Can King Cold transform?

Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
User avatar
TheGmGoken
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10592
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:19 pm
Location: Capsule Corps

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by TheGmGoken » Mon Dec 09, 2013 1:57 pm

Zombie wrote:
hleV wrote:I believe Cold can transform, but is still inferior to Freeza. I also believe that Cold's 2nd form (which we see him in) is inferior to Freeza's 2nd form. When they landed on Earth, Gohan & Kuririn talked about them sensing Freeza and another very powerful being. Later Gohan says that Freeza can get much, much stronger. So 2nd form Cold could've been 1,000,000 (inferior to 2nd form Freeza's over 1,000,000) while Mecha Freeza could've been at ~1% of his true power, which would be superior to 2nd form Cold.
If this was the case Trunks wouldn't need SSJ.
Trunks heard them talking about a SSJ so Trunks showed them one. Besides if SSj Goku beaten Freeza(Someone Trunks was taught that Goku was the best) then Trunks would use SSJ to beat Freeza as well. Then he killed Cold. Then he reverts. Why revert after killing Freeza?

User avatar
Kamiccolo9
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10371
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:32 pm
Location: Regensburg, Germany

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 2:02 pm

Zombie wrote:
hleV wrote:I believe Cold can transform, but is still inferior to Freeza. I also believe that Cold's 2nd form (which we see him in) is inferior to Freeza's 2nd form. When they landed on Earth, Gohan & Kuririn talked about them sensing Freeza and another very powerful being. Later Gohan says that Freeza can get much, much stronger. So 2nd form Cold could've been 1,000,000 (inferior to 2nd form Freeza's over 1,000,000) while Mecha Freeza could've been at ~1% of his true power, which would be superior to 2nd form Cold.
If this was the case Trunks wouldn't need SSJ.
For that matter, so could Vegeta or Piccolo.
Champion of the 1st Kanzenshuu Short Story Tenkaichi Budokai
Kamiccolo9's Kompendium of Short Stories
Cipher wrote:If Vegeta does not kill Gohan, I will stop illegally streaming the series.
Malik_DBNA wrote:
Scarz wrote:Malik, stop. People are asking me for lewd art of possessed Bra (with Vegeta).
"Achievement Unlocked: Rule 34"

User avatar
RandomGuy96
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 8881
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 3:57 pm
Location: San Diego, California, USA

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by RandomGuy96 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 2:09 pm

Vegeta and Piccolo were quite intimidated by both powers and put them in the same league. I highly doubt that the power they were sensing was that weak. Not to mention that Freeza can't even suppress himself that low.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.

User avatar
hleV
Banned
Posts: 3325
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:15 pm
Location: Lithuania

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by hleV » Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:26 pm

Zombie wrote:If this was the case Trunks wouldn't need SSJ.
Yes he would, because Freeza can seemlessly power up.

User avatar
DBZGTKOSDH
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 12401
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:45 pm
Location: Greece

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:49 pm

FireLordZuko wrote:I would imagine Toriyama would have let him transform if he could.
That's why I believe that he can't transform in the manga. But since an anime-guidebook implies that he can, the anime Cold can do it.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

User avatar
FoolsGil
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5039
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 10:37 pm

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by FoolsGil » Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:36 pm

Something I brought up once before on a different topic:
You know in hindsight, Toryama should have have Cold coming to Earth in a Final Form, but he probably thought the second form that Freeza had was more awesome-I know I like it, and it makes sense why Toryama didn't bother having him [Cold] transform against Trunks-Cold was a means to an end.He needed Trunks to come to the past, but he wanted Trunks to be mysterious and cool so he brought in Freeza to attack Earth to show what Trunks can do, but since Freeza has no way to get to Earth, He came up with Cold, thought 2nd form was the most cool/intimidating, had Cold pick Freeza up take to Earth and have Trunks kill Freeza, and to tie up loose ends, Trunks kills Cold because that part of the story is over and it was time to learn about Androids and the Future.
Could King Cold Transform? Yes. Was it important to the story? No. Would it have unnecessary made a story arc when we should be learning about the Future? Yes. So it didn't happen.

On to the thought King Cold is weaker than Freeza, I initially thought King Cold was slightly stronger than Freeza. Researching this, I came up inconclusive. At one point Freeza tells Trunks he's the strongest in the universe in front of his father. People take this for face value: Besides the fact Vegeta talks like that all the time though we have seen the Saiyans are inferior to a lot of races, I don't think it would look good to be undermined in front of the enemy, which is why Cold would say nothing but imo if Cold and Freeza destroyed Earth they would have a little "chat." afterwards in private. Either way I suppose I'm on the Freeza >>>> Cold Wagon, but a thought: it's never stated how weak King Cold is. If he is in the 2nd form and he needs to go up 2 more, is he 50% weaker, or 25% weaker in his final form? or is the % so nil that even if Freeza was stronger that wouldn't mean that if the two came to conflict it would be the smarter opponent who would win? Because in the end, we use stronger power levels to decide who would win in a fight-If Freeza is stronger, by how much exactly?

User avatar
Hellspawn28
Patreon Supporter
Posts: 15737
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:16 pm

I used to thought he was stronger then Freeza going by the Viz manga line and the line from Vegeta in the Japanese dub from what I can remember. I would imagine he could transform if AT didn't kill him off. Having Goku and Trunks team up to fight a bigger threat and someone stronger then Freeza would have made Cold less useless for once.
She/Her
PS5 username: Guyver_Spawn_27

rereboy
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 10262
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:42 pm

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by rereboy » Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:25 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:I used to thought he was stronger then Freeza going by the Viz manga line and the line from Vegeta in the Japanese dub from what I can remember. I would imagine he could transform if AT didn't kill him off. Having Goku and Trunks team up to fight a bigger threat and someone stronger then Freeza would have made Cold less useless for once.
And how would Goku have defeated Cold and Freeza in the future if it would take two SSJs to defeat Cold? I wouldn't mind if Cold had transformed and he was actually stronger than Freeza... As long as Trunks still killed him in a quick but intense fight.

User avatar
freezamite
Banned
Posts: 392
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:57 pm

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by freezamite » Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:54 pm

Can Nail regenerate a leg if he needs? Yes, he's Freezer's father, his form resembles the one of Freezer a lot and nothing is said to contradict that.
In fact, Freezer didn't transform to power up, he transformed to power down. In other words, Cold was already transformed, so the question should be if he could dis-transform himself, and the answer is a solid yes to me.
If he is in the 2nd form and he needs to go up 2 more, is he 50% weaker, or 25% weaker in his final form? or is the % so nil that even if Freeza was stronger that wouldn't mean that if the two came to conflict it would be the smarter opponent who would win? Because in the end, we use stronger power levels to decide who would win in a fight-If Freeza is stronger, by how much exactly?
I would put Cold at around 50% Freezer's maximum strength, with the same drawbacks that Freezer had when it came to use his maximum strength.
I had on mind a thread regarding those facts supported by what we know through the manga, and this is what makes more sense to me.

User avatar
dario03
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1357
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 2:36 pm

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by dario03 » Tue Dec 10, 2013 2:57 pm

Maybe the forms don't go in the same order for looks. Maybe Cold is in his true form but his true form just looks like Freeza's second form. Perhaps his lower forms look completely different or like Freeza's first, third, and final form.

User avatar
KentalSSJ6
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6473
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:03 am
Location: Chicago, Illinois.

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by KentalSSJ6 » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:42 pm

I dont care if he can or not, and if he can, its like I said before, I'm all for more transformations if they are executed properly.

For example, Multiverse has given us a good 4th form cold and theres a amazing fanart of Cold in the fifth form.
Deviantart (NSFW) - http://yamato012.deviantart.com/
DBSW Group Page - http://dbsw.deviantart.com/
Still the 1k Sniper - [spoiler]http://orig10.deviantart.net/6a02/f/201 ... 8npe7r.png[/spoiler]

User avatar
goku the krump dancer
I Live Here
Posts: 3678
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2009 10:34 pm

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by goku the krump dancer » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:26 pm

No mouth piece for the fifth form? Also the image at the bottom makes it seem as though Cold is bursting out of a onesie lol.
It's not too late. One day, it will be.
Peace And Power MF DOOM!
Peace and Power Kevin Samuels

User avatar
KentalSSJ6
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6473
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:03 am
Location: Chicago, Illinois.

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by KentalSSJ6 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:25 am

goku the krump dancer wrote:No mouth piece for the fifth form? Also the image at the bottom makes it seem as though Cold is bursting out of a onesie lol.
Always hated that mouth piece that Cooler had. If he got it from the start id be fine but the way it just pops up like the part of a machine always seemed stupid to me.
Deviantart (NSFW) - http://yamato012.deviantart.com/
DBSW Group Page - http://dbsw.deviantart.com/
Still the 1k Sniper - [spoiler]http://orig10.deviantart.net/6a02/f/201 ... 8npe7r.png[/spoiler]

User avatar
Polyphase Avatron
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6643
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:48 am

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Wed Dec 11, 2013 6:57 am

I think he can, and if he did he would be potentially as strong as 16. or stronger.
Cool stuff that I upload here because Youtube will copyright claim it: https://vimeo.com/user60967147

User avatar
Jackal puFF
I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
Posts: 1684
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 2:24 pm
Contact:

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by Jackal puFF » Fri Dec 13, 2013 6:24 am

I always thought he was in his 2nd form. Looks exactly like Frieza's 2nd form.

And if he isn't.. How long would it take Frieza to get that big? I mean he's already super old right?

User avatar
Friezacooler
Regular
Posts: 694
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2013 2:13 am

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by Friezacooler » Fri Dec 13, 2013 3:57 pm

King Cold, Lord Chilled and Freeza are nearly on the same level. Regarding losing to a Super Saiyan, Cooler is confirmed stronger than Freeza; that doesn't necessarily mean he surpassed King Cold or Lord Chilled as he lost to (a) SSj1 too. Regarding King Cold, one would assume if Frieza and Cooler are his relatives/sons then obviously he has the ability to transform. Whether the form shown in the Dragonball universe is his first form, median or last form is a different unanswerable question that only Tori-Bot, Akira Toriyama or other legal sources can answer. Unil then stick to the fact that the transformations shown are all equal regarding losing to (a) SSj1 except SSj1 except Cooler > Freeza (huh?!).

User avatar
SSJ4_Zankuto
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 378
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:43 pm
Location: South Wales
Contact:

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by SSJ4_Zankuto » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:19 pm

I think King Cold might have had one or two transformations left in his disposal and didn't use them against Super Saiyan Trunks for some reason.

User avatar
Nazi Cola
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1072
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:25 pm
Location: Inside you

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by Nazi Cola » Fri Dec 13, 2013 11:40 pm

Eh, the Dragon Books also say Pure Boo is the strongest Boo, so I'm not sure how much I can trust their judgment here.
CatouttaHell wrote:I guess he's just impossibly powerful and he now gets thrills from letting things go as much to hell as possible before busting out his ultimate power and ending the villain or some shit.

User avatar
KentalSSJ6
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6473
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:03 am
Location: Chicago, Illinois.

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by KentalSSJ6 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 12:03 am

Nazi Cola wrote:Eh, the Dragon Books also say Pure Boo is the strongest Boo, so I'm not sure how much I can trust their judgment here.
I think it says that because Pure Buu is crazy and durable enough to survive blowing up a planet. He blew earth up knowing he was on it yet did it anyway with a laugh.

I can see him being listed as the strongest due to his unpredictability.
Deviantart (NSFW) - http://yamato012.deviantart.com/
DBSW Group Page - http://dbsw.deviantart.com/
Still the 1k Sniper - [spoiler]http://orig10.deviantart.net/6a02/f/201 ... 8npe7r.png[/spoiler]

User avatar
RandomGuy96
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 8881
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 3:57 pm
Location: San Diego, California, USA

Re: Can King Cold transform?

Post by RandomGuy96 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 3:33 am

Nazi Cola wrote:Eh, the Dragon Books also say Pure Boo is the strongest Boo, so I'm not sure how much I can trust their judgment here.
Well, in the anime that's kinda-sorta-not-really true. So perhaps the transformation note only applies to anime King Cold, who's far stronger than canon King Cold given what he says about Freeza.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.

Post Reply