. BUT. His big mistake is that he is using the French translation, and not the original version of the manga, which is why First Form Freeza's battle power is 53.000 and not 530.000.

That's also the problem with Cold being stronger than Freeza. While the Japanese version of the manga makes Freeza's superiority clear, the French version apparently doesn't.

Freeza's power nerf doesn't affect my enjoyment main comic because it isn't brought up there, but it does make it harder for me to take Salagir seriously. Same as Broli's infinite power, I suppose.

[TonyTheTiger]

Cold being in a reduced form? I can see that. Him being a little stronger than Freeza? That I can tolerate. But him being as strong as he's presented in DBM? Hell no. It makes his confrontation with Trunks seem like the idiocy of a spectacular fool rather than the last ditch effort against unexpected strength that it was supposed to be. It's those changes that are the biggest problem. The ones that, in retrospect, screw up the implications of earlier events. If Cold is as strong as Android 16 (implied somewhere, I think) then not only does it make him a moron but it reduces Freeza's entire gimmick to that of a spoiled brat on a joyride through his father's empire. It makes it seem like Goku didn't actually accomplish anything on Namek beyond getting insanely lucky that Freeza didn't call daddy sooner.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Exactly. While I like DBM a lot, there are many things in it that if they weren't there, DBM would be my favorite fan manga. But with all these shit in it, I prefer Toyble's DBAF, because at least AF feels like Dragon Ball (to me), while there are times that DBM doesn't.

[omegalucas]

I can see where he came up with Cold being way more powerful than Freeza.
If I recall correctly, when they approach the Earth, the Z Senshi recognize Freeza's ki and comment on a huge ki that is coming as well, that being Cold. Salagir probably took that "huge ki" reference and made the form Cold is seen in the manga close to Mecha Freeza in power. Then, he probably used the other forms as multipliers (by comparing the power levels of the various forms of Freeza) and applied it to Cold.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

I can see where he came up with Cold being way more powerful than Freeza.
If I recall correctly, when they approach the Earth, the Z Senshi recognize Freeza's ki and comment on a huge ki that is coming as well, that being Cold. Salagir probably took that "huge ki" reference and made the form Cold is seen in the manga close to Mecha Freeza in power.

The line you mentioned is anime only, while the manga makes it clear that Freeza is stronger than Cold.