EDIT: So this is in Tambourine's Daizenshuu 7 biography:
"As a Demon Clansman made to battle, his battle power is many times greater than Cymbal's"
What does this imply? That those "many times stronger" and "half as strong" etc. statements made by Piccolo throughout this arc and the next were genuinely referring to battle power? That Yajirobe was actually way weaker than he looked, and Goku was holding back for some bizarre reason...?
Goku's stomach had a delayed reaction to the food he ate and he only truly fully recovered after his fight with Yajirobe.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.
RandomGuy96 wrote:
Not really, when it's the only way we can judge it.
Why? He was about to fight Gero, what reason would he have to keep suppressing himself? When dodging, for instance, he has no reason to keep suppressing his power and fake worry when he can easily just dodge it without any effort.
I said that Ten dodging it was a feat in his favor. You said it wasn't, because Goku wasn't using his full power to dodge it. The proof you gave of this is that Tenshinhan could dodge it. Which is circular reasoning.
It being the only way doesn't make it any better, though. Regardless of not having anything else to go off, it just doesn't work by itself.
Because again, he suppresses himself even while fighting to conserve energy. He kept dropping down to 5,000 while fighting people far above that. Once again the expression can't be used for crap.
No, that's not it. I was not replying to that part, I was replying to the part about Gero not being surprised by Goku's base power. Only that part.
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!
The anime seems to support the idea that Earthlings are on par with Base Saiyans, as Tenshinhan was able to fight Trunks and Yamcha beat those Base Goku-tier guys in the Otherworld.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.
Kid Buu wrote:The anime seems to support the idea that Earthlings are on par with Base Saiyans, as Tenshinhan was able to fight Trunks and Yamcha beat those Base Goku-tier guys in the Otherworld.
The anime also has SSJ3 Goku fending off Buutenks and SSJ2 Goku and Vegeta managed to survive Buuhan not to mention SSJ1 Goku holding off SSJ3 Gotenks and Gohan together.
Never use anime filler for character strength depictions.
Kid Buu wrote:The anime seems to support the idea that Earthlings are on par with Base Saiyans, as Tenshinhan was able to fight Trunks and Yamcha beat those Base Goku-tier guys in the Otherworld.
Which just furthers supports the idea that the Earthlings are far behind the base Saiyans.
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!
Yajirobe - 170 Tambourine - 160 Cymbal - 40 Drum - 200 Piano - 6 Piccolo Daimao - 210
Young - 260
Kami - 300 Mr. Popo - 290
Spoiler:
Son Goku - 320 Kuririn - 195 Yamcha - 182 Tenshinhan - 230 Chaozu- 145 Cyborg Taopaipai - 158 Chichi - 130 Piccolo - 320
Giant - 335
Chappa - 91
Last edited by DBZGTKOSDH on Sat Aug 23, 2014 5:19 pm, edited 5 times in total.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Any particular reason that you have Android 8 being the strongest character in Dragon Ball?
Accident, I think. It's a revised list from an older list I made a year ago, so I didn't noticed that. I'll lower him, I don't think he is that strong as well.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
dbgtFO wrote:Personally I'm more intrigued by the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai being held twice
I... I've no idea what you are talking about...
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Personally, I think that Chiaotzu is a little too close to Cyborg Tao.
Nah, I think he is fine. It's the same difference that was between Vegeta & Dodoria, meaning a one-sided fight with an easy win.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
It's really a good list but I'm curious why many people have 21st Goku at the 80's or 90's. I'm currently going with 50, gives me more breathing room later on.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Yeah, but with that small of a difference, Chiaotzu should have been able to use his psychic powers just like he did against Goku.
Would it work on Taopaipai? He was one of his masters after all.
Zombie wrote:It's really a good list but I'm curious why many people have 21st Goku at the 80's or 90's. I'm currently going with 50, gives me more breathing room later on.
Because I want to keep Kame-sennin's growth smaller. He is an old, and very experienced martial artist, he shouldn't have room to make huge jumps in power.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
KentalSSJ6 wrote:Out of curiosity, where does everyone put Goku in base during the Buu saga? I'd say a flat 100 million seems accurate enough.
Somewhere around 80 or 90 million has long been the "sweet spot" for me. It allows him to make a little growth in the few years before Battle of Gods, reaching 90 or 100 million but still being considered unable to defeat Freeza. With all the back-and-forth power leapfrogging during the Androids and Cell arc, I find it difficult for Goku to end up any lower than that, since ideally I'd like him to be around 50 or 60 million during the Boo arc instead.
