DragonBall Z Abridged

[FoolsGil]

Nice way to put out that fire Kaiser.

[KaiserNeko]

Nice way to put out that fire Kaiser.

Yeah, gotta be specific. Especially here, no lack of knowledgeable fans!

[rereboy]

To be fair, its never really clear who of the two is stronger after Namek. Nothing is stated or implied in that regard in the Cell saga and in the Buu saga we have only that single comment by Yamcha that seems to imply that he believes that Krillin is stronger than Tenshinhan because he states that he is the strongest human. Its not a whole lot to go on, in truth. It does seem to weight more in Krillins favor of course but only because there's almost nothing to go on except that Yamcha comment.

[Super Vegetto]

To be fair, its never really clear who of the two is stronger after Namek. Nothing is stated or implied in that regard in the Cell saga and in the Buu saga we have only that single comment by Yamcha that seems to imply that he believes that Krillin is stronger than Tenshinhan because he states that he is the strongest human. Its not a whole lot to go on, in truth. It does seem to weight more in Krillins favor of course but only because there's almost nothing to go on except that Yamcha comment.

Yamcha is obviously basing his statment on Krillin compered to every earthing up to that point.

Which means that 3 years after training for Androids: Krillin > Tien

Also Krillin's incrise in strenght on Namek is probably what keaps him on top as human, which is why it weight's more on Krillins side imo.

Also Batlle of Gods Bio for Krillin says: “strongest Earthling warrior”.


So yeah, Krillin > Tien

[rereboy]

Also Batlle of Gods Bio for Krillin says: “strongest Earthling warrior”.

Their basis is Yamcha's statement, obviously. It all comes down to that one single phrase being the only thing that implies anything regarding who is stronger of the two. In the absence of anything else, it ends up the only determining factor. If Yamcha had said something else, worded it a little differently, we would literally have nothing else but speculation and opinion.

[Kamiccolo9]

Also Batlle of Gods Bio for Krillin says: “strongest Earthling warrior”.

Their basis is Yamcha's statement, obviously. It all comes down to that one single phrase being the only thing that implies anything regarding who is stronger of the two. In the absence of anything else, it ends up the only determining factor. If Yamcha had said something else, worded it a little differently, we would literally have nothing else but speculation and opinion.

There's also a Toriyama interview on this site where he says that Krillin is the strongest Earthling.
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/ ... ma-nozawa/

[rereboy]

Also Batlle of Gods Bio for Krillin says: “strongest Earthling warrior”.

Their basis is Yamcha's statement, obviously. It all comes down to that one single phrase being the only thing that implies anything regarding who is stronger of the two. In the absence of anything else, it ends up the only determining factor. If Yamcha had said something else, worded it a little differently, we would literally have nothing else but speculation and opinion.

There's also a Toriyama interview on this site where he says that Krillin is the strongest Earthling.
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/ ... ma-nozawa/

The problem with that is that Toriyama is so forgetful and uncaring about details like that that we can't really take everything he states as a sure thing.

[TheMightyOzaru]

I never meant to imply Tenshinhan was stronger than Krillin.

I'm saying, think of it from Dr. Gero's perspective. Krillin is the buttmonkey. Tenshinhan, on the other hand, is considerably more confident.

Fair enough.

Also Batlle of Gods Bio for Krillin says: “strongest Earthling warrior”.

Their basis is Yamcha's statement, obviously. It all comes down to that one single phrase being the only thing that implies anything regarding who is stronger of the two. In the absence of anything else, it ends up the only determining factor. If Yamcha had said something else, worded it a little differently, we would literally have nothing else but speculation and opinion.

Except, you know, Krillins power level rising, as pointed out by Vegeta when Freeza showed up. A V-jump issue even gives Krillin a BP of 75,000

[rereboy]

Piccolo got a power comparable to Nail's or even higher just from being at Kaio's for a week. Tenshinhan was the one who stayed with Kaio the longest due to the time they had to wait to reactivate the Dragon Balls and I imagine him training him much harder than Krillin on Earth due to his personality and dedication.

I see no reason to assume that Krillin is stronger than Tenshinhan without Yamcha's comment.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Piccolo got a power comparable to Nail's or even higher.

Except he didn't. He just has to be stronger than a Namekian warrior for Nail to consider him impressive. As far as I'm concerned, Tenshinhan hit 43,000. Toriyama stated Krillin is the strongest. The V-Jump BPs imply he is stronger. The Battle of Gods supplemental material also says Krillin is the strongest. Lastly, Yamcha claims he is the strongest. That's 3(4) things that claim he is the strongest. Tenshinhan being stronger is an assumption. Krillin being stronger is supported by facts.

[FoolsGil]

Jeezy Petes the fire is spreading fast! Kaiser Neko, do something!

[rereboy]

You seem to miss the point that I'm not saying that Krillin is not the stronger of the two. He is. I'm merely pointing out that its only that comment from Yamcha that makes the difference. The V-Jump BPs and the Battle of Gods supplemental material say that he is stronger because of that comment from Yamcha. As for the interview, I tend to not give much importance to what Toriyama says because he is simply too forgetful and, quite frankly, he just doesn't care much about such details, he never did. I wouldn't be surprised if he had said something completely different from what Yamcha implied and even if he did, I would still give more importance to what is in the manga.

As for Piccolo, he could have been 15.000 for all I care. He would still have gone from something like 2000 to 15.000 in 6 days or something like that. My point was that they can make huge gains in Kaio's planet and Tenshinhan was there the longest, hundreds of days. Without Yamcha's comment, there is no reason to assume that he wouldn't be able to keep up with Krillin by training in Kaio's planet.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Why is Yamcah's statement the only one that matters? Toriyama says he is and Battle of Gods supplements say he is. That's 3 things that clearly say he's the strongest. Other than that, what do we have? Basic assumptions because.... well I really don't know why people assume Tenshinhan the strongest Earthling. Other than his Kikoho, he's never displayed anything Krillin can't do. Piccolo went from 3,500 to 30,000 IMO. Tenshinhan was a great deal weaker than Piccolo, and Piccolo has displayed an ability to get a lot stronger relatively quickly in the manga. I'm not shocked he managed to almost get 10 times stronger in 6+ days. Tenshinhan on the other hand is a human. Him getting to 43,000 is perfectly reasonable.

[rereboy]

Why are you even arguing with me...? I'm not even saying that Krillin is not the stronger of the two . I just pointed out that its not something that obvious since Yamcha's comment is the only thing that actually implies an answer to that in the manga.

And why are you repeating yourself like you didn't even read my answer to what you said? The guides and supplemental stuff just follow that comment from Yamcha, like most fans. They are basically pointing out the result of what he said. And I've already explained why I don't give importance to Toriyama's comments.

And is it so hard to understand why it would be simple to imagine that Tenshinhan could be considered stronger than Krillin if that Yamcha's comment didn't exist?

1: Tenshinhan had always been ahead of Krillin before Namek.
2: His dedication to his training is extreme, more than Krillin's, especially after Namek, since Krillin starts to want to settle down.
3: Training in Kaio's planet can produce tremendous gains in power, even in short periods. Looking at the manga, there's no reason to assume that Tenshinhan wouldn't be able to keep up with Krillin after spending so much time in Kaio's planet.
4: Tenshinhan has better feats than Krillin in the android/cell arc since he managed to hold semi-perfect Cell.
5: Tenshinhan has better feats than Krillin in the buu arc since he managed to defect a ki attack from Gotenks' Buu aimed at Dende.

Without Yamcha's comment, this would all weight in Tenshinhan's favor. It just doesn't because Yamcha's comment ends up being a more direct comparison. But it explains why many fans place Tenshinhan higher than Krillin if they don't pay attention to that comment or if they just ignore it.

[TheMightyOzaru]

I'm arguing with you because you under the impression that there's not a lot evidence for Krillins superiority. I gave you 3 pieces of evidence that outright state Krillin is the strongest earthling. Toriyama's word is also good enough because he reread the manga prior to working on the BoG. Without Yamcha's statement, there's still not a good reason for Tenshinhan's superiority. They are assumptions that, really, are based on nothing but his Kikoho forcing Cell down.

[Kaboom]

The DBZ Abridged thread is NOT the place for "Kuririn Vs Tenshinhan Debate #6,296,549."

[rereboy]

I'm arguing with you because you under the impression that there's not a lot evidence for Krillins superiority. I gave you 3 pieces of evidence that outright state Krillin is the strongest earthling. Toriyama's word is also good enough because he reread the manga prior to working on the BoG.

And there's not. You didn't mention one thing from the actual manga/story besides Yamcha's comment. Your other "evidence" is merely derivative from the manga and what's in there, namely Yamcha's comment. But that's my opinion. There was never any need for you to cause such a big argument about me explaining why I think him being stronger is not the most obvious thing in the world. It should be pretty apparent to everyone that are things much more obvious in the manga than that, so I don't see why me basically stating that its not that obvious should result in a big argument even if you don't agree with me in some details.

But, like Kaboom said, this is not the place to discuss it. So its the end of the discussion for me.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Ok... but the supplement and Toriyama's statement are direct confirmation. I don't see why they should be ignored just because they still go off what Yamcha has to say. However, yes. This is getting a little out of hand. Sorry I started a rather pointless argument.

[rereboy]

Confirmation of what Yamcha said (by outside sources regarding the manga) would only matter if I was actually arguing that Krillin wasn't the stronger of the two and/or if I was questioning the validity of what Yamcha said. That was not what I was arguing, so...

Anyway:

[Insertclevername]

This is fitting since Gokuu is sort of a baby anyway.