Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

[Pantalones]

A bit one-sided, yeah... but at least it's well-drawn and actually kinda interesting, not just another "whoops, some random thing changes so that Villain #25086 wins! that means a bunch of unnecessarily gory death scenes for the good guys!" sort of thing like the Cell and Bojack specials.

We've got planets we haven't seen before, a fight that isn't just a slight modification of something that happened in the main universe (two actually, if you count Cooler getting instantly slaughtered as a "fight"), we found out that Cold has a good reason for avoiding using his 4th form rather than "just 'plot stupidity' to prevent him from easily killing Trunks" (he has even less control over it than Freeza and, on top of that, it tires him out even faster--his true form is really only superior to his sons' in terms of raw power, not actual usefulness), we found out that Vegeta still kills Cui even in this universe, we found out what Vegeta ended up doing in this universe, and so on. Yeah, it'd be nice to have a special with a less one-sided fight for once, but this is still a hell of a lot better than a lot of the specials have been.

[mAcChaos]

Yeah, the art alone made it worth it. It just made me hunger for that last step which would add to the quality.

[TonyTheTiger]

I like the idea of Cold going all out immediately. It shows that he's less stupid than his son, a, and b, it highlights how intimidated he really is.

Which is exactly why Cold is so screwy in DBM. You have a guy who A) is supposedly significantly more powerful than his sons, B) is more than willing to immediately use that power against someone who he knows can beat said sons, and C) ...um...got killed by Trunks after a pathetic ruse designed to gain some leverage.

I like this special but Cold's buffs make no sense at all.

we found out that Cold has a good reason for avoiding using his 4th form rather than "just 'plot stupidity' to prevent him from easily killing Trunks" (he has even less control over it than Freeza and, on top of that, it tires him out even faster--his true form is really only superior to his sons' in terms of raw power, not actual usefulness).

It doesn't add up, though. He knows Gast is stronger than Freeza and Cooler so he immediately goes into his final form (a transformation that appears to take him just a few moments, mind you) because he's smart enough to know he has to. But when landing on Earth (a planet he couldn't give two shits about) to face off with a guy who he knows is stronger than Freeza, he not only stays in a reduced form, he remains that way even after a different guy obliterates Freeza and instead takes the opportunity to stand there and chat about the dude's sword. I can't reconcile Cold's behavior when facing Gast with his behavior when facing Trunks.

[RandomGuy96]

Yeah, if anything this special just makes that plot hole a thousand times worse.

A Namek easily beats Freeza: "This is bad. I better use my full power right away, and be ready to confront him."

A Super Saiyan easily beats Freeza: "I'm going to stay suppressed to a fraction of my maximum power and then never ever even try to power up. Clearly I am a genius."

[coola]

Gast also beat Coola before, so maybe that make Cold decide to use his full power right from start? We have no idea about Cold power in his usual form, maybe he thought it would be enough for Super Saiyan, who only beat Freeza?

[rereboy]

I like the idea of Cold going all out immediately. It shows that he's less stupid than his son, a, and b, it highlights how intimidated he really is.

Which is exactly why Cold is so screwy in DBM. You have a guy who A) is supposedly significantly more powerful than his sons, B) is more than willing to immediately use that power against someone who he knows can beat said sons, and C) ...um...got killed by Trunks after a pathetic ruse designed to gain some leverage.

I like this special but Cold's buffs make no sense at all.

That's because they didn't properly explained why he didn't buff himself against Trunks. They should have offered an explanation.

For example, they could have explained that the reason why Cold left the command of the organization to his sons was because he started suffering from a chronic illness. That disease would not be life-threating but it would affect him severely while in his true form and severely weaken him. However, in his restricted forms, the disease becomes dormant and doesn't manifest itself. That way, Cold would actually be more powerful in his restricted forms than in his true form, but since his restricted forms aren't more powerful than his sons, he retired and left the command of the organization to his sons. That would explain why he didn't even try to transform agaisnt Trunks.

And in DBM's tournament, they would just have to explain that, nowadays, Cold has found a cure for his disease, so he can use his true form again. And, not only that, but he has learned to control his power properly.

In this special they could have just explained that in this universe Cold never actually developed that disease, so he didn't actually retire, which would explain why more people know about him.

In fact, if I made a rewrite of DBM I would make this happen. And if I was Salagir, even though we are already very much passed the point where Cold first fought, I would add or edit a page or two offering this explanation. It would take care of what is, to me, the most obvious plothole in DBM regarding the manga.

[TonyTheTiger]

A contrived coincidence as an explanation is not much of an improvement over no explanation at all.

[rereboy]

A contrived coincidence as an explanation is not much of an improvement over no explanation at all.

Coincidence? I don't think so. Freeza was already in power when Goku was born, meaning that Cold would have been retired for at the very least several decades, fully explaining why most aren't aware of him by now. That explanation would also fit perfectly well with the mystery of why Cold appears to be in a restricted form in the manga similar to Freeza's, making it coherent to and expanding the manga and the relations of the Freeza's family in a interesting way. Furthermore, it would be a very logical and interesting way of explaining why Cold is satisfied in remaining in the backstage, and it would also be one of the best non-typical explanations for Cold to be stronger in DBM than he was in the manga, IMO (by having him be cured nowadays).

No matter how I look at it, from whatever angle I can think of, its a logical and interesting expansion into his backstory, that offers an explanation for one of the mysteries of the manga (Cold's appearance, his power and why he remains in the backstage) while still being a logical basis of why he is stronger than his sons in DBM.

At the very least, its miles better that what DBM offered to explain his power in regards to the manga, which was basically nothing.

[RandomGuy96]

I still would prefer him just not being stronger at all. It doesn't seem to have any point.

[rereboy]

I still would prefer him just not being stronger at all. It doesn't seem to have any point.

The whole idea behind DBM is having cool and interesting fights. Having Cold being in a true form like Freeza and being stronger than in the manga follows that perfectly. You might as well be asking what is the point of DBM.

They should just have explained Cold better.

[Skar]

In this special they could have just explained that in this universe Cold never actually developed that disease, so he didn't actually retire, which would explain why more people know about him.

Well wouldn't U7 be identical to U18 up until the point of divergence? This universe diverged when Nail and Guru decided to fuse so everything that happened before that should be the same as U18. If his higher forms were too unstable to use against Trunks then he probably shouldn't have been able to use them in a different universe that diverged a little over a year earlier than that. The disease explanation could work for U8 since there's a 30 year gap between when it diverged and when King Cold was shown using his full power at the tournament so a cure could have been developed in that time.

[RandomGuy96]

I still would prefer him just not being stronger at all. It doesn't seem to have any point.

The whole idea behind DBM is having cool and interesting fights. Having Cold being in a true form like Freeza and being stronger than in the manga follows that perfectly. You might as well be asking what is the point of DBM.

They should just have explained Cold better.

No, it doesn't. Nothing so far has actually required Cold to be stronger than Freeza and Cooler. If not for Piccolo once stating "he's as strong as android 17, maybe even as strong as 16", no one would ever think he's any stronger than he was in the manga. Piccolo could have just said "he's much stronger than before, yet still not quite on Freeza's level", and nothing would change, except for the story making significantly more sense.

[rereboy]

I still would prefer him just not being stronger at all. It doesn't seem to have any point.

The whole idea behind DBM is having cool and interesting fights. Having Cold being in a true form like Freeza and being stronger than in the manga follows that perfectly. You might as well be asking what is the point of DBM.

They should just have explained Cold better.

No, it doesn't. Nothing so far has actually required Cold to be stronger than Freeza and Cooler. If not for Piccolo once stating "he's as strong as android 17, maybe even as strong as 16", no one would ever think he's any stronger than he was in the manga. Piccolo could have just said "he's much stronger than before, yet still not quite on Freeza's level", and nothing would change, except for the story making significantly more sense.

Freeza would not win against a SSJ like Bardock unless he was significantly stronger. Cold won. So, no, in order to have that fight, a member of that family would have to be significantly stronger. They chose Cold to be that member because they thought it would be better than having Freeza or Coola who were already sufficiently explored. They just didn't explain properly the reason for this, in-universe.

But, even besides that, you are missing the point. It was never REQUIRED for any of the Freeza family to be there at all or be stronger than in the manga. Nor is it required to have a second Vegeta with SSJ2. Or a Namekian to be as strong as Gast. Or Krillin to be as strong as he is. Or a hundred other things. The fan manga could have been done without those things. But are these things actually cool and interesting? Yes. Is that the whole point of the fan manga? Yes.

In this special they could have just explained that in this universe Cold never actually developed that disease, so he didn't actually retire, which would explain why more people know about him.

Well wouldn't U7 be identical to U18 up until the point of divergence? This universe diverged when Nail and Guru decided to fuse so everything that happened before that should be the same as U18. If his higher forms were too unstable to use against Trunks then he probably shouldn't have been able to use them in a different universe that diverged a little over a year earlier than that. The disease explanation could work for U8 since there's a 30 year gap between when it diverged and when King Cold was shown using his full power at the tournament so a cure could have been developed in that time.

It would be about the same, the main difference would be that Cold was still the head of the empire and people would know about him, but actual events would remain the same.

No, the power of his true form being unstable doesn't explain at all why he didn't even try to transform against Trunks because the transformation would still make him a lot stronger than he was before and stronger than Trunks. He would have a hard time controlling it like we see in the special, but even losing control and destroying Earth would be much better for Cold than fighting Trunks in his suppression form because he would be able to survive in space. It makes zero sense for him to not even try if that transformation would make him a lot stronger.

The disease explanation I offered explains why he didn't even try because the disease would become active in his true form, severely weakening him to the point he was not any stronger than he was before, perhaps even weaker.

[RandomGuy96]

Freeza would not win against a SSJ like Bardock unless he was significantly stronger. Cold won. So, no, in order to have that fight, a member of that family would have to be significantly stronger. They chose Cold to be that member because they thought it would be better than having Freeza or Coola who were already sufficiently explored. They just didn't explain properly the reason for this, in-universe.

But, even besides that, you are missing the point. It was never REQUIRED for any of the Freeza family to be there at all or be stronger than in the manga. Nor is it required to have a second Vegeta with SSJ2. Or a Namekian to be as strong as Gast. Or Krillin to be as strong as he is. Or a hundred other things. The fan manga could have been done without those things. But are these things actually cool and interesting? Yes. Is that the whole point of the fan manga? Yes.

Bardock is a weakling in "canon", so no, he wouldn't need to be stronger.

Actually, I'd answer "no" to most of those things. I don't like Krillin, Cold, or Gast being that strong. Cold being stronger has no point and does nothing but make this fan comic shittier.

[rereboy]

Freeza would not win against a SSJ like Bardock unless he was significantly stronger. Cold won. So, no, in order to have that fight, a member of that family would have to be significantly stronger. They chose Cold to be that member because they thought it would be better than having Freeza or Coola who were already sufficiently explored. They just didn't explain properly the reason for this, in-universe.

But, even besides that, you are missing the point. It was never REQUIRED for any of the Freeza family to be there at all or be stronger than in the manga. Nor is it required to have a second Vegeta with SSJ2. Or a Namekian to be as strong as Gast. Or Krillin to be as strong as he is. Or a hundred other things. The fan manga could have been done without those things. But are these things actually cool and interesting? Yes. Is that the whole point of the fan manga? Yes.

Bardock is a weakling in "canon", so no, he wouldn't need to be stronger.

Actually, I'd answer "no" to most of those things. I don't like Krillin, Cold, or Gast being that strong. Cold being stronger has no point and does nothing but make this fan comic shittier.

So, in other words, you don't think that any of things that happen in the comic are cool or interesting even though that's practically the sole purpose of the comic, and you even call the comic shitty.

But you are always in this topic commenting it and following the comic. Why?

Ah, right, you are one of those "fans" that is constantly criticizing the comic, offering nothing else but negativity, that don't really like anything in it and constantly say "NO" to anything that might be positive about the comic, like you just did, and that constantly repeats himself, instead of just not following it anymore or not offering constantly the same type of comments. In short, you are everything that is wrong in this topic and fan bases in general. Yeah, good for you, hope that is working out for you... I'm sure that all other fan comics with all those SSJS10 coming to Earth for no good reason are way more cool and interesting.

[RandomGuy96]

So, in other words, you don't think that any of things that happen in the comic are cool or interesting even though that's practically the sole purpose of the comic, and you even call the comic shitty.

I don't know how you get "this comic shouldn't exist" from "these group of characters shouldn't be this strong". Also, shittier =/= shitty. I've said before that this comic is a 6/10 for me. Also, I comment on positives when I see them, like this special's art, most of Zen Buu, the premise, and some of the fights, and occasionally defend it when I see the criticism as unfounded (the complaints about the gore).

But you are always in this topic commenting it and following the comic. Why?

It takes about a minute to just click and read, and it occasionally does something entertaining, so I'm not really losing anything even if it turns out to be a bad page that week.

Ah, right, you are one of those "fans" that is constantly criticizing the comic, offering nothing else but negativity, that don't really like anything in it and constantly say "NO" to anything that might be positive about the comic, like you just did, and that constantly repeats himself, instead of just not following it anymore or not offering constantly the same type of comments. In short, you are everything that is wrong in this topic and fan bases in general. Yeah, good for you, hope that is working out for you... I'm sure that all other fan comics with all those SSJS10 coming to Earth for no good reason are way more cool and interesting.

Cut the condescending bullshit. I only comment on this particular comic because I think it can, at times, be good, while I don't even read those other fan comics you're rambling about since I dislike them based on the premise. I'll say whatever I damn well please about this comic. If an idea in it is shit, which happens a lot, I'll say its shit. If you disagree and really like the comic, even the ideas that I think are bad, fine, but don't pull this "everything wrong about fan bases" crap and put words in my mouth.

[Kaboom]

In short, you are everything that is wrong in this topic and fan bases in general.

Come on, this type of derogatory labeling is entirely unnecessary and overboard, especially over something like a web comic. Let's all just drop it and move on, please.

[TheGmGoken]

Didn't want to come here today but the site is down for UOTAA WiFi but on my data it's to bad of connection to load DBM let alone changing Kanzenshuu pages. I tried but kept saying "no connection". So I'll make a quick post since it's less stuff for my phone to load. Two questions

1. Is the special over? It bored me sadly(dropped it after a few pages) and wasn't a fan of the artstyle. I prefer to read DB in DB art. The artstyle in the special is incredible otherwise.

2. If the special over what's the current chapter about? Any cover page or idea?

Sorry for inconvenience. I wish I didn't have to come to the site for a dumb question but technology fails sometimes. Sucks that it's only on this side of the dorms that has bad connection.

[rereboy]

In short, you are everything that is wrong in this topic and fan bases in general.

Come on, this type of derogatory labeling is entirely unnecessary and overboard, especially over something like a web comic. Let's all just drop it and move on, please.

I merely commented that his apparent constant pessimistic and negative attitude towards DBM is something that I find wrong in many fan bases, that kind of stance. I didn't insult him or treated him wrongly in any way, imo. In hindsight, I admit that I shouldn't have said "everything wrong" because obviously that is an exaggeration and perhaps my tone should have been more neutral, but I don't understand why what I said is worse than constantly offering the same kind of negative and over-critical comments in a single topic.

Cut the condescending bullshit. I only comment on this particular comic because I think it can, at times, be good, while I don't even read those other fan comics you're rambling about since I dislike them based on the premise. I'll say whatever I damn well please about this comic. If an idea in it is shit, which happens a lot, I'll say its shit. If you disagree and really like the comic, even the ideas that I think are bad, fine, but don't pull this "everything wrong about fan bases" crap and put words in my mouth.

You'll forgive me, but all I recall from you in this topic is always the same kind of comments. Of course, if for some reason I'm wrong and most of your participation in the topic is not how I recall, I naturally apologize for being wrong about that. But honestly, it gets tiresome and it gets old to just read the same kind of negative things which are often repeated ad eternum and that often seem more interested in tearing down the fan manga and stating how bad something about the fan manga is, or the fan manga itself is, than actually discussing what could be better about it, what should change, the honest positives and negatives and so on.

And quite honestly, IMO, your most recent posts in response to mine seemed to be also more interested in tearing down the fan manga and any idea to improve what is there than to discuss it constructively. You just adopted a stance of basically saying "this is wrong and it shouldn't be" and dismissed the arguments for adapting that particular something and improving it and the arguments that show that that particular something is no different than all the other things that the fan manga does and are perfectly coherent with its basic goal.

Not to mention that I find particularly aggravating seeing the topics of the comics that you say are worse than DBM basically free from negative comments from you or mostly anyone, and see this topic filled with those types of comments. Rather interesting how that works, huh? And yeah, I find that lack of fairness and perspective one of the things that is wrong with fan bases. Sorry for pointing out my opinion about that but if you have a right to say whatever you want to say about the fan manga, I don't see why I can't state my opinion about what you said.

[Skar]

It would be about the same, the main difference would be that Cold was still the head of the empire and people would know about him, but actual events would remain the same.

If King Cold acted differently in U7 than he did in U18 then wouldn't that be when that universe diverged? Since U7 diverged when Nail and Guru decided to fuse all the events and characters would have been identical prior to that.

No, the power of his true form being unstable doesn't explain at all why he didn't even try to transform against Trunks because the transformation would still make him a lot stronger than he was before and stronger than Trunks. He would have a hard time controlling it like we see in the special, but even losing control and destroying Earth would be much better for Cold than fighting Trunks in his suppression form because he would be able to survive in space. It makes zero sense for him to not even try if that transformation would make him a lot stronger.

That's actually the reason I think it's a plothole for King Cold to be that much stronger than Frieza in DBM. I would have had it where King Cold could transform but his 100% form would still remain weaker than Frieza's. That way he could still be more powerful than he was in canon and explain why he didn't bother transforming against someone who easily defeated Frieza. To make him the strongest they could say he secretly mastered the fifth form and it was slightly above Cooler's. His fights would still play out the same way in the tournament. He scares Videl into forfeiting, he defeats a relatively weak SSJ Bardock, and loses to Bra in the third round.I think that would make more sense than him potentially being more powerful than #16 in his true form but never considers transforming against Trunks. Whether that form was too difficult to control or he was suffering from some kind of virus it would still be better to risk that than going up against someone he knows is more powerful than him.