Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[ZombieVito]

I guess it's just preference, AT did group them in the same tier. They could even be equal.

[RandomGuy96]

I guess it's just preference, AT did group them in the same tier. They could even be equal.

Well, the Daizenshuu said King Vegeta was stronger, and even if AT grouped them together in the same tier, that doesn't mean they're equal, just that no others came close to them. I'm not sure what's wrong with having the king stronger here.

Normally people bitch at me for having my power levels too low in their eyes. It's almost refreshing to be bitched at for the opposite.

So you're just going to act condescending instead of answering any of my questions? K.

[ZombieVito]

Interesting, I was unaware of that. Do you have the quote by any chance?

[Kaboom]

So you're just going to act condescending instead of answering any of my questions? K.

My tone was intended as humorous, not condescending. I apologize, Mr. Pot.

Why? Raditz was an actual warrior, Gine was unfit for fighting and apparently was so worthless that Bardock had to save her all the time, and was better used as lunch lady.

Because...

A) Toriyama only cited her personality as her weakness, not her power, so she could very well still have "average" power for an adult Saiyan, and...
B) Having even gentle and non-combatant people be stronger than Raditz is funny.

Berry's evil great-great-great grandson � 8,000

Who?

I was making a joke about the evil alien who accompanied Freeza looking somewhat like the Plantians from Episode of Bardock, but after actually comparing the two, they don't look as similar as I thought aside from the shape of their heads. I should stop making up power levels super late at night.

[RandomGuy96]

My tone was intended as humorous, not condescending. I apologize, Mr. Pot.

Oh. 's cool then. But you still didn't answer why Bardock was so high, when Toriyama explicitly said a saiyan would be promoted if their battle power was high enough, and Bardock spent a whole month on Vegeta apparently stronger than Nappa.

Because...

A) Toriyama only cited her personality as her weakness, not her power, so she could very well still have "average" power for an adult Saiyan, and...
B) Having even gentle and non-combatant people be stronger than Raditz is funny.

Would 1,800 really be "average"? I'd think that Raditz, who at 1,500 could one-shot common Freeza grunts (as shown when Gohan and weighted Krillin each take out those thugs on Namek), and was several times stronger than his low-class brother before special training, would be considered above average.

I was making a joke about the evil alien who accompanied Freeza looking somewhat like the Plantians from Episode of Bardock, but after actually comparing the two, they don't look as similar as I thought aside from the shape of their heads. I should stop making up power levels super late at night.

K. Speaking of peculiarly designed aliens, is it true that Abo and Kado are in the background of one shot?

Interesting, I was unaware of that. Do you have the quote by any chance?

D7 bio:
"Though he was the strongest Saiyan at the time, Freeza easily killed him without transforming."

[ZombieVito]

Thanks, I'll bump him to 10,000.

[Kaboom]

Oh. 's cool then. But you still didn't answer why Bardock was so high, when Toriyama explicitly said a Saiyan would be promoted if their battle power was high enough, and Bardock spent a whole month on Vegeta apparently stronger than Nappa.

I suspect there wouldn't any answer that I could force myself to believe and that you would be satisfied in. But in a nutshell, I consider the 4000-5000 range to be more or less where the "transition" from low-class to mid-class/elite can happen. Then an elite can be anywhere from that range up to almost 10,000.

Minus-Bardock may have broken into that transitional range, but there's no guarantee he'd get promoted while still being so relatively low. Nappa, however, may have been stronger once, and been weaker due to age in the Saiyan arc when he was around 4000-4500. I'd bet he's the oldest Saiyan we've ever had introduced.

Would 1,800 really be "average"? I'd think that Raditz, who at 1,500 could one-shot common Freeza grunts (as shown when Gohan and weighted Krillin each take out those thugs on Namek), and was several times stronger than his low-class brother before special training, would be considered above average.

That 1500-2000 range would be "average" for a Saiyan, but the way I see it Saiyans are typically stronger than most other races. Potentially even a lot stronger. Greatest warrior race in the universe and what-not.

K. Speaking of peculiarly designed aliens, is it true that Abo and Kado are in the background of one shot?

There is an alien that looks an awful lot like one of them, yes. But I doubt it's explicitly meant to actually be one of them.

[ZombieVito]

I like to believe it's them, nice tie in with the ova.

[RandomGuy96]

Anyway, my opinion on their powers:

Gine: 1,000

(typical low-class, more or less; strong enough to actually be in Bardock's squad, but weak enough to be effectively worthless in it)

Bardock: 2,500

(above any low-class, but still not quite advancing into elite territory, as Toriyama implied, even with a later zenkai boost in EOB)

Kakarot: 8

(Strong enough that he'd be dangerous to a regular human, but weak enough that Gohan can easily subdue him, and a little bit of training later only brings him up to 10 in time for the Pilaf arc)

Raditz: 750

Nappa: 4,500

Vegeta: 9,000

(Raditz and Vegeta are half of their adult selves; seems appropriate. Nappa doesn't actually appear here, but this is what I'd peg him at in this time period. That's the M3 pamphlet number for him, by the way. He's in his late fifties by the Saiyan arc and hasn't been training, so it's appropriate he'd be a bit stronger in his prime)

King Vegeta: 9,500

(But of course, the king remains the strongest saiyan, at OVER NINE THOUSAAAAAAAAND!)

Abo: 50,000

Kado: 50,000

Freeza: 530,000

(Abo and Kado are in the same general realm as the Ginyus. Freeza is as he always is; even if the strongest saiyans were to go SS, he'd still be the strongest thing around in just his 3rd suppression form.)

[ZombieVito]

Will they really be that stronger? Vegeta said they where toe and toe with the Ginyu's.

[RandomGuy96]

Will they really be that stronger? Vegeta said they where toe and toe with the Ginyu's.

I just recall him saying they were ranked with the Ginyus. Since the Ginyus vary so widely in power, with Guldo being around 10,000, Recoome/Jeice/Burter being around 40,000, and the Captain being at 120,000, I just took that to mean "way the hell stronger than Dodoria and Zarbon". They're still not so strong that the four weaker members can't beat one of the brothers by ganging up, or that Ginyu himself can't easily crush them at the same time and probably even beat Aka.

[ZombieVito]

Well Vegeta did say this:

I remember. At the time, they were the ones shoulder to shoulder with the Ginyu Special-Squad

And well you said it Guldo is too weak and Ginyu too strong. I take that quote as them rivaling Recoome, Burter and Jeice since they are rivals as well.

[Saiga]

Abo and Kado appeared in Minus? That's actually pretty neat. A continuity reference that makes sense and fits well.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

I don't think they are in it. Just a random alien that looks like them from what I recall.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Yeah, it's not them. Just a similar design.

[Saiga]

Aww, okay then.

No Dragon Ball Minus battle powers from me, anyway, I usually don't do any for stuff outside the original manga.

[DannyDBZfanforever]

Aww, okay then.

No Dragon Ball Minus battle powers from me, anyway, I usually don't do any for stuff outside the original manga.

What power levels from Dragon Ball Minus? Do you have a list? I'd like to see

[xmysticgohanx]

Can someone list all the official pre-Z power levels for me please.

Also Kaboom, is your 22,000 number for Dodoria official or conjecture?

[Kaboom]

Can someone list all the official pre-Z power levels for me please.
Also Kaboom, is your 22,000 number for Dodoria official or conjecture?

The site's battle power guide has a complete list of all official figures, with adjacent links to sources and explanations for them. And yes, Dodoria's 22,000 is among them.

[Saiga]

Aww, okay then.

No Dragon Ball Minus battle powers from me, anyway, I usually don't do any for stuff outside the original manga.

What power levels from Dragon Ball Minus? Do you have a list? I'd like to see

Nah, I was saying I don't have a Minus list since others were talking about what levels they had everyone at.