Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[TheGmGoken]

Um..the general audience in Japan told Toei that Gohan shouldn't be SSJ in BoG. Kinda goes against your argument. It's a reason why Korea made Gohan's hair black in the BOG poster (because Korea is awesome). It's an official well known DB fact. You don't insult your audience intelligence.

Not just Japan, but everywhere. When at the theater or in public, most people remember these things first when I say Dragon Ball (all my experiences):
Goku
Vegeta
Piccolo
Gohan
Super Saiyan
Freeza
Majin Buu
Never do they recall Ultimate Gohan until I ask them about it, and even then there is a pause. It isn't insulting your fanbase's intelligence, it is making an enjoyable story for both old, casual fans and new fans.

So we gotta go by what you've asked? Is that why Toei was "forced" to change Gohan to Mystic in BoG. Explain that. If the fans didn't care. Why did Korea change the poster to make Gohan hair black? If the fans didn't care. Why did my Lil bro complain? If fans don't care? It's insulting your audience intelligenc . Your reasoning sounds like something WWE would say.

[mAcChaos]

So what if Gohan fights as a Super Saiyan in this movie?Why is there so much disappointment?
With a baby on a way, maybe whatever free time he had, he used it for studying, so he didn't train at all and lost the power old Kaioshin gave him.It's never been said that he can't lose that power if he doesn't train.And it's pure logic that he will became weaker without training.It took 1 day for old Kaioshin to make him that strong, several years without training and maybe his mystic power would be so weak that a Super Saiyan power is again the best way for him to fight.
I don't have a problem with that, on the other hand, if he managed to keep his mystic power and fights as a mystic I wouldn't have a problem with that either.

You're justifying the in-story reason. But the question is, "why should that be the case?" Fans want Gohan to be back to his prime. We want Ultimate Gohan to kick ass and have some relevancy. So writers should....MAKE THAT HAPPEN! It's possible to do this without stealing Goku's glory away if that's what they fear.

At the very least, give us, through dialogue, an explanation as to why he's not tapping into that power. We have waited over a decade for that...

Is the purpose of this story to just be fan service and let the fans decide what happens though, or is it for Toriyama to tell his story?

If he thinks Gohan is past his prime, then that's how it is. He's never been a fighter at heart, so why would he be presented at the peak of his power?

[Abel Taylor]

Um..the general audience in Japan told Toei that Gohan shouldn't be SSJ in BoG. Kinda goes against your argument. It's a reason why Korea made Gohan's hair black in the BOG poster (because Korea is awesome). It's an official well known DB fact. You don't insult your audience intelligence.

Not just Japan, but everywhere. When at the theater or in public, most people remember these things first when I say Dragon Ball (all my experiences):
Goku
Vegeta
Piccolo
Gohan
Super Saiyan
Freeza
Majin Buu
Never do they recall Ultimate Gohan until I ask them about it, and even then there is a pause. It isn't insulting your fanbase's intelligence, it is making an enjoyable story for both old, casual fans and new fans.

So we gotta go by what you've asked? Is that why Toei was "forced" to change Gohan to Mystic in BoG. Explain that. If the fans didn't care. Why did Korea change the poster to make Gohan hair black? If the fans didn't care. Why did my Lil bro complain? If fans don't care? It's insulting your audience intelligenc . Your reasoning sounds like something WWE would say.

Nonono. I am just saying this: round up let's say 10,000 people. Ask them all about Dragon Ball, and specifically Gohan. The chances are that they will recognize Super saiyan more and not complain as compared to those who would. Ultimate Gohan vs Super Saiyan is pointless because, in general, movie goers are going to see a fun movie, and many of them won't be so critical as to scrutinize Gohan's form and get into arguments as to whether he should be a Super Saiyan.
I'm done arguing though. You won't see things my way, nor will I yours, so there is no point.

[EXBadguy]

Some people say ssjg goku design is lazy but love Mystic Gohan anyway.

I think it's because of the titles of the forms. Gohan's mystic form doesn't have a intimidating title like the Super Saiyan God does. I dunno about you, but when I hear the word "Super Saiyan God", I expect it to look like a god, NOT a rehash skinny knockoff of the Kaioken form.

I've expected the SSG form to at least similar to this... but with a cloak, dark gold aura, SSJ3&4 hair variation, no bandages, and with earrings like Broly's. Just to look like a legend.

[dbzfan7]

*Clearly misses the point of the whole post.*

I know what you mean I'm just saying that him not using his Mystic form against some henchmen isn't a big deal,it's like getting mad over Vegeta not using Ssj2 against Puipui.

If however he uses it against Freeza then I'll have to agree that it won't make sense but hopefully that won't happen cause in his promotional poster they have him in Mystic from BOG so they can't have forgotten about it.

Still missing the point. It's not only that. It's literally there being no purpose to using said form. On top of that we have Goku essentially stealing what Gohan's unique trait is. They refuse to use Gohan, but they have no problem stealing from his attributes from him for characters they want to use. It's like if they went "Hm...that candy beam is cool, but that's Boo's thing.....let's just give it to Goku anyway...I love Goku Sempai."

Speaking of Gohan going Super Saiyan and Goku not going Super Saiyan possibly, it's like SSJ God was so shitty, Toriyama wanted to due away with the lazy looking form as fast as possible. So he took a page from Gohan.

We just have more "It's Akira Freaking Toriyama", so anything stupid he could easily prevent is overlooked, cause he's Toriyama.

[dbgtFO]

Still missing the point. It's not only that. It's literally there being no purpose to using said form. On top of that we have Goku essentially stealing what Gohan's unique trait is. They refuse to use Gohan, but they have no problem stealing from his attributes from him for characters they want to use. It's like if they went "Hm...that candy beam is cool, but that's Boo's thing.....let's just give it to Goku anyway...I love Goku Sempai."

Speaking of Gohan going Super Saiyan and Goku not going Super Saiyan possibly, it's like SSJ God was so shitty, Toriyama wanted to due away with the lazy looking form as fast as possible. So he took a page from Gohan.

We just have more "It's Akira Freaking Toriyama", so anything stupid he could easily prevent is overlooked, cause he's Toriyama.

I think this whole Goku and Vegeta stealing Gohan's thing actually has precedent..
Remember a certain age old debate? My avatar should give you an idea of which debate I'm referring to

[Michelle91]

Why couldn't exist two Hells?

There could be two or more levels of Hell in Dragon Ball but nothing is stated that there is. The only proof that we have is that there is only one level of Hell in the series. I think the new movies from Toriyama can not have GT fit into them. In GT, Freeza seems to be just as weak as he was on Namek while in ROF, he's strong enough to kill Buuhan in one blow. I doubt he will power from training. If he can train now then he won't be even more stronger now in GT if he knows that training can make him stronger.

[sintzu]

Remember a certain age old debate? My avatar should give you an idea of which debate I'm referring to

The one about weather or not Gohan was a Ssj2 against Dabura ? I still don't understand why it's a debate cause he's drawn as a Ssj and before anyone says it doesn't make sense remember that Goku told Future Trunks that he couldn't use Ssj anytime he wanted before training it so the same applies to Gohan who didn't train in 7 years.

Any way good thing this is a small thing among the fan base and there's no way the thread is going to turn into a battlefield between the 2 sides.

[dbzfan7]

Still missing the point. It's not only that. It's literally there being no purpose to using said form. On top of that we have Goku essentially stealing what Gohan's unique trait is. They refuse to use Gohan, but they have no problem stealing from his attributes from him for characters they want to use. It's like if they went "Hm...that candy beam is cool, but that's Boo's thing.....let's just give it to Goku anyway...I love Goku Sempai."

Speaking of Gohan going Super Saiyan and Goku not going Super Saiyan possibly, it's like SSJ God was so shitty, Toriyama wanted to due away with the lazy looking form as fast as possible. So he took a page from Gohan.

We just have more "It's Akira Freaking Toriyama", so anything stupid he could easily prevent is overlooked, cause he's Toriyama.

I think this whole Goku and Vegeta stealing Gohan's thing actually has precedent..
Remember a certain age old debate? My avatar should give you an idea of which debate I'm referring to

Ah yes. To make Goku and Vegeta look more like they're on another level, they demote Gohan for no real good reason. Like we're a bunch of idiots and can't already tell SSJ2 Goku and Majin Vegeta are already stronger.

[GeeRod]

Wow I never thought Kanzenshuu was this nitpick. People complain about Freeza's arm changing from right to left, about Gohan going SSJ EVEN THOUGH HE USES IN BOG. Gohan uses if he wants to and fuck mystic form. I'll probably stop come in this forum and just stay in the main page, you guys are annoying.

[mAcChaos]

Wow I never thought Kanzenshuu was this nitpick. People complain about Freeza's arm changing from right to left, about Gohan going SSJ EVEN THOUGH HE USES IN BOG. Gohan uses if he wants to and fuck mystic form. I'll probably stop come in this forum and just stay in the main page, you guys are annoying.

It makes perfect sense too. He probably became too weak for relying purely on his base power again.

[dbgtFO]

^^^Exactly dbzfan.

[Michelle91]

Gohan went Mystic in BOG as well. I guess Gohan can use both forms whenever he wants. He most likely had to go SSj in order for Goku to become SSjG. I guess he's going SSj in the movie to save power. He may go Mystic later on in the movie.

[Tunjevina]

So what if Gohan fights as a Super Saiyan in this movie?Why is there so much disappointment?
With a baby on a way, maybe whatever free time he had, he used it for studying, so he didn't train at all and lost the power old Kaioshin gave him.It's never been said that he can't lose that power if he doesn't train.And it's pure logic that he will became weaker without training.It took 1 day for old Kaioshin to make him that strong, several years without training and maybe his mystic power would be so weak that a Super Saiyan power is again the best way for him to fight.
I don't have a problem with that, on the other hand, if he managed to keep his mystic power and fights as a mystic I wouldn't have a problem with that either.

You're justifying the in-story reason. But the question is, "why should that be the case?" Fans want Gohan to be back to his prime. We want Ultimate Gohan to kick ass and have some relevancy. So writers should....MAKE THAT HAPPEN! It's possible to do this without stealing Goku's glory away if that's what they fear.

At the very least, give us, through dialogue, an explanation as to why he's not tapping into that power. We have waited over a decade for that...

But, Toriyama made Gohan a nerd (after Cell Arc) who doesn't train and doesn't like fighting, I'm also not impressed with how he developed him, but that is what it is.For him to be back to his prime, he would need to train, but that's not in his character.
It's not impossible for him to change to a warrior like Future Gohan was, but a good plot with a good reason is needed for that to happen.

[sintzu]

Ah yes. To make Goku and Vegeta look more like they're on another level, they demote Gohan for no real good reason.

The reason was said in the previous arc,the form needs to be trained in order to use it at will.

[dbzfan7]

Wow I never thought Kanzenshuu was this nitpick. People complain about Freeza's arm changing from right to left, about Gohan going SSJ EVEN THOUGH HE USES IN BOG. Gohan uses if he wants to and fuck mystic form. I'll probably stop come in this forum and just stay in the main page, you guys are annoying.

Missing all the points but ok...goodbye...you won't be missed . Hopefully the fantastic Kanzenshuu team can still bring you info.

^^^Exactly dbzfan.

Man it's like a curse. I always seem to really fall for side characters, but they always get butt fucked. Gohan and the boys from Dragon Ball, Tails and Knuckles from Sonic, Luigi before recently from Mario. The only one I like who wasn't butt fucked was Zero from Mega Man X.

Ah yes. To make Goku and Vegeta look more like they're on another level, they demote Gohan for no real good reason.

The reason was said in the previous arc,the form needs to be trained in order to use it at will.

He already fucking used SSJ2 in the Tenkaichi Budokai. He knows how to use SSJ2 at will already. It was a bullshit excuse because they wanted to wank Goku and Vegeta's fight some more. They could easily have SSJ2 Gohan, and still get the point across of Goku and Vegeta being stronger.

[Kakarot9001]

Child Goku in GT had to use SSJ3 to fight against someone who was described as a Majin Buu level threat (Rildo), but he easily defeated Freeza and Cell in the Super 17 Saga while in base form. Now we're getting a Freeza who'll be much stronger than a Buu Saga level enemy. There's no way these movies work alongside GT.

There's also Freeza's supposed new form that obviously didn't exist in GT for obvious reasons.

No. Goku used SSJ3 only once in GT and was agains Baby who might have great powers since he made a similiar God ritual with he being Vegeta with Gohan, Goten, Trunks and Bra.
Against General Rildo he only transformed in SSJ in the battle.

Huh, you're right. I mixed up SSJ3 with that pseudo-SSJ2 moment during the battle against Metal Rildo, when he shines and his hairstyle changes. It still places GT Kid Goku and GT Freeza in a much lower level than Goku and Freeza in the new movie.

We must first watch this movie before making these statements, there is nothing confirming that right now.

The Hell in GT is against everything said in the manga, the one we've got now wasn't hinted at but it can work.. Sort of.
If Freeza stays this strength he would destroy base Goku in GT no sweat as he's only around SSJ3 Goku Z at best, and IMO that's generous.
I personally can't see how it fits, but if you really want it to I'm sure you'll find your own theories for it to fit.
Just agree to disagree

We haven't seen yet how strong will Freeza become, but I assume that he might be still one step back at GT Goku PL, that's the reason why Goku could be him without putting many efforts. I expect that Toriyama realizes that after Z comes GT, those movies are the perfect opportunity for him to make explain some GT points.

"Mystic" is not a transformation it is his base state, dude

If that was the case then Old Kai wouldn't have told him to transform into it as he would his Ssj forms plus in BOG we see him power up to it then later to Ssj so he can obviously pick which form he wants.

Not really, Elder Kai has said that Gohan in his base state is more than enough and transformations for him are useless for now on, as for the scene in BoG it was just a simple power-up before trying to knock Beerus.

[sintzu]

"why should that be the case?" Fans want Gohan to be back to his prime. We want Ultimate Gohan to kick ass and have some relevancy. So writers should....MAKE THAT HAPPEN! It's possible to do this without stealing Goku's glory away if that's what they fear.

At the very least, give us, through dialogue, an explanation as to why he's not tapping into that power. We have waited over a decade for that...

Where can you go with Gohan at this point ? The reason they're sticking with Goku&Vegeta is because they're interesting characters with room to develop and build stories around but Gohan ? After Cell he's become a boring character who doesn't care about training so why would anyone look to him when Goku&Vegeta are around ?

The only way I can see him becoming relevant again is if something happens to those 2 but even then they would probably have to have whoever be weak for him to able to stand a chance.

[EXBadguy]

Wow I never thought Kanzenshuu was this nitpick. People complain about Freeza's arm changing from right to left, about Gohan going SSJ EVEN THOUGH HE USES IN BOG. Gohan uses if he wants to and fuck mystic form. I'll probably stop come in this forum and just stay in the main page, you guys are annoying.

Preach!

[sintzu]

He already fucking used SSJ2 in the Tenkaichi Budokai.

Goku also used ssj1 against Freeza yet he had to train it in order to use it freely instead of relaying on luck when something happens.