The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Kamiccolo9]

23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Old Piccolo Daimao
23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Young Piccolo Daimao
Start of Z Kuririn vs Weighted Piccolo Jr. (23rd Budokai)

Krillin wins the first, but loses the others. I don't think any of them were Daimao-level at the 23rd Budokai except for Goku and Piccolo, and nobody really improved all that much between the 23rd Budokai and the start of Z.

[ZombieVito]

23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Old Piccolo Daimao
23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Young Piccolo Daimao
Start of Z Kuririn vs Weighted Piccolo Jr. (23rd Budokai)

Krillin losses every fight.

[Kamiccolo9]

23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Old Piccolo Daimao
23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Young Piccolo Daimao
Start of Z Kuririn vs Weighted Piccolo Jr. (23rd Budokai)

Krillin losses every fight.

Even against Old Daimao? He managed to put up a decent fight against a weighted Majunior, who I'd imagine would still be above the old guy.

[Kaboom]

I think I'm going to agree that old King Piccolo is the only opponent that Kuririn's got a shot against. The other two are just too strong for him.

[ZombieVito]

23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Old Piccolo Daimao
23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Young Piccolo Daimao
Start of Z Kuririn vs Weighted Piccolo Jr. (23rd Budokai)

Krillin losses every fight.

Even against Old Daimao? He managed to put up a decent fight against a weighted Majunior, who I'd imagine would still be above the old guy.

They are close (210 vs 198 by my numbers) but Piccolo Daimao is just a better fighter at this time IMO.

[RandomGuy96]

I think even Old Daimao could beat Krillin at this point... unless the battle powers read at the beginning of the series weren't their full powers. Which would make some things make a LOT more sense. As is, though, I think Old Daimao is stronger, has better physical attributes (regeneration, stretchy arms, being 2.5 meters tall), and IMO is a better fighter at this point:

Old Daimao: 225
Young Daimao: 260

Krillin: 197
Tenshinhan: 235
Yamcha: 165
Cyborg Tao: 155
Goku: 395
Piccolo: 385

[Kid Buu]

Is it possible that the power levels Bulma read in early Z were just the suppressed levels of the humans? It's not like any of them were in some hardcore battle that forced them to go all out when they were first read.

[ZombieVito]

Is it possible that the power levels Bulma read in early Z were just the suppressed levels of the humans? It's not like any of them were in some hardcore battle that forced them to go all out when they were first read.

Can they even suppressed there Ki at this point? Goku only learned that with Kamisama.

[Doctor.]

Or, I don't know, the Daizenshuu was just wrong and 260 for Young Piccolo Daimao doesn't make any sense at all, just like how Tenshinhan demonstrated?

[Kamiccolo9]

Or, I don't know, the Daizenshuu was just wrong and 260 for Young Piccolo Daimao doesn't make any sense at all, just like how Tenshinhan demonstrated?

Personally, I'd take an out-of-universe official publication over the word of a fallible, in-universe character, if I'm forced to pick between them.

[Doctor.]

Normally I would too, but Tenshinhhan is a reliable source. He had no reason to lie and Goku didn't say anything so we can dismiss the possibility of him being wrong. I just see that everyone here takes the "official" material way to seriously sometimes. They're not immune to mistakes. And Piccolo's powerlevel to me makes no sense.

[Kamiccolo9]

Normally I would too, but Tenshinhhan is a reliable source. He had no reason to lie and Goku didn't say anything so we can dismiss the possibility of him being wrong. I just see that everyone here takes the "official" material way to seriously sometimes. They're not immune to mistakes. And Piccolo's powerlevel to me makes no sense.

I didn't say that Tenshinhan was lying, but power sensing isn't all that exact at this point (if it ever really is), and it definitely wasn't back during the fight with Daimao, most of which Tenshinhan spent heavily wounded. I don't like using character's estimations of power as definite proof of how strong they are, unless it's backed up by something that proves it, like Ginyu's guessing that Goku was at 85,000. And I especially don't like using estimations of power based on how strong a guy was years ago. Plus, another aspect of Tenshinhan's whole characterization in the 23rd Budokai is him overestimating himself, thinking that he had caught up to Goku, only to find out that Goku was so far ahead that he was playing with him the entire time.

So, if the guidebooks say something, and there's nothing that definitively contradicts it, then I tend to take it as true.

[Saiga]

" Only, Saiyans rapidly increase in strength as they fight against strong opponents, so the longer they fought, the more that gap would shrink, and it might even be possible for them to eventually turn the tables."

So even if you think Vegetto is weaker than Billy, he would catch up very quickly.


He wouldn't need to, though, because SS2 Vegetto would stomp Billy.

It's too bad what Toriyama said has never actually happened in the series that we've seen. Seems like he misunderstood how Zenkai works, if anything.

[Kamiccolo9]

" Only, Saiyans rapidly increase in strength as they fight against strong opponents, so the longer they fought, the more that gap would shrink, and it might even be possible for them to eventually turn the tables."

So even if you think Vegetto is weaker than Billy, he would catch up very quickly.


He wouldn't need to, though, because SS2 Vegetto would stomp Billy.

It's too bad what Toriyama said has never actually happened in the series that we've seen. Seems like he misunderstood how Zenkai works, if anything.

Well, that's my rationale for how strong Goten and Trunks are.

[Kid Buu]

The entire 22nd Budokai if Yamcha faced Chaozu first round and Kuririn faced Tenshinhan in the third round.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

It's too bad what Toriyama said has never actually happened in the series that we've seen. Seems like he misunderstood how Zenkai works, if anything.

Actually, it happened in the fight between Goku & Jackie Chun in the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai. Goku got stronger according to Kuririn, yet he wasn't near-dead from their fight, but he had a long fight with a powerful opponent.

Plus, Vegeta says this in the manga:

Chapter: 257 (DBZ 63), P10.1-2
Context: Vegeta bragging to Dodoria about how he became stronger.
Vegeta: “Fuhahaha…! We Saiyans grow stronger each time we fight…! The stronger the opponent, the stronger we become…So I’m becoming stronger too…! I almost died on Earth, and have now vastly powered up…!”

[dbgtFO]

23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Old Piccolo Daimao
23rd Budokai Kuririn vs Young Piccolo Daimao
Start of Z Kuririn vs Weighted Piccolo Jr. (23rd Budokai)

1. Demon King Piccolo one shots Krillin.
2. Demon King Piccolo one shots Krillin.
3. Piccolo one shots Krillin.
Eh, no way Krillin would have stood a chance against any past version of Piccolo until his training with Kami.

The entire 22nd Budokai if Yamcha faced Chaozu first round and Kuririn faced Tenshinhan in the third round.

Quarter finals:
Yamcha advances to the next round, making sure an exit at the first round doesn't become a running gag. Jackie Chun advances to the next round as in the original. Tenshinhan swats aside Krillin after giving the false impression they were on equal footing. Tenshinhan doesn't break Krillin's leg, as he doesn't find it necessary. Goku advances to the next round like in the original.
Semi finals:
Yamcha battles Jackie Chun, but although a closer fight than last time, he still isn't good enough to beat his disguised master and loses. Tenshinhan's surprise at Goku's speed and power has him in the ropes for a while, until he gets his act together and starts fighting a bit more equally. Having not gotten to talk with Kame-sennin, Tenshinhan has no qualms about Chaozu using his paralysis attack on Goku and manages to win after looking like losing.
Final:
Jackie Chun tries talking some sense into Tenshinhan, who along with Tsuru-sennin and Chaozu learns his real identity. Tenshinhan being unable to focus is eventually thrown out of the ring securing Jackie Chun another title.

It's too bad what Toriyama said has never actually happened in the series that we've seen. Seems like he misunderstood how Zenkai works, if anything.

Actually, it happened in the fight between Goku & Jackie Chun in the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai. Goku got stronger according to Kuririn, yet he wasn't near-dead from their fight, but he had a long fight with a powerful opponent.

I'd like to know the chapter number just so I can check myself.

[ZombieVito]

Second form Freeza (FP) vs Piccolo fused with Nail (FP)

What would had happen if Freeza didn't transformed?

[Kaboom]

I like to think that Piccolo would have eventually won.

Because mutha-effin' Piccolo.

[dbgtFO]

Yep Piccolo should eventually win. Alternatively Piccolo realizes the weights he took off didn't increase his speed significantly, because, as Saiga likes to argue, he had been wearing them since before merging with Nail.