Do "gags" count? Did they "happen"?

[Zephyr]

I noticed multiple posts in another thread bring up the nature of gags as character feats. I've also seen many users handwave certain parts of the story away as being "just gags".

Why not have a thread specifically for such a topic?

I'd argue that in some way, shape, or form, the gags do have to count for something. They happened in the continuity. They can't just be shirked off as having not happened. "It's just a gag" also seems to be more of an out-of-universe answer.

I don't really have any central thesis or main point I'm arguing here, just trying to get a conversation started.

[Kamiccolo9]

They happen, they just don't count towards actual feats. I'd relate it to breaking the fourth wall; sure, characters may reference things outside their universe, but that doesn't mean that they are truly aware they are fictional characters.

[Zephyr]

sure, characters may reference things outside their universe, but that doesn't mean that they are truly aware they are fictional characters.

How would they imagine to make the reference in the first place then?

[Kamiccolo9]

sure, characters may reference things outside their universe, but that doesn't mean that they are truly aware they are fictional characters.

How would they imagine to make the reference in the first place then?

Because it's not meant to be taken seriously. It's a joke.

[KentalSSJ6]

Look at when Goku uses the manga's panel to bounce a rock off of in Dragonball. That would be a gag feat.

[rereboy]

Gags happen in-universe but you can't draw conclusions from them because they are not meant to be taken seriously.

You can't, for example, conclude that Goku can survive in space just because he took Boss Rabbit to the moon with just his staff.

[Gaffer Tape]

I think they count, at least to a certain degree. But Dragon Ball is not Looney Tunes, so the line isn't nearly as distinct. This is a series about super-powered people, which makes it difficult to tell what's truly gag and what's not. When the characters survive machine gun fire with only cartoony bullet holes, is that because it's a gag, or is it because they're strong? Or both? I don't see why it can't be both.

I see the Cell vs. Mr. Satan example used a lot as a supposed example of gag things not counting, but that's never made sense to me. Even the story justifies it. Characters say that Cell didn't want to waste the effort killing someone like him. This isn't like that silly crossover with... the name escapes me... where Freeza just *can't* kill the guy because he's a gag character. So it's kind of a gray area. Yeah, Mr. Satan smashing into a mountain is played for laughs, so it's a gag in that sense, but just because something is played for humor doesn't mean it doesn't or can't happen, and I at least think it can easily be "accepted."

Characters breaking the fourth wall... definitely a little trickier.

[Rocketman]

I see the Cell vs. Mr. Satan example used a lot as a supposed example of gag things not counting, but that's never made sense to me. Even the story justifies it. Characters say that Cell didn't want to waste the effort killing someone like him. This isn't like that silly crossover with... the name escapes me... where Freeza just *can't* kill the guy because he's a gag character. So it's kind of a gray area. Yeah, Mr. Satan smashing into a mountain is played for laughs, so it's a gag in that sense, but just because something is played for humor doesn't mean it doesn't or can't happen, and I at least think it can easily be "accepted."

Getting smashed into a mountain like that would at the very least cripple a normal human. Or hell, break his nose, bust a lip, something.

[Zephyr]

Perhaps in moments of extreme desperation and hopelessness, Mr. Satan is able to access what ki he does have, in a defensive manner, without actually realizing what's going on?

[Hitiro]

I would say anything re-referenced in non-gag material counts as it happening. Like Base Gotenks getting a beating from Fat Boo. It is later brought up when they fuse as SSJ's. Unlike Mr. Satan vs. Cell where the gag happens and it is never really discussed again outside of the gag setting. Or another example would be Goku putting the Carrot Master and his two minions on the moon.

[goku the krump dancer]

I see the Cell vs. Mr. Satan example used a lot as a supposed example of gag things not counting, but that's never made sense to me. Even the story justifies it. Characters say that Cell didn't want to waste the effort killing someone like him. This isn't like that silly crossover with... the name escapes me... where Freeza just *can't* kill the guy because he's a gag character. So it's kind of a gray area. Yeah, Mr. Satan smashing into a mountain is played for laughs, so it's a gag in that sense, but just because something is played for humor doesn't mean it doesn't or can't happen, and I at least think it can easily be "accepted."

Getting smashed into a mountain like that would at the very least cripple a normal human. Or hell, break his nose, bust a lip, something.

I believe he was bleeding little and had a missing tooth after that.

[Hellspawn28]

Gag feats are play for laughs and nothing more just like when Beerus was eating the wasabi which caused him to bounce all over the place in a cartoonish style. Mr. Satan has something that most fans in vs. debates called "Jobber aura" which can have a weak character do something out of context in order to hype them or have someone super strong get their ass kick from weaker characters out of context. That's why Mr. Satan can take hits from Cell and Buu when someone like Roshi would not. GT Goku suffers from jobber aura during his fight with Super 17 as a SSj1.

[Gabool The Wild]

Gags happen in-universe but you can't draw conclusions from them because they are not meant to be taken seriously.

You can't, for example, conclude that Goku can survive in space just because he took Boss Rabbit to the moon with just his staff.

I'd pretty much go with this. You can say a gag happened and if it adds to one's feats, but you can't make any outlandish claims out of them. If you read too far into a gag, well... it probably won't work out.

[Gaffer Tape]

Getting smashed into a mountain like that would at the very least cripple a normal human. Or hell, break his nose, bust a lip, something.

I don't think anything or anyone in Dragon Ball could be considered "normal" by real world standards.

[Saiyan007]

Why wouldn't they count?

A feat is a feat whether it's a gag or not doesn't matter if they look cartoonish or not or your're not supposed to take them seriously they still happened.

[Hitiro]

Why wouldn't they count?

A feat is a feat whether it's a gag or not doesn't matter if they look cartoonish or not or your're not supposed to take them seriously they still happened.

By that logic Saiyan's can survive in space because Goku put Carrot Master(Boss Rabbit) on the moon. But the feat is never repeated again and Freeza tells us that Saiyan's can. So not all gag feats are legitimate feats.

[Kamiccolo9]

Why wouldn't they count?

Because if they did, you'd have to explain why Krillin, Roshi, and Goku have magical bullethole regeneration powers, why Goku's head gets twice as big when he bites someone, how Lunch has the ability to create matter, why Mr. Satan can survive being slapped into a mountain by a guy who can punch a city in half, yet gets mortally wounded by a bullet, Cell's head getting 3 times bigger when he shouts for 18, pretty much any Saiyan-Arc Anime Chi-Chi filler, and way, way more. None of it makes any sense, so for the sake of consistency (and also considering that it's not supposed to be taken seriously) we don't count these "feats."

Unless you seriously think that Chi-Chi has the ability to pull guns out of her ass at will whenever she gets mad?

[KentalSSJ6]

Why wouldn't they count?

A feat is a feat whether it's a gag or not doesn't matter if they look cartoonish or not or your're not supposed to take them seriously they still happened.

By that logic Saiyan's can survive in space because Goku put Carrot Master(Boss Rabbit) on the moon. But the feat is never repeated again and Freeza tells us that Saiyan's can. So not all gag feats are legitimate feats.

I could believe that Goku could survive in space. We do know he went to the moon to drop Boss Rabbit off so he was obviously in the vacuum. He could of just as easily forgot and took Freeza's word for it when he said Saiyans could not survive in the void of space. Goku DID forget his promise to marry Chichi. I would think forgetting he could breathe in space would be something he could forget a hour after doing it.

[rereboy]

Why wouldn't they count?

A feat is a feat whether it's a gag or not doesn't matter if they look cartoonish or not or your're not supposed to take them seriously they still happened.

By that logic Saiyan's can survive in space because Goku put Carrot Master(Boss Rabbit) on the moon. But the feat is never repeated again and Freeza tells us that Saiyan's can. So not all gag feats are legitimate feats.

I could believe that Goku could survive in space. We do know he went to the moon to drop Boss Rabbit off so he was obviously in the vacuum. He could of just as easily forgot and took Freeza's word for it when he said Saiyans could not survive in the void of space. Goku DID forget his promise to marry Chichi. I would think forgetting he could breathe in space would be something he could forget a hour after doing it.

Goku was shown as having a need to breathe and having a time limit to how much time he can remain underwater. So, no, he can't survive in space for more than a few minutes.

And for his staff to be able to take him to the moon and back in just a few minutes it would have to grow incredibly fast since the moon is 384403 km (238857 miles) away from Earth and it would have to be able to extend to that length.

Not to mention that Boss Rabbit and his human minions also had to be able survive that journey in space and also be able to survive in the moon since they stayed there and lived there from that point on.

[Hitiro]

Goku was shown as having a need to breathe and having a time limit to how much time he can remain underwater. So, no, he can't survive in space for more than a few minutes.

And for his staff to be able to take him to the moon and back in just a few minutes it would have to grow incredibly fast since the moon is 384403 km (238857 miles) away from Earth and it would have to be able to extend to that length.

Not to mention that Boss Rabbit and his human minions also had to be able survive that journey in space and also be able to survive in the moon since they stayed there and lived there from that point on.

Not to mention Boss Rabbit and his henchmen were fine on the moon without oxygen. I'm not sure about Boss Rabbit being able to survive on the moon without oxygen. But his henchmen who were humans definitely wouldn't have been able to survive.