How couldn't they ? aren't they power multipliers ? meaning that no matter how strong goku gets he could alwayse use ssj2 to get a 100 times stronger and ssj4 to get 400 times stronger ?DBZGTKOSDH wrote:SS2 & SS3 just don't give any additional power anymore
Or he could have:RandomGuy96 wrote: Manga: sealed away because his enemy feared his abilities: "He was freaked out by how fearsome I am. Yep, sure wa~~~as.”
Interview: sealed away because of an argument with a petty god about some trifling thing.
They're clearly different reasons, and completely incompatible unless you assume Elder Kaioshin was a liar.
It didnt really seem that way considering SSJ2 = SSJ3 on Kid Buu as the gap was the same difference. That and Zenkais don't work after SSJ1 I assume, so the higher forms arent benificial for him physically anymore, his ki consumption is negated with SSJGod as well.sintzu wrote:How couldn't they ? aren't they power multipliers ? meaning that no matter how strong goku gets he could alwayse use ssj2 to get a 100 times stronger and ssj4 to get 400 times stronger ?DBZGTKOSDH wrote:SS2 & SS3 just don't give any additional power anymore
I agree with who say that the reason is so they won't have to draw them anymore
I dont think hes changing things just to screw with it, hes fully capable of making other projects. He earlier said he was very sick of writting for DB for a long time didnt he? Than only recently he got reinspired through all the interest put back into it. I think hes just thinking of new ideas he never considered when he first wrote the manga and trying his best to appropriately add them to whatever or however far he remembers he left off. The problem is that Akira Toriyama never drafts anything out, nor proof reads the scenarios he sites before confirming ideas. He simply just winging everything for fun but lacks the advisors to fact check him before he rambles. Ooshi was who I thought was on the job but she barely knows anything consistent with the series, just a bardock fangirl. Hence DBM and EOB.Gaffer Tape wrote:Change for the sake of change. No thought, no connection to his previous writings. Some fans seem to eat up all this "world-building" stuff (although I find these to be more world-shattering), but it just seems to me to be talking for the sake of talking. Like he or Shueisha really want an audience to promote this full-color manga, but they've run out of legitimate stuff to say (which, after 30 years, is really no crime), so it's just, like, "Screw it. We'll make shit up. If it's wrong, we'll just hide behind, 'Oh, well, this is what the true story was.'"
Zephyr wrote:The fandom's collective fetishizing of "moments" is also ridiculous to me. No, not everyone needs a fucking "shine" moment. If that's all you want, then all you want is fanservice, rather than an actual coherent story. And of course those aren't mutually exclusive; you could have a coherent story with "shine" moments! But if a story is perfectly coherent (and I'm really not seeing any compelling arguments that this one is anything but, despite constantly recurring, really poorly reasoned, attempts to argue otherwise), and you're bemoaning the lack of "shine" moments as a reason for the story's poor quality, then you're letting your thirst for "shine" moments obfuscate your ability to detect basic storytelling when it's right in front of you.
Ssj2 goku vs kid buu was fillerSingleFringe&Sparks wrote:It didnt really seem that way considering SSJ2 = SSJ3 on Kid Buu.
Shame how they wasted such crisp animation and (seldom made)varied attack sequences on a rather long chunk of filler like that. A big waste.sintzu wrote:Ssj2 goku vs kid buu was fillerSingleFringe&Sparks wrote:It didnt really seem that way considering SSJ2 = SSJ3 on Kid Buu.
In the manga ssj3 goku could fight kid buu while ssj2 vegeta almost got killed.
As cliche and astro-boyish as that sounds why would he want to take away their emotions then if he loved them? That idea is clearly not at all supported, it makes no sense with either of their characters. I thought 16 was difective becaushe he wasnt programmed with any form of aggression and had limited reasoning comprehension?B wrote:Gero just loving his dead son
Zephyr wrote:The fandom's collective fetishizing of "moments" is also ridiculous to me. No, not everyone needs a fucking "shine" moment. If that's all you want, then all you want is fanservice, rather than an actual coherent story. And of course those aren't mutually exclusive; you could have a coherent story with "shine" moments! But if a story is perfectly coherent (and I'm really not seeing any compelling arguments that this one is anything but, despite constantly recurring, really poorly reasoned, attempts to argue otherwise), and you're bemoaning the lack of "shine" moments as a reason for the story's poor quality, then you're letting your thirst for "shine" moments obfuscate your ability to detect basic storytelling when it's right in front of you.
I don't see it as a waste cause at the end of the day it was really goodSingleFringe&Sparks wrote:Shame how they wasted such crisp animation and (seldom made)varied attack sequences on a rather long chunk of filler like that. A big waste.
The point is that Goku has now Godly power, and there's no difference how can he draw that power taking its appearance or in SSJ1 or SSJ2 or SSJ3, because the power of his is no more like it was, he has not normal Ki any longer. Yet transforming into SSJ2 and 3 causing him strain. So base Goku and SSJ1 Goku can use the form the most efficiently. The multipliers doesn't exist any more, they can not multiply a very different type of power. Goku is special because he is a God without its appearance and SSJ2 and 3 are waaaay below SSJ-God's power.sintzu wrote:How couldn't they ? aren't they power multipliers ? meaning that no matter how strong goku gets he could alwayse use ssj2 to get a 100 times stronger and ssj4 to get 400 times stronger ?DBZGTKOSDH wrote:SS2 & SS3 just don't give any additional power anymore
I agree with who say that the reason is so they wown't have to draw them anymore
I'll take pre-Battle Of Gods any dayBlade wrote:Oh no... He's been talking again
It almost feels like the best way to try and keep track of this is to draw up two versions of collective Dragon Universe lore, whereby everything pre and post Battle of Gods are treat as separate entities, because right now it's like we're endlessly having to either trade off between ignoring the inconsistencies between old and new information, or replacing any old information which no longer fits.
Oh, and so much for Super Saiyan strength multipliers.
Toriyama said any saiyan can be a god so if evryone is special then no one is.Low Tone G wrote:Goku is special because he is a God without its appearance.
Does that mean that everyone can keep its power after the time limit? Goku is special in the sense.sintzu wrote:Toriyama said any saiyan can be a god so if evryone is special then no one is.Low Tone G wrote:Goku is special because he is a God without its appearance.
We'll find out when the next film is out and 99% whoever gets the form will keep the powerLow Tone G wrote:Does that mean that everyone can keep its power after the time limit? Goku is special in the sense.sintzu wrote:Toriyama said any saiyan can be a god so if evryone is special then no one is.Low Tone G wrote:Goku is special because he is a God without its appearance.
Surely! I make a bet only Vegeta will become and keep on a God! But I hope Vegeta will not be an old-school Goku imitator.Low Tone G wrote:Does that mean that everyone can keep its power after the time limit? Goku is special in the sense.
We'll find out when the next film is out and 99% whoever gets the form will keep the power
He has absorbed SSGod's power, so transforming doesn't make him stronger anymore.sintzu wrote:How couldn't they ? aren't they power multipliers ? meaning that no matter how strong goku gets he could alwayse use ssj2 to get a 100 times stronger and ssj4 to get 400 times stronger ?
Why would that be a reason? He barely draws anything DB related.I agree with who say that the reason is so they wown't have to draw them anymore
The previous one failed to do so, since he died. Beerus said that Goku absorbed the power through their fight, so I guess that for someone to absorb the power, he needs to have a hard fight with someone, or train while he is in the form.Low Tone G wrote:Does that mean that everyone can keep its power after the time limit?
Except that it doesn't. His mother is soft, but Goku was still a violent baby up until he hit his head. And his father was still an evil asshole, he just cares for his family.SingleFringe&Sparks wrote:The new manga suggests that Goku was inherently good and incorruptable because of his Mother somehow which isnt at all logical.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:When the hell did that one change?!sintzu wrote:What was wrong with goku getting his good nature from grandpa gohan ?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
What ever power goku has can be 100× stronger with ssj2 and 400× stronger with ssj3.DBZGTKOSDH wrote: He has absorbed SSGod's power, so transforming doesn't make him stronger anymore.
So 50× is more then 100× and 400× ?Toriyama wrote: Super Saiyan would raise his level more
It's not like that anymore because Goku absorbed the power of Super Saiyan God. He can use the form's power in base, so transforming doesn't make him stronger anymore.sintzu wrote:What ever power goku has can be 100× stronger with ssj2 and 400× stronger with ssj3.DBZGTKOSDH wrote: He has absorbed SSGod's power, so transforming doesn't make him stronger anymore.
Then again that's manga rules and from what he's been doing and saying it looks like they don't mean anything anymore.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
He never said he does.Basaku wrote:Welp. Love him and all but does he expect anyone to buy he thought of Beerus already 20 years ago when writing Old Kai's story lol? Of course not.
I don't think he expects that at all. Toriyama always makes things up as he goes along, for example he hadn't thought of Goku and Piccolo being aliens until the Saiyan arc.Basaku wrote:Welp. Love him and all but does he expect anyone to buy he thought of Beerus already 20 years ago when writing Old Kai's story lol? Of course not.
