Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kaboom » Sun Apr 14, 2013 1:38 pm

Kamiccolo9 wrote:Mastered Super Saiyan isn't a seperate form though. I see Freeza's final form as the equivalent of a Super Saiyan, while Cooler, who remains in the form, is closer to a mastered Super Saiyan.
That's the way I've long seen it, too. It's remarkable how similar they all seem.

Freeza's True Form → Super Saiyan
Freeza's "100%" State → Super Saiyan Grade 2 or 3
Coola's True Form → Full-Power Super Saiyan
Coola's "Super" Form → Super Saiyan 2

More on-topic, that sort of mental comparison is what usually causes me to assume that Coola's super form grants more power than if he simply went 100%, but I guess that would be jumping the gun a bit.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Apr 14, 2013 1:54 pm

Kamiccolo9 wrote:Mastered Super Saiyan isn't a seperate form though.
Super Saiyan Full Power was treated as a separate form in Daizenshuu 2 & 10.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:18 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Mastered Super Saiyan isn't a seperate form though.
Super Saiyan Full Power was treated as a separate form in Daizenshuu 2 & 10.
I imagine that that is just to note that it happened. It's still the same form as regular SSJ, only, well, mastered. It's been trained to be more efficient and not waste energy.

Edit: Here we go. No one seems to consider it a separate transformation.
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Piccolo: “…I think there’s no doubt that they were Super Saiyans…However, they’ve trained so that they can exist in that state at an ordinary, everyday level…”
Trunks: “S-so then…When they fight, they’ll [perform] an ev-even more tremendous transformation…!”
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:47 pm

It's more like an upgraded version of the original Super Saiyan form, since they are not exactly the same. Goku, for example, as a SSFP can suppress his power, he is not angry all the time (which is also shown in his facial features), the ki drain is extremely minimal (to the point he can stay like that all day, but he still needs some energy to transform, as shown in his final battle with Boo) and the aura is different when powering up.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:52 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:It's more like an upgraded version of the original Super Saiyan form, since they are not exactly the same. Goku, for example, as a SSFP can suppress his power, he is not angry all the time (which is also shown in his facial features), the ki drain is extremely minimal (to the point he can stay like that all day, but he still needs some energy to transform, as shown in his final battle with Boo) and the aura is different when powering up.
Or, he's just managed to train himself to where the negative aspects of SSJ are now gone. It's still the same transformation, but now it's more efficient. He doesn't have to deal with all the problems that the Super Saiyans initially had when they transformed. The term "mastered Super Saiyan" is never once mentioned in the series. It's not acknowledged as a separate transformation by anyone in the series, and when Goku is demonstrating the various levels of Super Saiyan, he never mentions that his SSJ1 is actually a different form.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:16 pm

The result of his training was the new form. It replaced the original Super Saiyan form.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:19 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:The result of his training was the new form. It replaced the original Super Saiyan form.
Except it didn't replace it. It's the same form, only mastered. Thus the name. Again, it's never referred to in either the manga or the anime as a new form, only that Goku and Gohan have rid themselves of the negative effects of being Super Saiyans.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:28 pm

It is referred as a different form in the guidebooks though. In the end, it is the same form, but it's a different form at the same time. :crazy:
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:32 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:It is referred as a different form in the guidebooks though. In the end, it is the same form, but it's a different form at the same time. :crazy:
Honestly, the only reason I think it's mentioned in the guidebooks is to mark that it happened. Would you mind posting what it actually says about it in the Daizenshuu?
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:46 pm

In the guidebooks, the formed is named Super Saiyan Full Power or Super Saiyan Grade 4.
Daizenshuu 2 wrote:SUPER SAIYAN FULL POWER
First Appears: Vol. 34+
Goku trained in the Room of Spirit and Time before his fight with Cell. He draws out the power of the Super Saiyan to its limits, and the aura that surrounds him is different.
Daizenshuu 10 wrote:Variations
Grades 2-3 are powered up versions of the Grade 1, which Goku, Vegeta, and Trunks have the ability to transform into. Full Power time is a type where they are able to unconsciously exist in the Super Saiya-jin state, and even the wildness of their personality vanishes. Only Goku and Gohan can transform into this.
Trunks TV Special Animation Comic Section wrote:Super Saiyan Grade Four
A form where without consciously raising their ki they are still able to remain Super Saiyan on a regular basis: that's Grade Four. From the start Grade One balanced power, energy consumption, etc. This form removes the slightly agitated state which characterizes Grade One. It's a natural form of Super Saiyan which has even gotten rid of their wild personality!

Son Gohan
He grew a lot both physically and mentally during his roughly 1 year of training in the Room of Spirit and Time! After Goku surrenders, he succeeds him in stepping up to the Cell Games ring and challenging perfect form Cell! His clothes were given to him by his martial arts master Piccolo.

[red text] The strongest boy warrior!

[Cell bear hugs Gohan] Though possessing power surpassing Cell, his gentle heart shied away from battle!

Son Goku
Goku transformed into Grade Four during his training in the Room of Spirit and Time, and stepped up to the ring as the first challenger in the Cell Games. Though he put up a good fight against perfect form Cell, he sadly resigned, and selected Gohan as Cell's next opponent.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by GTx10 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:47 pm

I always saw it like this: Freeza 4th form is strong, his 100% power is just that, his forth form at its Max. SS1 Goku beat him. SS1 Goku is stronger. Cooler's basic form same ish as 4th form Freeza. Goku fought well until Cooler went Shredder on him. SS1 Goku beat him. SS1 can be strengthened until eventually SS2 is obtained. Maybe If SS2 wasn't made SS1 would power up to Broly style LSS. I doubt it but who knows?

Clearly a SS1 can battle and more than likely best Freeza in ether 4th, 100%, or Mecha form. The Cooler movies emphasize "Cooler is stronger than Freeza!" That's the pinch.

Birusu is shocked anyone but him beat Freeza, Son Goku's claim to fame is beating Freeza! If the COOLER movies pinch is that Cooler is Freeza's brother and stronger it stands to reason that SS1 Goku at absolute full perfected state is number 1, Cooler in Metal form is second, Mecha Freeza is third.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:50 pm

It seems to me like they're just saying that this state is just a natural progression of the normal SSJ form. Other than the term "grade 4" (which I have to say that I've never heard before; is this the only publication that calls it that), I see nothing to indicate that it is an entirely new form.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by RandomGuy96 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:52 pm

I always saw it like this: Freeza 4th form is strong, his 100% power is just that, his forth form at its Max. SS1 Goku beat him. SS1 Goku is stronger. Cooler's basic form same ish as 4th form Freeza. Goku fought well until Cooler went Shredder on him. SS1 Goku beat him. SS1 can be strengthened until eventually SS2 is obtained. Maybe If SS2 wasn't made SS1 would power up to Broly style LSS. I doubt it but who knows?

Clearly a SS1 can battle and more than likely best Freeza in ether 4th, 100%, or Mecha form. The Cooler movies emphasize "Cooler is stronger than Freeza!" That's the pinch.

Birusu is shocked anyone but him beat Freeza, Son Goku's claim to fame is beating Freeza! If the movies pinch is that Cooler is Freeza's brother and stronger it stands to reason that SS1 Goku at absolute full perfected state is number 1, Cooler in Metal form is second, Mecha Freeza is third.
...what? I'm not really sure what that post is supposed to be saying...

Anyway, Cooler IS the stronger brother. The Kais and Bills thought it was Freeza, but they're not omniscient, that much is extremely obvious. Freeza was probably the most boastful and successful conqueror in the universe, not the strongest. He did seem to be more of the face of the organization than Cooler and Cold. Also normal Cooler is stronger than Mecha Freeza (Metal is just overkill) and Metal Cooler was stronger than Goku when he died.

Goku is also not the strongest in the universe. In fact, factoring in Cooler, Goku has never been the strongest in the universe, except arguably at one brief point in the Buu Saga.
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dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:56 pm

RandomGuy96 wrote: ...what? I'm not really sure what that post is supposed to be saying...

Anyway, Cooler IS the stronger brother. The Kais and Bills thought it was Freeza, but they're not omniscient, that much is extremely obvious. Freeza was probably the most boastful and successful conqueror in the universe, not the strongest. He did seem to be more of the face of the organization than Cooler and Cold. Also normal Cooler is stronger than Mecha Freeza (Metal is just overkill) and Metal Cooler was stronger than Goku when he died.

Goku is also not the strongest in the universe. In fact, factoring in Cooler, Goku has never been the strongest in the universe, except arguably at one brief point in the Buu Saga.
From what I understand, the new movie is a continuation of the manga, not the anime or the other movies (besides the 2008 special.) So Cooler wouldn't even factor in to Birisu's statement.

Edit: Sorry, quoted the wrong person previously. Fixed now.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by GTx10 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 4:00 pm

I didn't say Son Goku is the strongest ever. Now in the good guy category he is because of SSG form)
I was saying that in this situation Goku is stronger Than Cooler while Cooler is stronger than Freeza.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Draken » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:17 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:In the guidebooks, the formed is named Super Saiyan Full Power or Super Saiyan Grade 4.
Daizenshuu 2 wrote:SUPER SAIYAN FULL POWER
First Appears: Vol. 34+
Goku trained in the Room of Spirit and Time before his fight with Cell. He draws out the power of the Super Saiyan to its limits, and the aura that surrounds him is different.
Daizenshuu 10 wrote:Variations
Grades 2-3 are powered up versions of the Grade 1, which Goku, Vegeta, and Trunks have the ability to transform into. Full Power time is a type where they are able to unconsciously exist in the Super Saiya-jin state, and even the wildness of their personality vanishes. Only Goku and Gohan can transform into this.
Trunks TV Special Animation Comic Section wrote:Super Saiyan Grade Four
A form where without consciously raising their ki they are still able to remain Super Saiyan on a regular basis: that's Grade Four. From the start Grade One balanced power, energy consumption, etc. This form removes the slightly agitated state which characterizes Grade One. It's a natural form of Super Saiyan which has even gotten rid of their wild personality!

Son Gohan
He grew a lot both physically and mentally during his roughly 1 year of training in the Room of Spirit and Time! After Goku surrenders, he succeeds him in stepping up to the Cell Games ring and challenging perfect form Cell! His clothes were given to him by his martial arts master Piccolo.

[red text] The strongest boy warrior!

[Cell bear hugs Gohan] Though possessing power surpassing Cell, his gentle heart shied away from battle!

Son Goku
Goku transformed into Grade Four during his training in the Room of Spirit and Time, and stepped up to the ring as the first challenger in the Cell Games. Though he put up a good fight against perfect form Cell, he sadly resigned, and selected Gohan as Cell's next opponent.
I think that's wrong then.... I mean come on, Vegeta surely should have gotten FPSSJ. Not the first time the Daizenshuu has been wrong.
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:20 pm

Draken wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:In the guidebooks, the formed is named Super Saiyan Full Power or Super Saiyan Grade 4.
Daizenshuu 2 wrote:SUPER SAIYAN FULL POWER
First Appears: Vol. 34+
Goku trained in the Room of Spirit and Time before his fight with Cell. He draws out the power of the Super Saiyan to its limits, and the aura that surrounds him is different.
Daizenshuu 10 wrote:Variations
Grades 2-3 are powered up versions of the Grade 1, which Goku, Vegeta, and Trunks have the ability to transform into. Full Power time is a type where they are able to unconsciously exist in the Super Saiya-jin state, and even the wildness of their personality vanishes. Only Goku and Gohan can transform into this.
Trunks TV Special Animation Comic Section wrote:Super Saiyan Grade Four
A form where without consciously raising their ki they are still able to remain Super Saiyan on a regular basis: that's Grade Four. From the start Grade One balanced power, energy consumption, etc. This form removes the slightly agitated state which characterizes Grade One. It's a natural form of Super Saiyan which has even gotten rid of their wild personality!

Son Gohan
He grew a lot both physically and mentally during his roughly 1 year of training in the Room of Spirit and Time! After Goku surrenders, he succeeds him in stepping up to the Cell Games ring and challenging perfect form Cell! His clothes were given to him by his martial arts master Piccolo.

[red text] The strongest boy warrior!

[Cell bear hugs Gohan] Though possessing power surpassing Cell, his gentle heart shied away from battle!

Son Goku
Goku transformed into Grade Four during his training in the Room of Spirit and Time, and stepped up to the ring as the first challenger in the Cell Games. Though he put up a good fight against perfect form Cell, he sadly resigned, and selected Gohan as Cell's next opponent.
I think that's wrong then.... I mean come on, Vegeta surely should have gotten FPSSJ. Not the first time the Daizenshuu has been wrong.
I agree. I mean, why wouldnt he? He flat-out admits the superiority of the state; why would he hinder himself by not doing it?
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:47 am

The manga shows Vegeta (in Boo arc), Future Trunks (when he returns to the future), Goten, Trunks, and Gotenks with Super Saiyan Full Power aura, and Goten even has non-angry facial features at some point (a trait exclusive to the SSFP, all other SS forms have angry facial features), which leads me to believe that all of them mastered the Super Saiyan form (Vegeta & Trunks at their second day in the RoSaT, Goten & Trunks when they were "playing fight", Gotenks & Vegetto because their components have already done it).
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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Draken
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by Draken » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:32 am

Which is why the guidebooks could be wrong. They said only Gohan and Goku can "transform" into it, when we know in reality all the Saiyans can. It's not a transformation, simply a state of being. Imagine a healthy runner and a non-healthy runner. They can both jog at the same speeds. Yet the healthy runner's heart will be exerting less effort and he can keep the pace continually with minimal stress. The non-healthy runner can jog at the speed for awhile, but then eventually his heart will get too tired to continue pumping blood at that level of exertion and his feet/legs will start feeling the stress. Same thing with SSJ and FPSSJ. Don't tell me you think humans have transformations when running :problem:
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Mastered SSJ, Freeza's 100% and Cooler's 5th Form.

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:34 am

Draken wrote:Which is why the guidebooks could be wrong. They said only Gohan and Goku can "transform" into it, when we know in reality all the Saiyans can. It's not a transformation, simply a state of being. Imagine a healthy runner and a non-healthy runner. They can both jog at the same speeds. Yet the healthy runner's heart will be exerting less effort and he can keep the pace continually with minimal stress. The non-healthy runner can jog at the speed for awhile, but then eventually his heart will get too tired to continue pumping blood at that level of exertion and his feet/legs will start feeling the stress. Same thing with SSJ and FPSSJ. Don't tell me you think humans have transformations when running :problem:
Super Saiyan & Super Saiyan Full Power are the same form, but different states IMO.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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