Piccolo stomps.Mjb1985 wrote:Piccolo ( Androids Saga ) vs Freeza
I'll think you'll find that according to Toriyama's statement in the Daizenshuu 6, he can't. All movies take place in alternate universes.Draken wrote:He can if he wants to =/. You just might not do it yourself.dbzfan7 wrote:You can't fit Super Android 13 into the main timeline.PerfectFreeza wrote:17 and 18 appear in the intro, killing Dr. Gero, so it doesn't have to be an alternate timeline.
What Toriyama says goes. Nuff said.Draken wrote:Maybe in your personal canon everything Daizenshuu says goes and movies suck. Maybe for his Daizenshuu is not canon and movies are.
Maybe for you.TheMightyOzaru wrote:What Toriyama says goes. Nuff said.Draken wrote:Maybe in your personal canon everything Daizenshuu says goes and movies suck. Maybe for his Daizenshuu is not canon and movies are.
No. There is a difference in having an opinion and just being wrong. Toriyama created this series and what he says goes.Draken wrote:Maybe for you.TheMightyOzaru wrote:What Toriyama says goes. Nuff said.Draken wrote:Maybe in your personal canon everything Daizenshuu says goes and movies suck. Maybe for his Daizenshuu is not canon and movies are.
Not really. Obviously, you would probably consider Toryama's word before dismissing it, but he admits that he has forgotten a lot of what he did in the series. If he contradicts himself, or if one sees something that Toryama said as a contradiction, then he shouldn't be forced to accept it.TheMightyOzaru wrote: No. There is a difference in having an opinion and just being wrong. Toriyama created this series and what he says goes.
Cipher wrote:If Vegeta does not kill Gohan, I will stop illegally streaming the series.
Malik_DBNA wrote:"Achievement Unlocked: Rule 34"Scarz wrote:Malik, stop. People are asking me for lewd art of possessed Bra (with Vegeta).
Until he goes back on his word, he is right.Kamiccolo9 wrote:Not really. Obviously, you would probably consider Toryama's word before dismissing it, but he admits that he has forgotten a lot of what he did in the series. If he contradicts himself, or if one sees something that Toryama said as a contradiction, then he shouldn't be forced to accept it.TheMightyOzaru wrote: No. There is a difference in having an opinion and just being wrong. Toriyama created this series and what he says goes.
If that works for you, then fine. But Dragonball has no set canon. For example, if I decided to go only with what was in the Kanzeban edition of the manga,without accepting any other media, then that would be perfectly fine. One does not have to accept anything.TheMightyOzaru wrote:Until he goes back on his word, he is right.Kamiccolo9 wrote:Not really. Obviously, you would probably consider Toryama's word before dismissing it, but he admits that he has forgotten a lot of what he did in the series. If he contradicts himself, or if one sees something that Toryama said as a contradiction, then he shouldn't be forced to accept it.TheMightyOzaru wrote: No. There is a difference in having an opinion and just being wrong. Toriyama created this series and what he says goes.
Cipher wrote:If Vegeta does not kill Gohan, I will stop illegally streaming the series.
Malik_DBNA wrote:"Achievement Unlocked: Rule 34"Scarz wrote:Malik, stop. People are asking me for lewd art of possessed Bra (with Vegeta).
Once again, that's your opinion.TheMightyOzaru wrote:Until he goes back on his word, he is right.Kamiccolo9 wrote:Not really. Obviously, you would probably consider Toryama's word before dismissing it, but he admits that he has forgotten a lot of what he did in the series. If he contradicts himself, or if one sees something that Toryama said as a contradiction, then he shouldn't be forced to accept it.TheMightyOzaru wrote: No. There is a difference in having an opinion and just being wrong. Toriyama created this series and what he says goes.
Yeah, that's the crux of the problem. Sure, Movie 7 starts with 17 and 18 being released. But in the main story, that event kicks off a non-stop sequence that ends with Goku dead, Gohan a Super Saiyan (2), Trunks' sword being broken, etc... Even the "slow" parts of the Androids arc had main characters either sick in bed or training in the Room of Spirit and Time for their duration, or the world completely shut down in a panic (which means no shopping sprees or bikini model shows). There's absolutely no opportunity in the main story for Movie 7's events to happen as depicted.Rocketman wrote:It's not about Toriyama's word, for me. It's about the fact that there is not a single day in the Android Arc where Movie 7 could possibly take place.
Piccolo gives Freeza a tough battle, but looses in the end. Going by battle powers, I believe Piccolo is around 100.000.000.Piccolo ( Androids Saga ) vs Freeza
Don't forget though that Trunks is a Saiyan Halfling, with an enormous amount of dormant power. Just look how strong present Trunks got just by sparring with Goten.He started out a lot weaker and only got eight months to train. During those eight months he didn't have a gravity room, senzu beans, a training partner, or anything else that would justify such a massive increase.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
There were many reasons for that:Goku was 88% of Vegeta in the Saiyan Arc and thought it would be pointless to continue and assured death was imminent in a battle with a gap that small. So I personally don't view Freeza's power very far away from Goku at all.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Freeza has a power advantage, is super-durable, and also has many deadly ki attacks on his arsenal, and since he could fight like he did against SS Goku, I can't see any hope for Piccolo.RandomGuy96 wrote:If I had Piccolo at 100,000,000 (I don't), I still think he'd win. Not only is he more skilled than Freeza, but Freeza has severe stamina problems at 100% power.
Also, do not compare Future Trunks to present Trunks. That just doesn't work. Otherwise Trunks should've stomped both androids when he was a kid.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
