Was the Freeza saga just a rehash of the Saiyan saga?

[thatdbzguy]

The Freeza arc contains quite a few things that were similarily present in the Saiyan saga, particularly Goku's arrival. Do you think that the Freeza saga is just a rehash of the Saiyan arc, or are there still plenty of things that help separate the two?

[Gonstead]

Simple answer: No.

Long answer: What very few instances both arcs may share, they both have more than enough differences that make them original enough to not be compared to each other.

To think both are practically the same and that they're nothing more than rehashes is asinine.

[JackyBoi99]

Both arcs have a few similar aspects, but no the furiza arc was not a rehash of the saiyajin arc.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Hmmm. thinking about it, Goku always arrived pretty late to the party, maybe stretching here but:
Saiyan- dead, training with King Kai,
Frieza- injured in hospital
Cell arc- he had that disease, and later was in the HTC.
Buu Arc- was dead and arrived after Buu ate everyone iirc.

[Marco Polo]

It's a rehash because the villains were handled so poorly, right? But at least neither of these two sagas is the lowest rated saga I guess

[Kamiccolo9]

The Freeza arc contains quite a few things that were similarily present in the Saiyan saga, particularly Goku's arrival. Do you think that the Freeza saga is just a rehash of the Saiyan arc, or are there still plenty of things that help separate the two?

This thread contains quite a few things that were similarly present in your other threads, particularly (insert thread you have made in the last 3 months of your choice here.) Do you think that this thread is just a rehash of (insert thread you have made in the last 3 months of your choice here), or are there still plenty of things that help separate the two?

[samuraix123]

It's a rehash because the villains were handled so poorly, right? But at least neither of these two sagas is the lowest rated saga I guess

Haha this made me laugh. I don't think the Freeza saga was a rehash of the saiyan saga. I guess someone could argue Goku arriving late again to the fight but I think there's so much stuff going on in Freeza saga. Krillin being killed,Goku turning Super Saiyan,Planet about ready to explode haha

[Zephyr]

Saiyan Arc:
- Opens up with a mysterious figure coming and immediately starting a conflict in which the two most powerful enemies in the world must team up. Goku dies, and his son gets kidnapped.
- Goku trains for a year in the afterlife, mastering two new crucial techniques. When he is finished he arrives late to the battlefield, and almost everyone is dead.
- He defeats one of the two remaining antagonists effortlessly. The main battle then goes underway.
- Before long, Goku is in a bad spot. It eventually takes the cooperation of Gohan, Krillin, and Yajirobe to defeat the villain here.
- The four remaining a protagonists, and the one remaining antagonist not only survive, but knowingly go their separate ways to recover.


Namek Arc:
- Opens up with Bulma, Gohan, and Krillin going into space.
- They land on Namek, and fight a couple of soldiers.
- As Gohan and Krillin are making good will with the locals, Dende and the Grand Elder, Vegeta is tearing Freeza's army up, taking out many high ranking generals.
- Eventually the Ginyu Force arrives, and the heroes team up with Vegeta. After they're all but utterly decimated, Goku shows up and makes short work of their foes.
- Vegeta eats a Senzu, then runs away. Goku and Ginyu switch bodies for a tedious mini-arc.
- The Ginyus are eventually defeated, and Goku is put into a healing tank for a while. In the mean time, the Dragon Balls get used, and Piccolo comes back.
- Freeza's pissed, and starts fighting the crew, meanwhile Piccolo powers up further.
- Freeza transforms, fights Piccolo, transforms again, and transforms again. All but kills Vegeta, and completes the job right after Goku shows up.
- The main battle then goes underway. Before long, Goku is in a bad spot. But then, he uses the Genki Dama...which doesn't work.
- Krillin's killed, Piccolo's on the brink of death. Goku snaps and powers up immensely into a Super Saiyan.
- After getting his shit totally wrecked by the Super Saiyan, Freeza sends a blast to the planet's core, giving the planet 5 minutes to live.
- All but Goku and Freeza are teleported to Earth, via multi-Dragon tomfoolery. Goku eventually comes out on top, and Freeza makes a handful of last-ditch efforts to bring Goku down with him.
- Goku meant to let him go, but eventually has to put him down. Thinking Freeza's dead, he escapes into space. The fate of the two is left somewhat vague at the end.

So...

Goku's out of commission for some extent and arrives just in time to save the day, good guys and bad guys teaming up, Goku uses a Genki Dama and fails, somebody gets wished back to life after training...

I'm not seeing much else in common. And even these are very loose connections. They're certainly repeated plot points (but some of these have more far-reaching repetitiveness than these two arc alone), but that doesn't make them rehashes. Well, then I guess you'd need to define "rehash".

There are still an overwhelming number of things to separate the two.

[The Monkey King]

No, not even close.
Unless you're going to niptick, if so you could accuse all shonen manga of doing this.

[TheUltimateVegito]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1OyW3yWW-c&hd=1

[VegettoEX]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1OyW3yWW-c&hd=1

This is not a legitimate response.

[dbboxkaifan]

One similarity that makes the Saiyan arc and Majin Boo arc very identical is when Gohan is looking at Super Boo, whereas in the Saiyan arc the same happened but with Goku and Vegeta.

In both arcs they were looking for the Dragon Balls to ask Shen Long for immortality but neither of them made it that far (Vegeta/Freeza).

Sure you could say they have similarities but not rehashed exactly.

[Hellspawn28]

I never view the Freeza saga as a rehash of anything. The later half of the Bebi saga felt like a rehash of the Saiyan saga in my opinion.

[Ajay]

I think you're confusing basic arc structure with the definition of 'rehash'.

Dragon Ball's Z portion has almost always followed the same structure; a threat appears in a weaker form, it is relatively devastating but mostly overcome. A bigger threat appears or evolves from its predecessor and is battled against by secondary characters until a major protagonist eventually saves the day following a 'struggle'.

That type of structure is hardly exclusive to Dragon Ball; it's essentially shonen fighting anime in a nutshell. It's how you develop your characters and invent your villains that determines how successful it turns out. Toriyama has a great imagination and his heroes and villains are almost always top notch.

Even Battle of Gods that subverts the outcomes of this formula still essentially adheres to it. Beerus appears, Vegeta, Gohan, and Gotenks all fail to defeat him, and then Goku pops up with his Super Saiyan God powers and goes off and does the most significant damage to him. He may not win in a traditional manner but he saves the Earth and in that sense, he's victorious.

Does that make BoG a rehash of everything that came before? I don't think so. Each and every arc has enough unique content to separate itself from one another; whether that be setting, villain, transformation, attack...whatever, it's certainly enough to remain fresh and escape accusations of rehashing old content.

[Fionordequester]

Guys, from now on, in every topic DBZGuy makes, until we figure out what's up with him...I'd like to post this stuff...

While the Saiyan and Freeza sagas are, for the most part, pretty tightly written, the Cell and Buu sagas don't exactly share that trait, at least not as much as previous sagas.

So in your opinion, which saga do you think is more flawed?

I prefer Dragon Ball Z over the original.

Not exactly an "unpopular" opinion, but probably a minority one on this website.

I have a few shirts (wearing one right now, actually) and I've shown pics of my collection online before, but I try not to talk about it too much in real life. I don't want to get somebody started on why they hate DBZ. I get enough of that on the internet. [Context: When in thread called "How Open Are You About Your Fandom?"]

I personally loved most of the new voice work, and am glad that they decided to be a bit more faithful to the manga. [Context: When in thread called "Were you satisfied by the English dub of Kai?"]

I never agreed with this complaint. Each saga in DBZ felt fresh and inventive to me. I guess people only pay attention to the whole "bad guy shows up and gets defeated" thing, which is not all each saga has to offer.

The fandom's general interpretation of Gohan's speech to Cell as "random pacifism". [Context: When in thread called "Biggest DB Disappointment"]

I can't think of a single time where I didn't like any of my favorite characters, let alone one.

They may do stupid/dickish things at times, but they still retain their likability for me.

Any complaint involving how the Dragon Balls were used/not used doesn't bother me, and that includes how often they bring back people from the dead. Apparently, I'm pretty much alone in not being bothered by this.

Complaints about Gohan's character in the Cell arc. I usually just don't agree with them. [Context: Common Complaints against the series that don't bother you?]

1. Cell
2. Freeza
3. Saiyan
4. Buu

The Buu arc, while enjoyable, felt incredibly unnecessary to me. Not to mention that the writing was at its sloppiest here. [Context: Rank the 4 Major Z Arcs from Best to Worst]

Out of the three more major characters of DBZ, which do you prefer the most?

My personal favorite is Goku. I love his overall attitude and personality.

Am I the only one who actually liked Perfect Cell?


I liked how he was basically an evil version of Goku with the new goal of actually proving his perfection instead of going "K, reached Perfect Form. I'll leave you guys alone now."

I'm curious, what's with the dislike for Gohan? I actually really like him, just not as much as Goku or Vegeta.

Yeah, I've dug through his past posts, and it looks like things didn't always used to be this way. I don't know what's happened, but, I think there's something more than just a trolling attempt, judging by these posts, and the fact that he's been on this website since around September-October of 2013...and I'd really like to know what's up. Kind of concerned actually.

[Freeza Soldier #156]

The problem with "thatdbzguy" is that he seems to be incapable of forming his own opinion. He's basically a sheep. He just follows the "popular" opinion of others and forms his ideas based on that even if they contradict his previous beliefs. A good example is his post from way back when when he talked about liking Perfect Cell because he liked that he had a goal. Now he's constantly making posts about how Cell sucks because he has no real goal based on some ratings from IMDB that he used to determine that the Cell arc was the lowest rated arc of the series. It's sad and pathetic.

[VegettoEX]

I'd wager that none of you are professional psychiatrists, so I'll once again politely ask that you refrain from digging too deep into folks' motivations and instead do what you're actually here to do, which is discuss Dragon Ball, and Dragon Ball alone.

[Fionordequester]

I'd wager that none of you are professional psychiatrists, so I'll once again politely ask that you refrain from digging too deep into folks' motivations and instead do what you're actually here to do, which is discuss Dragon Ball, and Dragon Ball alone.

Once again? I don't remember there being a first time ...

Anyways though, you really think I'm digging too deep? His posts are all right there, publicly accessible for any forum user to see, so it's not like it's private information. And I honestly think context is kind of important here, lest people get the wrong idea about DBZGuy. I mean, it seems to me like if you ignore his past, we're just going to go into an endless cycle of "DBZ sucks > No it doesn't! > Yes it does > No it doesn't!", like we've been doing.

[Ajay]

Once again? I don't remember there being a first time ...

Anyways though, you really think I'm digging too deep? His posts are all right there, publicly accessible for any forum user to see, so it's not like it's private information. And I honestly think context is kind of important here, lest people get the wrong idea about DBZGuy. I mean, it seems to me like if you ignore his past, we're just going to go into an endless cycle of "DBZ sucks > No it doesn't! > Yes it does > No it doesn't!", like we've been doing.

You don't remember this thread? http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... d&start=60

We all turned into Dr. Phil and shared sob stories like it was X Factor!

[Fionordequester]

Nope, I wasn't around for that one...yeesh. Honestly, with THOSE kinds of messages from DBZGuy, I'm surprised we're still talking to him at all. Not that he's pathetic or deserves criticism or anything (that's not where I'm coming from), but nothing we can say here can address the underlying problems. And if the underlying problems aren't addressed, then he's PROBABLY not going to change his mind about topics like "how good is the Cell Saga?" no matter how well reasoned our responses are. So in other words, arguing is pointless....I think.