VIZ 3-in-1 Editions Coming Summer 2013

[UpFromTheSkies]

Djinn Boo is just a needless name change. If somebody buys the Manga and they don't know about DB they won't know why the hell there's an M on Boos belt. From what I remember, isn't Djinn an Islamic term to refer to spirits that inhabit the earth with free will, also were here before mankind, and the Devil is one too. Just going off what I remember hearing.

I didn't even know about this, I'm glad I never bought the Buu volumes, I would have been so disappointed. Maybe I'm being OCD and am overreacting to the changes Viz made, but it is what it is. I wish I could enjoy it, but I just can't.

[rereboy]

Djinn Boo is just a needless name change. If somebody buys the Manga and they don't know about DB they won't know why the hell there's an M on Boos belt. From what I remember, isn't Djinn an Islamic term to refer to spirits that inhabit the earth with free will, also were here before mankind, and the Devil is one too. Just going off what I remember hearing. I can see why they would use it for Boo as its an Arabic/Islamic term, but it just doesn't seem right to me.

I disagree. Not only its not confirmed anywhere that the M symbol on Buu and Babidi's minions actually stands for Majin (that is simply a fan assumption, you can read more about it on this topic: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... 7&p=578256 ), but you are also clearly ignoring the fact that Djinn is a standard and correct way of translating the term Majin.

Anyone who reads the Viz translation without knowing the original dialog will get a standard and correct translation of Majin Buu's name and, just any other fan, Japanese or not, he will not know what the M symbol stands for, since it was never confirmed what it means and it can mean a lot of things like, for example, Madoshi. So, what exactly is the problem with the translation..?

Djinn Boo is just a needless name change. If somebody buys the Manga and they don't know about DB they won't know why the hell there's an M on Boos belt. From what I remember, isn't Djinn an Islamic term to refer to spirits that inhabit the earth with free will, also were here before mankind, and the Devil is one too. Just going off what I remember hearing.

I didn't even know about this, I'm glad I never bought the Buu volumes, I would have been so disappointed. Maybe I'm being OCD and am overreacting to the changes Viz made, but it is what it is. I wish I could enjoy it, but I just can't.

Maybe you should check your facts before deciding to criticize. That's how I can tell that his arguments in this case have no validity, like I've demonstrated in this very post. Right now, you are simply jumping at anything that can somewhat support your already formed opinion.

[UpFromTheSkies]

I disagree. Not only its not confirmed anywhere that the M symbol on Buu and Babidi's minions actually stands for Majin (that is simply a fan assumption, you can read more about it on this topic: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... 7&p=578256 ), but you are also clearly ignoring the fact that Djinn is a standard and correct way of translating the term Majin.

I would imagine that it's not confirmed because it doesn't need to be. No need to confirm things that are so obvious.

Right now, you are simply jumping at anything that can somewhat support your already formed opinion.

I'm not really looking for anything to support it. It's a fact that Viz made changes, and I don't like them, and that just can't be helped. If you enjoy the translation and find the changes tolerable, good for you, go on enjoying them.

[Saiyan Prince Vegeta]

Djinn Boo is just a needless name change. If somebody buys the Manga and they don't know about DB they won't know why the hell there's an M on Boos belt. From what I remember, isn't Djinn an Islamic term to refer to spirits that inhabit the earth with free will, also were here before mankind, and the Devil is one too. Just going off what I remember hearing. I can see why they would use it for Boo as its an Arabic/Islamic term, but it just doesn't seem right to me.

I disagree. Not only its not confirmed anywhere that the M symbol on Buu and Babidi's minions actually stands for Majin (that is simply a fan assumption, you can read more about it on this topic: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... 7&p=578256 ), but you are also clearly ignoring the fact that Djinn is a standard and correct way of translating the term Majin.

Thats why I didn't mention the minions, and instead I only mentioned Boo, but after reading that I guess I understand what you mean. Oh, and just to clarify I wasn't "clearly ignoring" the Djinn thing, I just wanted to know why it is a correct way of translating Majin. I was trying to phrase my sentence as if it were more of a question, that's why I started with "Isn't Djinn an Islamic term", I probably should have put a question mark there. Oops.

[Duo]

This is getting the point where we should make a separate thread for the argument. I won't address any further points unless you wish to carry it else ware.

Also, I am not obligated to agree with Herms as to whether or not Djinn is acceptable, even if he's provided the community with an invaluable amount of service.

[UpFromTheSkies]

Translating is obviously not an easy task, and some changes must be made to get the meaning across, and the degree to which you find those changes tolerable is a matter of personal taste, it's not something that can be argued over. My personal taste is for the translation to be as direct as possible, with no censoring, and no name changes...and in certain cases where it's impossible to give a literal, direct translation, leave the words as they are, unstranslated, and explain in the notes what is meant and give the proper cultural context so that it can be understood.

[rereboy]

I would imagine that it's not confirmed because it doesn't need to be. No need to confirm things that are so obvious.

Right now, you are simply jumping at anything that can somewhat support your already formed opinion.

I'm not really looking for anything to support it. It's a fact that Viz made changes, and I don't like them, and that just can't be helped. If you enjoy the translation and find the changes tolerable, good for you, go on enjoying them.

Obvious like the fact that only Majin Buu is named Majin despite the fact that the symbol is in everything Babidi owns, including the characters that possess that symbol? Why would that be if it so obviously means "majin"? Why couldn't it mean Madoushi which can stand for mage, wizard or warlock? It would make much more sense for it to mean that term since the symbol is used in everything Babibi or Bobidi owns or owned and they are mages. I don't see why that is so obvious as you suggest. At all. If you want to believe it stands for that, sure, its your personal interpretation, but criticizing Viz's release because of a personal interpretation that isn't confirmed anywhere? Doesn't seem right.

And as I've said, I've no problem with you not liking Viz's releases. I just don't think you were being fair about their quality and flaws. Its important to treat things fairly.

Translating is obviously not an easy task, and some changes must be made to get the meaning across, and the degree to which you find those changes tolerable is a matter of personal taste, it's not something that can be argued over. My personal taste is for the translation to be as direct as possible, with no censoring, and no name changes...and in certain cases where it's impossible to give a literal, direct translation, leave the words as they are, unstranslated, and explain in the notes what is meant and give the proper cultural context so that it can be understood.

Agreed. However, its different to say that something is just not up to our tastes and quite another to imply that something that doesn't suit our tastes is no good because of it. Like I said, fair treatment, fair rating. That's the only way to criticize.

Oh, and just to clarify I wasn't "clearly ignoring" the Djinn thing, I just wanted to know why it is a correct way of translating Majin. I was trying to phrase my sentence as if it were more of a question, that's why I started with "Isn't Djinn an Islamic term", I probably should have put a question mark there. Oops.

I'm sure that Herms has explained it better somewhere on the forum, but at the moment I just have that quote from him. But yes, its origin is mainly from ancient arabic culture, and refers to magical beings or spirits, I believe.

Edit: I found another post by Herms about the term "Djinn" here: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... nn#p492619

In there, when asked if Majin means "Demon/Magic person" or "Demon/Magic people", Herms says this: "Yep. And it's often used in Japanese to refer to djinn/genie, like in the story of Aladdin. And notably for DB, in Dr. Slump there's a Majin imprisoned in a bottle who's used as a secret weapon by a quasi-Middle Eastern nation. The actual words djinn or genie get used sometimes too though, so it's not a one-to-one correspondence. Majin is also used to refer to other mythical beings like the Asura, or to fictional magic beings like Nights from the game Nights into Dreams. The Shin Megami Tensei games use Majin as a category for bizarre, super-strong optional bosses (djinn are classified under a different category in the game, for the record). In Yu Yu Hakusho, Game Master is served by various Game Majin, and in this case Steve Simmons translates the word as "genie"."

This is getting the point where we should make a separate thread for the argument. I won't address any further points unless you wish to carry it else ware.

Also, I am not obligated to agree with Herms as to whether or not Djinn is acceptable, even if he's provided the community with an invaluable amount of service.

You don't have to agree with anything or anyone. I just pointed what Herms said because I trust his translations since he's demonstrated many times in the past that he knows his stuff. And, if Djinn is indeed a standard and correct of translating Djinn like he says, and I trust him to be accurate, then I don't seen anything wrong with the translation at all. If you do, so be it.

[Tullece]

The link you keep posting unless I'm blind, doesn't even mention paper quality it just says that it will be the same type of release as the One Piece 3-1's which I assume means the same format, again I could careless about paper quality because I've never been rough with any of my reading material, I'm just glad I get it uncensored finally. I just don't understand the bashing of a product no ones put there hands on yet.

Also does anyone know if they'll keep the original color chapters intact?

[Akumaito Beam]

If the paper quality is relatively decent and it is indeed uncensored I will have all of zero problems double dipping on the comics. The manga is the only Dragonball related thing I really care about nowadays (to the point where this is infinitely more interesting to me than the new movie) and I recently had a huge Dragonball purge where I sold all of my Dragon Ball DVDs so that certainly frees up my wallet and shelf space a bit to invest in these. That being said I truly question if this is gong to be "uncensored". I have my suspicions that whoever is in charge of marketing doesn't know what has been censored inside and out like we do and possibly judged at a glance. That being said I will be tickled pink if I'm wrong.As much as I adore the VIZ translation with a passion (I have a serious massive boner for that translation guys, like for reals) it would only sweeten the deal if they touched it up a bit. There are a few inconsistencies here and there, it would be great if they could bang those out. All n' all I'm not getting my hopes up though. I have a hunch this is just going to be what everyone assumed it was in the first place, a cheap ass, low quality VIZ Big. Again though, I would be pumped if I was wrong as shit. Either way VIZ is getting my money. It's this or the VIZ Big, which I hear looks super duper nice. I guess there's no real incentive to impress me personally.

[VegettoEX]

If you can care less about something, it means you have the capacity to care less about it. That's very likely not what you meant.

If I need to, I will explicitly say it in even more words right here: yes, the paper will be lower-quality in the Dragon Ball 3-in-1s, just like it is with the One Piece 3-in-1s. This was directly conveyed to us, and is one of the reasons they're keeping the Viz Big versions on the market for the collectors.

I would also note that Viz has traditionally had different definitions of what "uncut" actually means compared to what fans expect, and I would agree with you that until it's in your hands, you probably shouldn't judge "uncut" by a series of tweets that were not followed-up on for very specific clarification.

[FindKenshi]

Geeze.. I can't imagine the paper being even lower quality than Viz's first release.. that stuff was among the worst of the worst. This is even worse than that? Or is it just worse than the VizBig?

[UpFromTheSkies]

It's been a long time since I've bought it, but when Dragon Ball was printed in original Japanese Weekly Shonen Jump, the paper was really thin and cheap like newspaper. Do they still use that kind of paper?

[Duo]

Geeze.. I can't imagine the paper being even lower quality than Viz's first release.. that stuff was among the worst of the worst. This is even worse than that? Or is it just worse than the VizBig?

It's lower quality than the standard graphic novels. I believe VegettoEX has stated somewhere in this thread before.

Somewhere.

[Tanooki Kuribo]

Geeze.. I can't imagine the paper being even lower quality than Viz's first release.. that stuff was among the worst of the worst. This is even worse than that? Or is it just worse than the VizBig?

It's lower quality than the standard graphic novels. I believe VegettoEX has stated somewhere in this thread before.

Somewhere.

I actually picked up a One Piece 3 in 1 a few weeks ago and flipped through it in the store. I didn't do it to check out the paper quality but, I do remember thinking it seemed cheap. It was better than the monthly Shonen Jump paper, but worse than the first release paperback paper. I figured maybe I was just spoiled by the VizBig quality since I'm way more familiar with that line. If you're curious about the paper and have access to a book store that sells manga, just check out any of the Viz 3 in 1's.

This book store I was talking about, is on my way to the train station when I come home from work. I could just snap a pic of the paper tomorrow, but that won't help with letting you know how it feels.

[FindKenshi]

Is it still too late to get all the VizBig stuff? I mean is that on order, or are they pretty much printed out?

[theoriginalbilis]

The VizBigs are still in print and will continue to remain so for a while, I'm certain.

[Saiga]

I'm not sure about that. Checking Amazon, it seems 3 volumes right now are out of print. It looks like I might be going with these editions after all, I don't know how else to get a complete collection of the Z portion of the manga otherwise.

[rereboy]

I'm not sure about that. Checking Amazon, it seems 3 volumes right now are out of print. It looks like I might be going with these editions after all, I don't know how else to get a complete collection of the Z portion of the manga otherwise.

Viz has confirmed (to Kanzenshuu) that they will continue to sell the Vizbigs even after this 3-in-1 release, so any out of print volumes are only temporarily in that situation.

[VegettoEX]

Yeah, I've seen the Viz Bigs float out of Amazon before and they came back with a vengeance . Wouldn't worry about that for now.

[Saiga]

There always seem to be a few volumes missing, though. I guess I should buy what's available now and get the rest later, and just deal with the extra shipping costs.