When exactly does Goku learn to fly?

[Draken]

Well if Goku's most powerful version of Kamehameha that he charged with all intents and purposes to kill Piccolo hardly seemed to drain him of energy, I don't think random generic kamehameha's would drain much energy either.

Less energy than flying? Seeing as Videl, of all people, is capable of basic flight later on, energy consumption shouldn't have been a concern for Goku if he was capable of flying all throughout the fight.

So if it doesn't drain much energy either way what's wrong with the idea that Goku saved it for an ace in the hole?

On the other hand why doesn't Goku fly with the alien style Kami/Piccolo used if he learned it during training with Kami...

[Kamiccolo9]

Well if Goku's most powerful version of Kamehameha that he charged with all intents and purposes to kill Piccolo hardly seemed to drain him of energy, I don't think random generic kamehameha's would drain much energy either.

Less energy than flying? Seeing as Videl, of all people, is capable of basic flight later on, energy consumption shouldn't have been a concern for Goku if he was capable of flying all throughout the fight.

So if it doesn't drain much energy either way what's wrong with the idea that Goku saved it for an ace in the hole?

On the other hand why doesn't Goku fly with the alien style Kami/Piccolo used if he learned it during training with Kami...

One would think, all energy consumption problems aside, that simply flying would be easier than aiming himself with a Kamehameha.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

On the other hand why doesn't Goku fly with the alien style Kami/Piccolo used if he learned it during training with Kami...

Maybe he didn't learn it during his training with Kami?

[Draken]

One would think, all energy consumption problems aside, that simply flying would be easier than aiming himself with a Kamehameha.

But it looks so much cooler

[Saiga]

@rereboy We don't know that the other techniques consume more energy. Again, he's still reliant on Kinto'un in the Saiyan arc and crosses Snake Way the first time without flight. While Super Kamehameha are nothing to him.

Also, I've always thought that Gohan should be using whatever technique Piccolo is, rather than Bukujutsu. Since he learned flight after training with Piccolo. And then Videl and Goten would also have that technique passed onto them.

[Draken]

@rereboy We don't know that the other techniques consume more energy. Again, he's still reliant on Kinto'un in the Saiyan arc and crosses Snake Way the first time without flight. While Super Kamehameha are nothing to him.

Also, I've always thought that Gohan should be using whatever technique Piccolo is, rather than Bukujutsu. Since he learned flight after training with Piccolo. And then Videl and Goten would also have that technique passed onto them.

I feel like Gohan probably did, seeing as even someone as weak as Videl can fly without too much strain unless she's trying to go as fast as someone millions of times more powerful than her.

[rereboy]

@rereboy We don't know that the other techniques consume more energy. Again, he's still reliant on Kinto'un in the Saiyan arc and crosses Snake Way the first time without flight. While Super Kamehameha are nothing to him.

Also, I've always thought that Gohan should be using whatever technique Piccolo is, rather than Bukujutsu. Since he learned flight after training with Piccolo. And then Videl and Goten would also have that technique passed onto them.

My point is that he goes out of his way to figure out ways that substitute flying when flying would be easier if he actually knew the technique. I see no point in him hiding it and I don't find it coherent with his personality and his fighting style. Learning and using the technique on the spot because he needed it, though? That's classic Goku.

And Kintoun is a supersonic cloud. Its doubtful that Goku could fly faster than it in the Saiyan saga or even keep up with it. The fact that he rides it to face the Saiyans pretty much proves that he can't fly faster than it at that point, otherwise he would since everyone was in mortal danger.

[Draken]

Piccolo kept up no problem.

[Saiga]

Your point relies on the assumption that flight would be easier if he knew it. I'm saying that it's possible that this isn't the case.

[rereboy]

Piccolo kept up no problem.

How do you know Goku was using the cloud's top speed? Gohan wasn't in immediate mortal danger since Raditz had given Goku 24 hours to decide and arriving without Piccolo would be suicidal. So, Goku would match Piccolo's speed if he couldn't keep up with the cloud.

[Saiga]

So then why is he even using the cloud if not for the speed?

[rereboy]

Your point relies on the assumption that flight would be easier if he knew it. I'm saying that it's possible that this isn't the case.

Not the fight itself but the numerous times he avoids falling off bounds or has to change direction in the air. He actively goes out of his way to do it.

Sure, doing all that instead of flying probably didn't make any real difference in regards to the result of the fight or to the energy consumption... But why would he do it? Would Goku act that way? Do you really see Goku doing all that on purpose instead of just flying? Isn't it much more his style to just be straightforward about stuff? Wouldn't it be much more like Goku to just figure out a technique that he needed? And isn't that what appears to happen?

Seems obvious to me that him knowing how to fly before that moment makes less sense and is less coherent with Goku's personality and his fighting style.

So then why is he even using the cloud if not for the speed?

That way he doesn't spend any energy getting there. That makes it a much more efficient method of arriving to a battle.

[Draken]

Piccolo wasn't at all tired when he made it to the battlefield.

[Saiga]

Not the fight itself but the numerous times he avoids falling off bounds or has to change direction in the air. He actively goes out of his way to do it.

Sure, doing all that instead of flying probably didn't make any real difference in regards to the result of the fight or to the energy consumption... But why would he do it? Would Goku act that way? Do you really see Goku doing all that on purpose instead of just flying? Isn't it much more his style to just be straightforward about stuff? Wouldn't it be much more like Goku to just figure out a technique that he needed? And isn't that what appears to happen?

Seems obvious to me that him knowing how to fly before that moment makes less sense and is less coherent with Goku's personality and his fighting style.

Like I said, I think he avoids it because he's not used to flying yet. But he has been doing stuff like propelling himself with a Kamehameha for a while.

That way he doesn't spend any energy getting there. That makes it a much more efficient method of arriving to a battle.

Exactly. That was my entire reason for why he still uses the cloud - because of the energy consumption of flying.

[TenshiGokuu]

he learns to fly in raditz saga

[Flame Dragon]

My theory:

Flying has a fixed ki cost.
When he first learned how to fly, his energy reserves were quite low for the high energy cost of the technique. So he didn't use it often. So he prefered to use Kinto'un to save energy, especially if he needed the energy later for a big fight.
However, training not only makes you stronger, but also increases your stamina.
So the energy cost that was once very taxing, became negligible. So after training with King Kai, he felt like the technique was not that draining anymore.
After the Saiyan Saga, Goku started using Kinto'un less and less until he replaced it with flying, which probably was faster.
By flying that much, he mastered combat in the air and the ki control for bukujutsu, so the energy cost became pratically null and he felt at ease as much in the air as the ground.

As for Videl, she never needed to save energy for big fights, and she didn't have a less taxing alternative (Kinto'un) so she was forced to fly for transportation, so she mastered the technique much quicker.
And also it was said Humans are more precise at ki control. However even after that she still was not able to keep up with Gohan and Kibito flying, so maybe she coudln't fly as fast because she had a lower stamina.

[rereboy]

Piccolo wasn't at all tired when he made it to the battlefield.

Spending some energy wouldn't make him tired. But the energy is still spent.

[Tyro]

Pretty sure they said somewhere Piccolo uses a different style of bukujustsu than the rest of the cast.

In the Japanese anime, right before Goku and Piccolo are about to take off, Goku asks Piccolo if he can keep up with Kinto'un. Piccolo replies that his technique may be different from Bukujutsu but there is no need to doubt his speed. I'm unsure if this is in the Japanese manga.

[deadguy366]

When Goku flew in the 23rd tournament I was convinced it was the first time he had ever used the flying technique. Goku has always had the ability to use and master a technique after only seeing it once or twice. He attempted it as a last resort. If he had learned it previous to that moment we would've seen him flying already. Hence the reason he still used kamehamehas and such instead of just flying.

He doesn't fully master the technique enough to be able to use it all the time without using up all of his energy until after he completes his training with King Kaio. Which explains why he can only fly for a very short stretch before using up all his energy when he first starts travelling snake way. And also why he still uses kinto un up until that point.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

He doesn't fully master the technique enough to be able to use it all the time without using up all of his energy until after he completes his training with King Kaio.

Nitpicking here, but saying "King Kaio" is redundant.

Kaio
Kaio's name is made up of 界/kai, 'world', and 王/ou, 'king', making him “King of the Worlds”. The mark he wears on his clothes and prints on Goku’s uniform is a combination of界 and 王.