The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Draken]

Does this mean Broly is actually 2x as strong as SSJ2 Goku Buu arc?

[TheMightyOzaru]

Does this mean Broly is actually 2x as strong as SSJ2 Goku Buu arc?

How do you come to that conclusion ?

[RandomGuy96]

Goku wasn't there

I don't know how the Family Kamehameha actually being a combined attack would mean anything other than that it's stronger than Broly by a lot. And it was plainly shown to be a combined attack. Goku didn't even turn SS2 until after Trunks 'distracted' Broly anyway.

[PerfectFreeza]

Seeing as Krillin was able to take out the battle robots, and he's hundreds of times weaker than even Android Arc Piccolo, then it's easy just to disregard that as an inconsistency. Unless you want to either buff up Krillin to crazy high levels, or nerf Piccolo down to the Earthling's strength for no reason.
I doubt 18 was suppressing herself that much, judging by 17's statement that she couldn't take on all of them. Vegeta shouldn't be much weaker than 18 was.
As for them being at equal levels, Goku's unguarded Kamehameha blasted Cell in half, and would have killed him were it not for his regeneration, ans even suppressed Cell was much stronger than Goku. Same with Vegeta and his Final Flash. And we know that Cooler can gather his ki for huge attacks very quickly, as seen in M5, so there's no problem with him doing it here. There's not really any issue with an unguarded ki attack from a weaker or equal being, taking out a stronger one.

Perhaps again, it's the suppressed Piccolo.
Well, how else she could tank that hit?
You have a good point there, but still, Kamicollo should have been able to recover from that hit.
Combined attacks shouldn't work that way, or else what MightyOzaru said.
Broly was beaten by just SSJ2 Adult Gohan, SSJ1 Goten and SSJ1 Goku.Combined, they shouldn't be that much ahead of SSJ2 Goku.

[Mjb1985]

I think Broly was beaten by Ssj2 Goku/ Gohan and Ssj Goten.

[Draken]

I think Broly was beaten by Ssj2 Goku/ Gohan and Ssj Goten.

And using the logic that multiple fighters teaming up at the same time, we would have Goku 10, Gohan 8, Goten 3 or so. Add it up you get 21, 2x stronger than SSJ2 Goku using this addition logic that never works in DBZ.

[Mjb1985]

Yea 2x stronger than Goku sounds like a decent place to put Broly. Anything higher than that is too much for my taste though.

[Kamiccolo9]

Yea 2x stronger than Goku sounds like a decent place to put Broly. Anything higher than that is too much for my taste though.

I like having him just a little bit ahead of the Buu Arc SSJ2's. That works with what's shown, and it fits in with the producer's statement that Broly is the strongest Saiyan, as there was no SSJ3 yet.

[Mjb1985]

Yea generally a 1.2-2x range sounds good for me. Some like him higher some like him lower. I generally prefer a 1.5x difference.

[RandomGuy96]

I have Super Perfect Cell able to knock him around like a volleyball. Dai Kaioshin-Buu level is waaaaaaaaaaay overrating him.

[Kamiccolo9]

I have Super Perfect Cell able to knock him around like a volleyball. Dai Kaioshin-Buu level is waaaaaaaaaaay overrating him.

Is anyone putting him that high? I'm having Fat Buu at roughly 70 percent of SSJ3 Goku, and Broly being a little over 25 percent of Goku.

[Mjb1985]

That seems like you are nerfing him. He three shotted Super Saiyan 2 Gohan.

[Kamiccolo9]

That seems like you are nerfing him. He three shotted Super Saiyan 2 Gohan.

Yeah, but SSJ2 Gohan is also somewhat weaker than SSJ2 Goku. He doesn't have to be multiple times stronger to dominate the fight.

[RandomGuy96]

That seems like you are nerfing him. He three shotted Super Saiyan 2 Gohan.

And Super Perfect Cell would probably one-shot him. He one-shotted a much stronger SS2 Gohan with greater ease than Broly (and he never got hit in turn), and did more damage to him in the process. Broly didn't break Gohan's arm...

Yeah, Broly did absolutely nothing to impress me here. Equal to Super Perfect Cell is generous enough for him. I'd think if he were any higher he wouldn't even budge from Gohan's hits, and his barrier certainly would've at least held out longer.

Is anyone putting him that high? I'm having Fat Buu at roughly 70 percent of SSJ3 Goku, and Broly being a little over 25 percent of Goku.

You are putting him on the level of his first power up. The one that was moderately stronger than Vegeta and required Goku and Vegeta to team up to beat him.

[Kamiccolo9]

Is anyone putting him that high? I'm having Fat Buu at roughly 70 percent of SSJ3 Goku, and Broly being a little over 25 percent of Goku.

You are putting him on the level of his first power up.

I have no problem with that. Fat Buu wasn't noted to be anything impressive until his second power up, and Vegeta would have killed him numerous times were it not for his regeneration. Broly's nothing compared to the SSJ3 tier fighters, but I think that given what's shown, and the writer's statement, that high SSJ2 tier works for him.

[RandomGuy96]

I don't buy that Buu would've been screwed if not for regeneration. I think that he only bothers using ki to defend himself when he feels like it (i.e. in serious combat), and just regenerates the rest of the time because some attacks are so meaningless and weak to him. See Super Buu being pierced by bullets but then tanking a barrage of ki blasts from Gotenks. If Buu was a 'normal' fighter who couldn't regenerate, he'd be on guard all the time and wouldn't be anywhere near as fragile.

[Kamiccolo9]

I don't buy that Buu would've been screwed if not for regeneration. I think that he only bothers using ki to defend himself when he feels like it (i.e. in serious combat), and just regenerates the rest of the time because some attacks are so meaningless and weak to him. See Super Buu being pierced by bullets but then tanking a barrage of ki blasts from Gotenks. If Buu was a 'normal' fighter who couldn't regenerate, he'd be on guard all the time and wouldn't be anywhere near as fragile.

Possibly, but he does mention that Vegeta hurt him, implying a not so huge gap. I personally have no problem with Broly being on this level, or between Fat Buu and Majin Vegeta if that works better, but I do feel that he should be above the SSJ2's.

[Mjb1985]

Vegeta only fought Buu when Buu was stronger.

[dbzfan7]

Yea 2x stronger than Goku sounds like a decent place to put Broly. Anything higher than that is too much for my taste though.

I like having him just a little bit ahead of the Buu Arc SSJ2's. That works with what's shown, and it fits in with the producer's statement that Broly is the strongest Saiyan, as there was no SSJ3 yet.

Same. I don't have him much stronger than Boo arc SSJ2, but a little.

[Mjb1985]

Yea the general 1.2-2x range has a placement for everyone to be happy imo.