Dragon Ball Z "Seasons" On Blu-ray: News & Discussion

[Kendamu]

It comes from the fact that they were shown in 16:9 in theaters. Plus, there's always that one Gohan screenshot from Tree of Might where he's firing the Masenko that's not fully animated beyond where the 16:9 frame would end.

[AnimeMaakuo]

The blacks are so crushed that nearly all detail is lost within the relative darkness of a tree or a character's outfit. You would think that an experienced person working at FUNimation would avoid this issue. Wow.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

[dbboxkaifan]

Think of it as an HD upgrade to the 4 Movie Pack, and this is the result.

I too don't like the crushed blacks or any of the other stuff that's hindering its potential but it's in HD.

[AnimeMaakuo]

Think of it as an HD upgrade to the 4 Movie Pack, and this is the result.

I too don't like the crushed blacks or any of the other stuff that's hindering its potential but it's in HD.

I don't see the point of rewarding someone to beat me over the head, so why does FUNi constantly get away with turning what is an otherwise good show into mindless crap? It baffles me when people complain about a product they do nothing about, yet they continue to purchase the same crap. Being in HD is nice and all, but hiring someone to do a crappy job is the same as purchasing a crappy product. If you are too lazy to do something, you do not deserve to have anything better.

[SupremeSSJ]

Them shots are ugly bro, and the worst part is people actually like this.

[eledoremassis02]

[quote="Kojiro Sasaki"
People everywhere say that all the movies were meant to be seen in 16:9, but... where this information actually came from?
[/quote]

Think of Batman Mask of the Phantasm. It was shown in theaters and on the DVD is presented in 16x9 and 4x3.

Also nabbed this from the main site:

While all Dragon Ball movies were animated and produced in a 4:3 aspect ratio, they were actually theatrically debuted (and released to home VHS and Laserdisc) in a matted-widescreen format. In some cases, minor details were not fully drawn above and below in this otherwise-“cropped” viewing area, which would have been revealed by going back to the original prints and scanning in a larger area for the home release

[kei17]

It comes from the fact that they were shown in 16:9 in theaters.

They were shown in 4:3, too, though. I watched DBZ movie 13 at a nearby theater as a child and I remember it was 4:3. The film prints themselves had full 4:3 image and it was up to theaters how they show them, so some theaters would simply show movies uncropped.

Plus, there's always that one Gohan screenshot from Tree of Might where he's firing the Masenko that's not fully animated beyond where the 16:9 frame would end.

Also, when Shenlong grants the wish, the ground isn't present at first and suddenly appears. However, these errors don't necessarily mean that they had only 16:9 in mind during productions. If so, they would've had no reason to finish the out-of-frame stuff in every other shot and could've just always left it unfinished. As I said, some theaters showed movies uncropped and all the DBZ movies were broadcast in 4:3 on TV. In addition, Toei Video released all the DB movies and DBZ movies 1 to 3 in 4:3 on VHS and Betamax themsleves. Most CRT TVs at the time were not widescreen, so they must've had 4:3 in mind too for TV broadcasts and homevideo releases.

I consider these instances from DBZ movie 3 as just general errors, not as "evidences" of how it was supposed to be seen. I think 16:9 is nothing more than the "preferable" aspect ratio.

[eledoremassis02]

It comes from the fact that they were shown in 16:9 in theaters.

They were shown in 4:3, too, though. I watched DBZ movie 13 at a nearby theater as a child and I remember it was 4:3. The film prints themselves had full 4:3 image and it was up to theaters how they show them, so some theaters would simply show movies uncropped.

Plus, there's always that one Gohan screenshot from Tree of Might where he's firing the Masenko that's not fully animated beyond where the 16:9 frame would end.

Also, when Shenlong grants the wish, the ground isn't present at first and suddenly appears. However, these errors don't necessarily mean that they had only 16:9 in mind during productions. If so, they would've had no reason to finish the out-of-frame stuff in every other shot and could've just always left it unfinished. As I said, some theaters showed movies uncropped and all the DBZ movies were broadcast in 4:3 on TV. In addition, Toei Video released all the DB movies and DBZ movies 1 to 3 in 4:3 on VHS and Betamax themsleves. Most CRT TVs at the time were not widescreen, so they must've had 4:3 in mind too for TV broadcasts and homevideo releases.

I consider these instances from DBZ movie 3 as just general errors, not as "evidences" of how it was supposed to be seen. I think 16:9 is nothing more than the "preferable" aspect ratio.

Has any of the guidebooks or the Dragon Box movie books ever touch any light on this? Disney did 4:3 too but again, that could of been for home releases (as you mentioned).

[Kendamu]

It comes from the fact that they were shown in 16:9 in theaters.

They were shown in 4:3, too, though. I watched DBZ movie 13 at a nearby theater as a child and I remember it was 4:3. The film prints themselves had full 4:3 image and it was up to theaters how they show them, so some theaters would simply show movies uncropped.

Plus, there's always that one Gohan screenshot from Tree of Might where he's firing the Masenko that's not fully animated beyond where the 16:9 frame would end.

Also, when Shenlong grants the wish, the ground isn't present at first and suddenly appears. However, these errors don't necessarily mean that they had only 16:9 in mind during productions. If so, they would've had no reason to finish the out-of-frame stuff in every other shot and could've just always left it unfinished. As I said, some theaters showed movies uncropped and all the DBZ movies were broadcast in 4:3 on TV. In addition, Toei Video released all the DB movies and DBZ movies 1 to 3 in 4:3 on VHS and Betamax themsleves. Most CRT TVs at the time were not widescreen, so they must've had 4:3 in mind too for TV broadcasts and homevideo releases.

I consider these instances from DBZ movie 3 as just general errors, not as "evidences" of how it was supposed to be seen. I think 16:9 is nothing more than the "preferable" aspect ratio.

I'll certainly take your word for it! Thanks for sharing that with all of us! I didn't realize that these movies were ever in 4:3 in a theater. I figured it was like US theaters where everything was 16:9 and it was changed to 4:3 for the home release. Usually it was some sort of pan-and-scan effect, but there were cases like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990) where the movie was meant to be in 16:9, but they shot it in 4:3. When you watch it in 4:3, you can see some things that you weren't supposed to (like wires hanging out of the costumes) because it was actually outside the frame in its intended theatrical aspect ratio.

[kei17]

I'll certainly take your word for it! Thanks for sharing that with all of us! I didn't realize that these movies were ever in 4:3 in a theater. I figured it was like US theaters where everything was 16:9 and it was changed to 4:3 for the home release. Usually it was some sort of pan-and-scan effect, but there were cases like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990) where the movie was meant to be in 16:9, but they shot it in 4:3. When you watch it in 4:3, you can see some things that you weren't supposed to (like wires hanging out of the costumes) because it was actually outside the frame in its intended theatrical aspect ratio.

However, most major theaters probably showed the movies in 16:9. The theater where I watched the movie is a local music theater that would occasionally show movies for children on holidays. It only had a 4:3 screen, so they chose to fill it by leaving movies uncropped. Unlike major movies, Toei Anime Fairs were also shown at such local public centers, which tend to have outdated equipment and don't pay enough attention to intended formats.

[samuraix123]

Here's a shot of Piccolo in Broly The Legendary Super Saiyan.
Missing his hand

[jjgp1112]

Think of it as an HD upgrade to the 4 Movie Pack, and this is the result.

I too don't like the crushed blacks or any of the other stuff that's hindering its potential but it's in HD.

I don't see the point of rewarding someone to beat me over the head, so why does FUNi constantly get away with turning what is an otherwise good show into mindless crap? It baffles me when people complain about a product they do nothing about, yet they continue to purchase the same crap. Being in HD is nice and all, but hiring someone to do a crappy job is the same as purchasing a crappy product. If you are too lazy to do something, you do not deserve to have anything better.

They didn't do anything to the master, it was just a weird encode of the stream that made the colors messed up.

[Kojiro Sasaki]

I think the idea is that the movies were made with the knowledge and foresight that there would be cropping.

I tried to find out from where this information came from.

It's a shame the FUNi Z Movie Singles are compressed to DVD5s so the picture quality really took some hits at times, then again, that was Early FUNi but if it were now it'd be DVD9s.

Dragon Ball Z Movie 1 taken from Dragon Box: The Movies:

Plus, there's always that one Gohan screenshot from Tree of Might where he's firing the Masenko that's not fully animated beyond where the 16:9 frame would end.

I'm aware of this. I asked this question with DB Movies 1-3 and DBZ Movie 1 in mind (as shown on the screenshots).

They were shown in 4:3, too, though. I watched DBZ movie 13 at a nearby theater as a child and I remember it was 4:3. The film prints themselves had full 4:3 image and it was up to theaters how they show them, so some theaters would simply show movies uncropped.

Also, when Shenlong grants the wish, the ground isn't present at first and suddenly appears. However, these errors don't necessarily mean that they had only 16:9 in mind during productions. If so, they would've had no reason to finish the out-of-frame stuff in every other shot and could've just always left it unfinished. As I said, some theaters showed movies uncropped and all the DBZ movies were broadcast in 4:3 on TV. In addition, Toei Video released all the DB movies and DBZ movies 1 to 3 in 4:3 on VHS and Betamax themsleves. Most CRT TVs at the time were not widescreen, so they must've had 4:3 in mind too for TV broadcasts and homevideo releases.

I consider these instances from DBZ movie 3 as just general errors, not as "evidences" of how it was supposed to be seen. I think 16:9 is nothing more than the "preferable" aspect ratio.

Thanks for clarifying this.

The screenshots I posted were actually also the second question: What do you guys think when you compare them? I think that 16:9 cuts look no different than center cropped episodes - completely out of frame. If I would need to judge the intended aspect ratio just by looking on the screenshots - I would say that the movies (at least DB1-3, DBZ1) were animated with 4:3 in mind, exactly the same as the episodes.

[dbboxkaifan]

Kojiro @ The Dragon Box movies had much better enconding than the FUNi Z Movie Singles which shows why they look so great. I assume you have the Z Movie Singles so you can compare them yourself and see how compressed and pixelated the picture quality is.

[American Pelican]

Were the VHS and Laserdisc releases of the movies in Japan 4:3 or 16:9?

[Kojiro Sasaki]

Kojiro @ The Dragon Box movies had much better enconding than the FUNi Z Movie Singles which shows why they look so great. I assume you have the Z Movie Singles so you can compare them yourself and see how compressed and pixelated the picture quality is.

It's a shame the FUNi Z Movie Singles are compressed to DVD5s

I am only saying that DVD5s themselves are not a problem. You can record two (almost three) “Dead Zones” taken from Dragon Box onto one DVD5.

[dbboxkaifan]

You're right but it's disappointing that the encodes FUNi made for the Movie Z Singles are in pretty bad shape, although still enjoyable nevertheless.

The GT Singles which are also DVD5 (guess DVD9 would've been better as they have a good chunk of alternate angles) only downside is that the picture quality suffers at times but on stills it's identical to the Japanese Dragon Box GT.

[kei17]

Were the VHS and Laserdisc releases of the movies in Japan 4:3 or 16:9?

The first six movies (DB movie 1 to DBZ movie 3) were originally released in 4:3 on VHS and Betamax. They got re-released in 16:9 in 1996, and all the remaining movies were released only in 16:9 on any formats.

[Jabberwock xeno]

So I finally was able to obtain some of the Blu Ray sets, gonna give my thoughts.

As a forward, my views on what a good release should be is probably a lot different from most of you: i'm not a purist, I don't like film grain, for example: It's a defect that people have gotten accustomed too, nothing more, just like how people don't like higher frame rate video because they've seen 24 fps films all their lives.

Good:
+ HD!
+ Variety of audio tracks
+ Colors aren't as screwed up as the orange bricks (but...)
+ Grain removed (but,,,)
+ Cropping is better then the orange bricks (but...)

Bad:
- ..even though the colors aren't as bad as the orange bricks, they are still messed up
-...even though the grain is removed, it isn't removed well. It's aruably worse then it was in the orange bricks due to the wobbly effect that their grain removal has caused which is very distracting
-...even though the cropping is better, it's still cropped. It's not 4:3.

I'm not sure how i feel about the set. It seems that every Dragon Ball release we get has some sort o\f caveat. I'm disappointed that yet again there are large problems. I really wish that funi would just release a 4:3 blu ray with correct colors, all the audio options, and the grain removed or lessened without the loss of a significant amount of detail. It's not that hard to remove grain without losing too much detail in Photoshop even for somebody like me. I understand that logistically it becomes infeasible to do it manually for every frame, but I would think that with professional tools at their disposal they could do a lot better then this.

All of that said, this is still probably the best release thus far IMO, which is sad in a way. I'll probably tranfer the audio tracks from this to the DNR'd dragon box video so I have the best of both worlds.

[MarcFBR]

the grain removed or lessened without the loss of a significant amount of detail. It's not that hard to remove grain without losing too much detail in Photoshop even for somebody like me. I understand that logistically it becomes infeasible to do it manually for every frame, but I would think that with professional tools at their disposal they could do a lot better then this.

Go tell this to a professional.

Also record it, I'd like to see the video of you being laughed at. Remember to mention about how you did it in Photoshop so it's totally possible.

Far to many fans who know little to nothing of video keep making wild overreaching statements about how easy it is to do this sort of stuff.

Go look at Sword and the Stone from Disney to see how they did.

Nearly all of DBZ is archived on 16mm. You aren't going to degrain much of that without destroying it.