Can King Cold transform?

[RandomGuy96]

Basically a personal opinion thing here. Do you think he can? That he has a final form like Freeza, and was only in his 'second' when he arrived on Earth?

I don't think so. We know that he's weaker than Freeza, and was coming to Earth expecting to fight someone stronger than Freeza. I don't think he'd go down there in a suppressed form to do this. I think that his 'second' form is actually his only form, with a power level of around 90-100 million.

Toriyama said that Freeza's species are "mutants" and "hybrids". I think that Freeza and Cooler in their true forms take after their mother. For some evidence of this, see Chilled: he doesn't appear to be able to transform, and resembles Freeza's first form more than any other.

Also, look closely at Cold. He doesn't have those pink lines along his arms, legs, and tail like second form Freeza does. His skin is smooth and purple. He also doesn't have second form Freeza's giant shoulders with those purple things in them. Finally, he's GIGANTIC compared to Freeza's second form, so the comparison isn't exactly a perfect one.

[DarkPrince_92]

I think he probably could have. It sucks he only got 2 1/2 episodes of screen time; such a waste of a seemingly badass character.

[Kaboom]

Cold's bio from the DBZ Dragon Book(s) says this:

"His appearance bears a close resemblance to Freeza's second form, and Cold also appears to be the type whose abilities increase by transforming."

That's the closest thing I'm aware of to an official opinion on whether or not Cold can transform, and it seems to imply that he can. So that's good enough for me. I'll just assume that not everyone's suppression forms restrict the same relative amount of their power. I'm also a fan of the idea that the stronger one is, the more suppressive forms they'll end up with. So even if while in a restrictive form Cold was comparable to a relaxed true-form Freeza, if he took his own true form he'd still cap out as "somewhat weaker than Freeza" like how he's also officially described.

To put some numbers to that concept, I always tend to picture something like:

Freeza (1st Form): 5
-- 2nd Form: 10
-- 3rd Form: 20
-- True Form: 40
-- 100%: 1200

King Cold (1st Form): 15
-- 2nd Form (seen): 30
-- True Form: 60
-- 100%: 900

[Super Saiyan Turlast x4]

That's interesting information about Cold.

With that, I now go along with the idea of him being able to transform. I guess he never bothered to transform against Trunks because he thought the sword was the extent of his power, like he says.

[RandomGuy96]

Or because he knew it was futile either way.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

He can in the anime (based on that implication), but not in the manga. And even transformed, he would still end up weaker than Freeza.

It would be like this:

Freeza

• 1st Form - 0,5
  2nd Form - 1
  3rd Form - 2
  True Form - 3
  • 50% - 60
    100% - 120

Cold

• 1st Form - 1
  2nd Form (the one we saw)- 2
  3rd Form - 3
  True Form - 4
  Full Power - 80

My theory is that Cold is overpowered by Freeza because Freeza learned through training to increase his muscle-mass (like Muten Roshi did), while Coola found out how to transform through training.

[RandomGuy96]

But going by that, Freeza would still be a tiny bit stronger than Cold even without bulking up- 84 vs 80. Plus, I don't think 80 is "somewhat" lower than 120.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

But going by that, Freeza would still be a tiny bit stronger than Cold even without bulking up- 84 vs 80. Plus, I don't think 80 is "somewhat" lower than 120.

Why shouldn't 50% Freeza be stronger than Cold? And I didn't make him stronger, I placed Freeza at 60 & Cold at 80 (Cold can't bulk up), which means that Cold is stronger. But Freeza can power-up even more, making him 120, which is a x1.5 difference in their powers, which is a big difference. Why should Cold be "somewhat" weaker than Freeza anyway? Is this said anywhere?

[RandomGuy96]

But going by that, Freeza would still be a tiny bit stronger than Cold even without bulking up- 84 vs 80. Plus, I don't think 80 is "somewhat" lower than 120.

Why shouldn't 50% Freeza be stronger than Cold? And I didn't make him stronger, I placed Freeza at 60 & Cold at 80 (Cold can't bulk up), which means that Cold is stronger. But Freeza can power-up even more, making him 120, which is a x1.5 difference in their powers, which is a big difference. Why should Cold be "somewhat" weaker than Freeza anyway? Is this said anywhere?

50% Freeza isn't stronger than Cold. But that's not the extent of Freeza's 'normal' power. That's what he calls his 70%. You said that Freeza only surpassed Cold with the ki muscle mass boost, which didn't match up with the level you gave him.

Yeah, in the Daizenshuu. The exact words were in his bio:

Freeza's father. He is a shadowy presence in the organization, and nobody knows of his existence apart from his family and his direct subordinates, not even the Ginyu Special-Squad. Though he's the head of the strongest family in the universe, he is somewhat inferior to Freeza.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

50% Freeza isn't stronger than Cold. But that's not the extent of Freeza's 'normal' power. That's what he calls his 70%.

Didn't Freeza bulk up when he went beyond 50%?

You said that Cold only surpassed Freeza with the ki muscle mass boost, which didn't match up with the level you gave him.

I said that Freeza surpassed Cold, not that Cold surpassed Freeza.

Yeah, in the Daizenshuu. The exact words were in his bio:

Freeza's father. He is a shadowy presence in the organization, and nobody knows of his existence apart from his family and his direct subordinates, not even the Ginyu Special-Squad. Though he's the head of the strongest family in the universe, he is somewhat inferior to Freeza.

Cold

• 1st Form - 2
  2nd Form (the one we saw)- 3
  3rd Form - 4
  True Form - 5
  • Full Power - 110

I think this fits better. Mecha Freeza was also stronger than before, so this makes Cold somewhat inferior to Freeza both when they are in full power & in the state they were when we saw them.

[RandomGuy96]

Didn't Freeza bulk up when he went beyond 50%?

Ummm... he didn't look any more muscular when he mentioned he was at " about 70%", not to mention we don't know exactly when he powered up to that level. So I think that it was his max, and his "100%" is actually a SS Grade II like form that raises his power by 50% or so.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Didn't Freeza bulk up when he went beyond 50%?

Ummm... he didn't look any more muscular when he mentioned he was at " about 70%", not to mention we don't know exactly when he powered up to that level. So I think that it was his max, and his "100%" is actually a SS Grade II like form that raises his power by 50% or so.

Heh, never noticed that line about 70%. Just checked, and you are right. So yeah, 70% must be Freeza's max until he powers-up.

[Saiga]

Doesn't the Daizenshuu seem to use "somewhat" for any sort of gap, not necessarily implying that it's a small one?

On topic... yeah, I don't know. Seems the Dragon Book thinks so, but I don't know if that's good enough for me. I used to think that Freeza's race was constantly mutating, and at first everyone's true form was like Chilled, then mutated to be more like Cold, then like Freeza, who then went and created forms to resemble the forms of his ancestors and also he likes Ridley Scott so that's why the third form was in there. Which would mean Cold doesn't have any transformations, but I don't know about that idea any more.

[hleV]

I believe Cold can transform, but is still inferior to Freeza. I also believe that Cold's 2nd form (which we see him in) is inferior to Freeza's 2nd form. When they landed on Earth, Gohan & Kuririn talked about them sensing Freeza and another very powerful being. Later Gohan says that Freeza can get much, much stronger. So 2nd form Cold could've been 1,000,000 (inferior to 2nd form Freeza's over 1,000,000) while Mecha Freeza could've been at ~1% of his true power, which would be superior to 2nd form Cold.

[Godo]

I believe that Cold could hypothetically transform into other forms, and that the form we saw him in wasn't his final form.
I'd say that he was weaker than Freeza, mostly because of that he wanted to have Trunks as his son so that the most powerful fighter would stay in the Cold family. Going by that, Freeza was the strongest by that point of the two of them.
If I had to give him a max power compared to Freeza, I would put him as 90,000,000, because there would have to be a sizable difference between Cold and Freeza to see Freeza to be held in such a high regard and have so much power in their family.
After all this is a man who doesn't mourn the death of his own son and quickly wants to find a replacement, even if it is a Saiya-jin.

[FireLordZuko]

I would imagine Toriyama would have let him transform if he could.

[TheGmGoken]

I THINK his "Second" form is his final form. This is because I think he has enough power for transformation but doesn't need all that surpression. But he only appeared for such a short time that we have no anwser. I do think he has a 100% form though. I also think he just Big and strong(Muscle wise) which might just be a trait rather than a transformation. Like his "First form" is big as well just not as big while his second and final form is his bigggest and strongest.

[Gyt Kaliba]

Even without official statements hinting that he could potentially transform, I had always chalked it up to the possibility that he could, simply because both Freeza and Cooler did. I just never saw any reason to doubt that he could.

[ZombieVito]

I believe Cold can transform, but is still inferior to Freeza. I also believe that Cold's 2nd form (which we see him in) is inferior to Freeza's 2nd form. When they landed on Earth, Gohan & Kuririn talked about them sensing Freeza and another very powerful being. Later Gohan says that Freeza can get much, much stronger. So 2nd form Cold could've been 1,000,000 (inferior to 2nd form Freeza's over 1,000,000) while Mecha Freeza could've been at ~1% of his true power, which would be superior to 2nd form Cold.

If this was the case Trunks wouldn't need SSJ.

[dbzfan7]

I don't believe he can transform.