Goku vs Freeza - The longest anime battle in anime history?!

[penguintruth]

And this thread is 19 posts!

Whoops, not anymore.

Yeah, longest (largely) continuous fight I've ever seen in an anime, at least. Mercifully, there's not any other fights even half that length in the show.

[DarkPrince_92]

It was like 18-20 episodes. Somewhere in that range. That's MADDD LOONGGGG!!!!

[Hades]

Other than filler, what would you guys change or cut from the fight? Please don't mention the 5 minute thing. That's an easy fix, he doesn't say "five minutes" or says he was surprisingly off the mark.

I'd have Goku and Freeza fight evenly, to the extent that the better tactician would emerge victorious from the fight.

ETA: I'd also have the Super Saiyan form be a bit more, monstrous (it was implied that the legendary Super Saiyan - not broly - was quite like Majin Buu)

[ABED]

Other than filler, what would you guys change or cut from the fight? Please don't mention the 5 minute thing. That's an easy fix, he doesn't say "five minutes" or says he was surprisingly off the mark.

I'd have Goku and Freeza fight evenly, to the extent that the better tactician would emerge victorious from the fight.

ETA: I'd also have the Super Saiyan form be a bit more, monstrous (it was implied that the legendary Super Saiyan - not broly - was quite like Majin Buu)

I get what you mean, but I thought it was heavily hinted at that Goku was the better tactician. In fact, Goku's strategy was to break Freeza down psychologically by letting him reach his perfect form, and he had a good idea that Freeza's body couldn't handle the strain of that much power for long. As you see, Goku was on the money because Freeza's power dropped precipitously.

[Hades]

Other than filler, what would you guys change or cut from the fight? Please don't mention the 5 minute thing. That's an easy fix, he doesn't say "five minutes" or says he was surprisingly off the mark.

I'd have Goku and Freeza fight evenly, to the extent that the better tactician would emerge victorious from the fight.

ETA: I'd also have the Super Saiyan form be a bit more, monstrous (it was implied that the legendary Super Saiyan - not broly - was quite like Majin Buu)

I get what you mean, but I thought it was heavily hinted at that Goku was the better tactician. In fact, Goku's strategy was to break Freeza down psychologically by letting him reach his perfect form, and he had a good idea that Freeza's body couldn't handle the strain of that much power for long. As you see, Goku was on the money because Freeza's power dropped precipitously.

The problem with the fight was that it was one-sided. Were the fight between equals (Like SSJ2 Goku and Majin Vegeta) instead of one person holding all the cards, it would have a lot more suspense.

And for the Super Saiyan, it would carry a lot more Demonic qualities (not just in appearance but also behavior: perhaps have SSJ Goku actually make threats towards Gohan while the voice gets a lot deeper)

[ABED]

It wasn't one sided, Freeza got in plenty of quality offense on Goku, plus after all the crap Freeza did to his friends, it was nice to see the tables turned.

ANNNNNNNNNDDDDDD of course, you would make it darker.

[Hades]

It wasn't one sided, Freeza got in plenty of quality offense on Goku, plus after all the crap Freeza did to his friends, it was nice to see the tables turned.

ANNNNNNNNNDDDDDD of course, you would make it darker.

I wasn't saying that. It was implied in the Manga itself that the Saiyans were a violent bloodthirsty culture, and the Super Saiyan itself was implied to be a monster.

[ABED]

It wasn't one sided, Freeza got in plenty of quality offense on Goku, plus after all the crap Freeza did to his friends, it was nice to see the tables turned.

ANNNNNNNNNDDDDDD of course, you would make it darker.

I wasn't saying that. It was implied in the Manga itself that the Saiyans were a violent bloodthirsty culture, and the Super Saiyan itself was implied to be a monster.

They were already monsters, as it were. Goku was different. I don't think he needed to be demonic, perhaps more violent at first, but Goku should remain Goku.

[Hades]

It wasn't one sided, Freeza got in plenty of quality offense on Goku, plus after all the crap Freeza did to his friends, it was nice to see the tables turned.

ANNNNNNNNNDDDDDD of course, you would make it darker.

I wasn't saying that. It was implied in the Manga itself that the Saiyans were a violent bloodthirsty culture, and the Super Saiyan itself was implied to be a monster.

They were already monsters, as it were. Goku was different. I don't think he needed to be demonic, perhaps more violent at first, but Goku should remain Goku.

On second thought, Vegeta could be the demonic one (sadism goes up to eleven when he's SSJ)

[Kamiccolo9]

It wasn't one sided, Freeza got in plenty of quality offense on Goku, plus after all the crap Freeza did to his friends, it was nice to see the tables turned.

ANNNNNNNNNDDDDDD of course, you would make it darker.

I wasn't saying that. It was implied in the Manga itself that the Saiyans were a violent bloodthirsty culture, and the Super Saiyan itself was implied to be a monster.

Not in the manga. The Super Saiyan was said to be "The mightiest of fighters," who "love blood and battle." Nothing about them being monsters.

Chapter: 264 (DBZ 70), P6.5
Freeza: “It seems that the Saiyans really do hide bottomless battle power…It increases greatly the more they battle…Of course, there’s no way they could be a match for me, but if I don’t think of the future and nip them in the bud now…After all, it’d be troublesome if they were able to become Super Saiyans…”

Chapter: 280 (DBZ 86), P3.1-2
Vegeta: “A Super Saiyan appears once every thousand years… a Saiyan who overcomes the wall which no warrior, no matter how gifted, can overcome…That’s supposed to just be a stupid tradition…And even if the legend were true…only I would have the potential to become a Super Saiyan.”

Chapter: 285 (DBZ 91), P4.1-3, P5.2
Jheese: “Su…Su…Super Saiyan…!? Th-the legendary mightiest of warriors…[ ] So h-he’s…The one thing Lord Freeza feared, the Super Saiyan…!!”
Ginyu: “You don’t want to kill me? You don’t want any pointless fights…!? The Su-Super Saiyan is supposed to be the strongest warrior in the universe, who loves blood and battle…”

The anime, or at least the Funimation dub, has some stuff about the Legendary Super Saiyan's power overwhelming him, and causing him to destroy everything, or something like that, but the manga doesn't say anything like that.

[Hades]

It wasn't one sided, Freeza got in plenty of quality offense on Goku, plus after all the crap Freeza did to his friends, it was nice to see the tables turned.

ANNNNNNNNNDDDDDD of course, you would make it darker.

I wasn't saying that. It was implied in the Manga itself that the Saiyans were a violent bloodthirsty culture, and the Super Saiyan itself was implied to be a monster.

Not in the manga. The Super Saiyan was said to be "The mightiest of fighters," who "love blood and battle." Nothing about them being monsters.

Chapter: 264 (DBZ 70), P6.5
Freeza: “It seems that the Saiyans really do hide bottomless battle power…It increases greatly the more they battle…Of course, there’s no way they could be a match for me, but if I don’t think of the future and nip them in the bud now…After all, it’d be troublesome if they were able to become Super Saiyans…”

Chapter: 280 (DBZ 86), P3.1-2
Vegeta: “A Super Saiyan appears once every thousand years… a Saiyan who overcomes the wall which no warrior, no matter how gifted, can overcome…That’s supposed to just be a stupid tradition…And even if the legend were true…only I would have the potential to become a Super Saiyan.”

Chapter: 285 (DBZ 91), P4.1-3, P5.2
Jheese: “Su…Su…Super Saiyan…!? Th-the legendary mightiest of warriors…[ ] So h-he’s…The one thing Lord Freeza feared, the Super Saiyan…!!”
Ginyu: “You don’t want to kill me? You don’t want any pointless fights…!? The Su-Super Saiyan is supposed to be the strongest warrior in the universe, who loves blood and battle…”

The anime, or at least the Funimation dub, has some stuff about the Legendary Super Saiyan's power overwhelming him, and causing him to destroy everything, or something like that, but the manga doesn't say anything like that.

The problem is, the Saiyans were a culture where Majin Buu would fit in perfectly. It is logical that the Super Saiyan would be a sadistic monster.

[ABED]

Are you talking about Pure Buu? If so, no, he wouldn't fit in. Buu was insane and wanted everything dead. The Saiyans were warriors. They wanted to fight and conquor, but they also seemed to enjoy the spoils of war.

[Hades]

Are you talking about Pure Buu? If so, no, he wouldn't fit in. Buu was insane and wanted everything dead. The Saiyans were warriors. They wanted to fight and conquor, but they also seemed to enjoy the spoils of war.

I was thinking more Super/Fat Buu.

[ABED]

Saiyans run in packs, Buu is a loner.

[Kamiccolo9]

The problem is, the Saiyans were a culture where Majin Buu would fit in perfectly. It is logical that the Super Saiyan would be a sadistic monster.

The Saiyans are warriors. They are rational. They are not mindless beasts (unless they're Oozarus, but we're not talking about that.)
SSJ was never implied to be some kind of sadistic monster in the manga; it was just said to be the mightiest warrior in the universe.

[Hades]

The problem is, Saiyans as a whole would idolise the likes of Buu, Ted Bundy and Andrei Chikatilo (AFAIK, they were described as being cruel and sadistic by Freeza - DBZ Kai), so it stands to reason that the SSJ would be depraved and cruel.

[ABED]

Ted Bundy was a serial killer, not a warrior. Why would they idolize him? Saiyans are typically depraved and cruel, but that's not because of their blood or a transformation, they chose that lifestyle. Goku was different, so there's little reason to believe that the transformation would've turned him into something he wasn't.

[Eternal Super Saiyan]

May be the longest in history but it sure is one damn epic fight. Has to be my #1 battle in all of DBZ.

Please... after Goku went Super Saiyan, the battle was like... 5 minutes.

Or what many didn't get is that Frieza meant 5 Namekian minutes!!