If we assume the movies are the result of a divergence

[Hellspawn28]

Trunks is nowhere to be mention in Movie 5. Goku would have told Coola that he was not the one that killed Freeza.

[RandomGuy96]

Trunks is nowhere to be mention in Movie 5. Goku would have told Coola that he was not the one that killed Freeza.

Why would he do that? Why would he care when there was barley a moment where Cooler wasn't actively trying to kill him?

[Polyphase Avatron]

Trunks is nowhere to be mention in Movie 5. Goku would have told Coola that he was not the one that killed Freeza.

Why would he do that? Why would he care when there was barley a moment where Cooler wasn't actively trying to kill him?

Goku is naive. He might think that if Cooler knew he wasn't responsible for his brother's death then he might stop attacking him.

[some_weirdGuy]

That reminds me of the other thing I thought of with the cooler movie, which was that maybe it was set in future trunk's timeline.

That infographic on the first page was pretty neat, pretty much exactly the sort of thing I was going for with this thread. I kinda like to think there are maybe 4 'timelines' max, and that each movie fits into atleast one of them, bonus points if they'd also fit within the timelines of trunks' time travelling ('main' timeline, future timeline, alternate main [with only trunks not cell], and alternate future [where cell then came from])

[RandomGuy96]

Trunks is nowhere to be mention in Movie 5. Goku would have told Coola that he was not the one that killed Freeza.

Why would he do that? Why would he care when there was barley a moment where Cooler wasn't actively trying to kill him?

Goku is naive. He might think that if Cooler knew he wasn't responsible for his brother's death then he might stop attacking him.

I... don't think he's quite that dumb.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I... don't think he's quite that dumb.

He let Raditz go and gave Cell a senzu bean.

[RandomGuy96]

I... don't think he's quite that dumb.

He let Raditz go and gave Cell a senzu bean.

I don't think those are the same as this. Not even remotely. MAYBE the case of Raditz, but that's still different, and Goku should know better by now.

[garnetjester]

Also, the Cell thing was different because he just wanted for Gohan to have a better opponent. I think he might be dense about a lot of stuff, but when it comes to fighting he's not that dumb (bar the Raditz thing and possibly Freeza's second chance, although he had already one in that occasion, so it didn't really matter what he did with Freeza by then) I think the rest of his stupid fight-related things were more irresponsible than dumb, like giving Piccolo and Cell senzu beans and letting Vegeta escape just because of the prospect of more exciting fights in the future.

[Zephyr]

Made a thread on this a while back:

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... +timelines

To summarize:

Movie Timeline 1 [1, 2, 3, 4]:
Because Movie 1 occurs, Gohan's power is known prior to the Saiyan arc, resulting in him being trained a bit by Goku before Raditz, making him more capable during the fight with Nappa and Vegeta. This essentially saves Goku from getting as brutal of a beating, allowing him to travel with Bulma, Gohan, and Krillin to Namek. Because Goku and Freeza would be tough to deal with simultaneously, Vegeta teams up with them much earlier. This leads to Freeza being beaten in his first form. They revive their friends, and Movies 2, 3, and 4 are able to happen.

Movie Timeline 2 [5, 6]:
Goku doesn't linger in space, and never masters SSj transformation. Trunks comes back to tell of the Androids. This leads to Movie 5, where he cannot transform at will. Seeing how helpless they were against a random invader who is supposed to be drastically inferior to the Androids, Piccolo and Kami agree to fuse in order to give them an extra edge. Piccolo here isn't as strong as he is in the main timeline, because he has less training with SSj Goku under his belt at the time of his fusion with Kami. This prompts bringing Dende to Earth to be the new Kami. The Big Gete Star nabs Coola, and Movie 6 happens.

Movie Timeline 3 [7]:
Since Cell wasn't around, Kami wasn't convinced to fuse with Piccolo. The blueprints found in Gero's lab were used to build a controller, which shut down #17 and #18. Movie 7 stems from this.

Movie Timeline 4 [8, 10, 11]:
The "Vegeta doesn't ruin everyone's plans" timeline. He goes to finish off Semi-Perfect Cell, who escapes via Taiyoken and goes into hiding. Goku and Gohan leave the RoSaT early. Movie 8 occurs, because Paragus, who was keeping a close eye on Earth, saw that things were safe. Afterwards, Cell sneakily nabs #18 and becomes Perfect, announces the Cell Games, etc. Seven years later, Movie 10 happens while Gohan and co. train for the 25th TB. When The Saiyans are confronting Babidi, Vegeta stays patient long enough for Babidi and Dabura to be slain. He gets his rematch with Goku afterwards. Goku leaves. Later on, Movie 11 happens, because #18 still bribed Mr. Satan.

Movie Timeline 5 [12]:
Ultimate/Mystic Gohan finishes Buu without letting him pull any shenanigans. Universe is saved, Goku and Vegeta are dead still. Movie 12 goes down. Black haired Gohan can one-shot Final Form Freeza.

Movies 9, 13, the JSAT, and BoG all fit well enough in the main timeline that I don't feel any of them are the result of alternate universes.

[RandomGuy96]

Ultimate/Mystic Gohan finishes Buu without letting him pull any shenanigans. Universe is saved, Goku and Vegeta are dead still. Movie 12 goes down. Black haired Gohan can one-shot Final Form Freeza.

Movies 9, 13, the JSAT, and BoG all fit well enough in the main timeline that I don't feel any of them are the result of alternate universes.

Goku said Fat Janemba was the greatest power he ever felt, so Ultimate Gohan can't be a thing in this universe.

Movies 9 and 14 actually have faaaaaaaar more errors than Movie 5.

[xmysticgohanx]

That reminds me of the other thing I thought of with the cooler movie, which was that maybe it was set in future trunk's timeline.

I agree with this.

[Kid Buu]

Movie 1 takes place if Goku didn't let go off Raditz tail.

[Zephyr]

Goku said Fat Janemba was the greatest power he ever felt, so Ultimate Gohan can't be a thing in this universe.

Movies 9 and 14 actually have faaaaaaaar more errors than Movie 5.

Well in that case I guess the point of divergence would have to be Goku finishing Buu off when he first demonstrates SSj3.

I know Movie 14 has plenty of (easily reconcilable) errors, but what mistakes does 9 have?

[RandomGuy96]

Gohan in the Buu Saga states he hasn't seen is father since the Cell Games.

[Zephyr]

That's not far more errors than Movie 5, though. That's not even as bad of an error. Movie 5's error involves what a specific character is capable of, which requires a divergent timeline to occur. Movie 9's error can simply be explained with semantics and interpreting Gohan's line differently.

[RandomGuy96]

That's not far more errors than Movie 5, though. That's not even as bad of an error. Movie 5's error involves what a specific character is capable of, which requires a divergent timeline to occur. Movie 9's error can simply be explained with semantics and interpreting Gohan's line differently.

It is "far more", as M5 has no errors.

No divergent timeline required. It's just typical Toei fight logic. Have the hero fight in a lower form and get stomped even though he has a higher form he can use at any time. The exact same thing happens in Movie 13.

[Zephyr]

No divergent timeline required. It's just typical Toei fight logic. Have the hero fight in a lower form and get stomped even though he has a higher form he can use at any time. The exact same thing happens in Movie 13.

So you're saying Goku intentionally didn't transform? I never once gathered that from the movie. I feel like that's more of a stretch than a simple not-100%-literal-interpretation of Gohan's line in the Buu arc.

And by "higher form" in Movie 13, do you mean Goku's finishing attack on Hildegarn?

[RandomGuy96]

No divergent timeline required. It's just typical Toei fight logic. Have the hero fight in a lower form and get stomped even though he has a higher form he can use at any time. The exact same thing happens in Movie 13.

So you're saying Goku intentionally didn't transform? I never once gathered that from the movie. I feel like that's more of a stretch than a simple not-100%-literal-interpretation of Gohan's line in the Buu arc.

And by "higher form" in Movie 13, do you mean Goku's finishing attack on Hildegarn?

Not a stretch at all. He does this in literally every movie.

I mean SS3.

He also doesn't use KK in Movie 4 when Slug is beating him to death. He doesn't use SS in Movie 7 until after 13 kicks the shit out of him. Tries to fight SS Broly in base in Movie 8. Etc.

[Zephyr]

Well that's fair I guess. But that still seems erroneous, in every single one of those cases, from an in-universe perspective. Just feels out of character. I mean I guess you can use the "Goku's just being a silly Saiyan and dragging the battle on because he gets off on it" explanation, which he does numerous times in the manga. But in the manga, he only seemed to do that when he and his opponent were equals, not when he was getting pulverized by his opponent.

So I guess the real question at hand is "do out of character moments count as errors?"

[Hellspawn28]

Movie 6 was most likely written as a what if given that the movie came out a year before the Cell Games happen in the manga. I still believe that both Coola movies take place in the same universe and Kami must have known about #17 & #18 arriving. Unless #17 and #18 are weak as shit in the Coola universe.