Plothole Reconciliation Thread

[hleV]

Does ki necessarily indicate the owner?

[TheGmGoken]

Its a gag. Therefor not plot hole. Gag logic don't really apply to other set logic in series

[Mr.Judge]

Does ki necessarily indicate the owner?

Yeah. that's how Goku can effectively use his Teleportation technique. He sensed Bulma in Namek Saga.

even Gohan sensed his father's SSJ3 form from Supreme Kai world.

[dbgtFO]

Does ki necessarily indicate the owner?

Yeah. that's how Goku can effectively use his Teleportation technique. He sensed Bulma in Namek Saga.

even Gohan sensed his father's SSJ3 form from Supreme Kai world.

Not only that, but the part on Namek after Ginyu had switched bodies with Goku, Krillin and Gohan hid because they sensed Ginyu and Jheese approaching.

[Mr.Judge]

'Can Heart Virus' and 'using Shenron wish to cure it' be consider as a Plot-Hole?

The heart-virus which could have killed Goku in the original time-line, why couldn't some ask Shenron to cure it.

Also a saiyan body being affected by virus doesn't make sense considering they are shown to survive extreme condition and survive explosions going off.

Even if an virus somehow affects the body, explosion release tremendous amount of heat, that heat should be more than enough to kill the virus inside. Saiyans or (very durable humans) could still subject themselves to extremities of space and heat to rid themselves of virus.

Virus affecting Saiyan long enough that it could potentially kill them sound like a ill-conceived Plot-hole introduced by Akira Toriyama So Others could get some screen-time and Goku can retain his Hero-on-Hiatus until he faces Cell.

[Ringworm128]

To fix plot holes that can't be explained in universe in any way I came up with the head canon that what we see is just a retelling of the events of DB and any inconsistencies is just the narrator screwing up. I use this for pretty much everything.

[Puto]

You guys are overlooking an important fact:
Vegeta had already been revived once by Shenlong, he can't be wished back to life by Shenlong Again.

A different situation that's somewhat related to this... not really a 'plot hole' per se but a complete case of idiocy by the characters:

- Gokū, Kuririn and Piccolo are completely convinced that Gohan is dead (he isn't, but that's besides the point).
- Bulma then summons Shenlong and asks him to revive everybody who died since the tournament, except bad guys.
- ...and yet everyone is STILL convinced that Gohan is dead— even though they just made a wish to revive everybody. If Gohan had indeed died, wouldn't have have come back to life just then?

[sekzee]

Yep. Es mucho estupid.

[Darkprince410]

'Can Heart Virus' and 'using Shenron wish to cure it' be consider as a Plot-Hole?

The heart-virus which could have killed Goku in the original time-line, why couldn't some ask Shenron to cure it.

Also a saiyan body being affected by virus doesn't make sense considering they are shown to survive extreme condition and survive explosions going off.

Even if an virus somehow affects the body, explosion release tremendous amount of heat, that heat should be more than enough to kill the virus inside. Saiyans or (very durable humans) could still subject themselves to extremities of space and heat to rid themselves of virus.

Virus affecting Saiyan long enough that it could potentially kill them sound like a ill-conceived Plot-hole introduced by Akira Toriyama So Others could get some screen-time and Goku can retain his Hero-on-Hiatus until he faces Cell.

They're surviving because despite the extreme conditions, their internal body conditions are remaining fairly constant. From what we've seen, despite their strength and some of their other physical attributes (tail, the rate that they age, etc) Saiya-jin are very similar to humans (to where the two species can breed), so it's reasonable to assume that they're like us in terms of surviving in harsh temperatures (just that they're more resilient). We can survive in extremely cold or hot environments for a certain period of time because our bodies can maintain a core temperature for awhile, and for a Saiya-jin, that should reasonably be the same process, just maybe how long he can maintain that core temperature would change.

Their organs wouldn't be actually experiencing those extreme levels of heat or cold that you're suggesting, just their extremities and outer portions of their body. If their organs were exposed to the heat of an explosion, it'd kill them same as it'd kill a normal person. They're surviving those explosions because their insides aren't getting roasted by the heat, so a virus would be able to continue to thrive in there.

[Mr.Judge]

They're surviving because despite the extreme conditions, their internal body conditions are remaining fairly constant. From what we've seen, despite their strength and some of their other physical attributes (tail, the rate that they age, etc) Saiya-jin are very similar to humans (to where the two species can breed), so it's reasonable to assume that they're like us in terms of surviving in harsh temperatures (just that they're more resilient). We can survive in extremely cold or hot environments for a certain period of time because our bodies can maintain a core temperature for awhile, and for a Saiya-jin, that should reasonably be the same process, just maybe how long he can maintain that core temperature would change.

Their organs wouldn't be actually experiencing those extreme levels of heat or cold that you're suggesting, just their extremities and outer portions of their body. If their organs were exposed to the heat of an explosion, it'd kill them same as it'd kill a normal person. They're surviving those explosions because their insides aren't getting roasted by the heat, so a virus would be able to continue to thrive in there.

I thinks their organs too have same external durability since Even Electricity/lightning doesn't affect them. Even Frieza survives with his organs exposed to Planetary explosion and Space Cold. Popo even ate a Kamehameha.

[Hitiro]

I thinks their organs too have same external durability since Even Electricity/lightning doesn't affect them. Even Freeza survives with his organs exposed to Planetary explosion and Space Cold. Popo even ate a Kamehameha.

I think Freeza is a unique case, being an alien and all. And Popo eating the Kamehameha was filler I believe, lol.

[Mr.Judge]

lol.

But still there is the Electricity part Goku was subjected to in the 21st Budokai Tenkaichi finals.

the brain, spinal cord, and nerves are particularly vulnerable to injury.
Damage to the respiratory and cardiovascular systems is most acute at the moment of injury. Electric shocks can paralyze the respiratory system or disrupt heart action, causing instant death due to cardiac arrest. Also at risk are the smaller veins and arteries, which dissipate heat less easily than the larger blood vessels and can develop blood clots. Damage to the smaller vessels is probably one reason why amputation is often required following high-voltage injuries.
Many other sorts of injuries are possible after an electric shock, including cataracts, kidney failure, and substantial destruction of muscle tissue.

lol?

[Darkprince410]

I thinks their organs too have same external durability since Even Electricity/lightning doesn't affect them. Even Freeza survives with his organs exposed to Planetary explosion and Space Cold. Popo even ate a Kamehameha.

I think Freeza is a unique case, being an alien and all. And Popo eating the Kamehameha was filler I believe, lol.

But still there is the Electricity part Goku was subjected to in the 21st Budokai Tenkaichi finals.

the brain, spinal cord, and nerves are particularly vulnerable to injury.
Damage to the respiratory and cardiovascular systems is most acute at the moment of injury. Electric shocks can paralyze the respiratory system or disrupt heart action, causing instant death due to cardiac arrest. Also at risk are the smaller veins and arteries, which dissipate heat less easily than the larger blood vessels and can develop blood clots. Damage to the smaller vessels is probably one reason why amputation is often required following high-voltage injuries.
Many other sorts of injuries are possible after an electric shock, including cataracts, kidney failure, and substantial destruction of muscle tissue. The victim may suffer a fall or be hit by debris from exploding equipment. An electric arc may set clothing or nearby flammable substances on fire. Strong s

The only non-filler electrical attacks I can think of is what Roshi (as Jackie Chun) used on Goku, which he intentionally held back on because he didn't want Goku to die (for obvious reason), and what Buyon used on Goku when they were in Muscle Tower, and who knows why that didn't outright kill Goku. If there are any other canon electrical attacks, I can't think of any offhand. However, in the latter's case (the former's case was interrupted by Goku transforming into an Oozaru), it certainly did affect him. It wasn't permanent damage but it did leave him injured. Without knowing the actual voltage or amperage of the two attacks, we can't guess as to how serious or life threatening they were, but remember that normal humans in real life have survived lightning strikes before without any real injury.

With Freeza, he's a unique case, since his physiology is far different from humans or saiya-jin, being able to survive in a vacuum and extreme cold of deep space. Given that he had next to no ki at the time and his durability was essentially shot, his ability to stay alive with his internal organs exposed like that is more a testament to his species rather than strength and durability common place to strong characters.

[Mr.Judge]

Without knowing the actual voltage or amperage of the two attacks, we can't guess as to how serious or life threatening they were, but remember that normal humans in real life have survived lightning strikes before without any real injury.

You are comparing attacks of top tier capable of destroying at least few city blocks to Mountains during that arc.
They are nowhere in anyway comparable to human beings who survived lightning strikes which only last momentarily.

As soon as Goku transformed into Oozaru, Roshi's attack dissipated.
That Goku's durability in his transformed state increased to a level, that the technique was no longer effective.

[Darkprince410]

Without knowing the actual voltage or amperage of the two attacks, we can't guess as to how serious or life threatening they were, but remember that normal humans in real life have survived lightning strikes before without any real injury.

You are comparing attacks of top tier capable of destroying at least few city blocks to Mountains during that arc.
They are nowhere in anyway comparable to human beings who survived lightning strikes which only last momentarily.

As soon as Goku transformed into Oozaru, Roshi's attack dissipated.
That Goku's durability in his transformed state increased to a level, that the technique was no longer effective.

We have no frame of reference for how powerful that attack would be if Roshi had used it on buildings or mountains, since he only uses it the one time on Goku. So I don't get how you believe it's capable of destroying city blocks or mountains. Yes, Roshi himself is easily able to when he utilizes an attack with actual destructive purposes, but while this is a dangerous attack, we don't know how dangerous it actually is, and how much electricity is being generated and released. It's basically like a grandiose and flashy tazer really, and it's very likely that a lightning bolt is still more voltage.

[thatdbzguy]

Vegeta says Zenkais don't work if they're self-inflicted. Yet Goku got them by doing just that. Any explanations?

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Vegeta says Zenkais don't work if they're self-inflicted. Yet Goku got them by doing just that. Any explanations?

Goku damaged himself indirectly. Vegeta talks about damaging himself directly.

[Darkprince410]

Vegeta says Zenkais don't work if they're self-inflicted. Yet Goku got them by doing just that. Any explanations?

Vegeta's take on it was just basically like putting his hand to his chest and blasting a hole through himself. That's something that he physically couldn't do because he couldn't generate a blast strong enough to do that while at the same time dropping his ki down to a point where he'd be vulnerable to the blast. Goku, when he was in the spaceship training for Namek, was firing off Kamehamehas in an arch and letting them swing around the inside of the ship before striking him, giving him time to adjust his strength so he could be considerably damaged by them.

[thatdbzguy]

Vegeta says Zenkais don't work if they're self-inflicted. Yet Goku got them by doing just that. Any explanations?

Vegeta's take on it was just basically like putting his hand to his chest and blasting a hole through himself. That's something that he physically couldn't do because he couldn't generate a blast strong enough to do that while at the same time dropping his ki down to a point where he'd be vulnerable to the blast. Goku, when he was in the spaceship training for Namek, was firing off Kamehamehas in an arch and letting them swing around the inside of the ship before striking him, giving him time to adjust his strength so he could be considerably damaged by them.

So why couldn't Vegeta just shoot an arched blast?

[rereboy]

Vegeta says Zenkais don't work if they're self-inflicted. Yet Goku got them by doing just that. Any explanations?

He probably meant that it wouldn't work because they aren't nearly as effective, and as such it would be useless to do that in that situation (Freeza about to kill them).