Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
Bullza wrote:So if Super Saiyan God Goku was a 6, Beerus was a 10 and Whis a 15 then were do you think the following would stand?
Blue Goku
Blue Vegeta
Golden Freeza
Base Goku
Base Vegeta
White Freeza
A good question.
If Goku and Vegeta are still supposed to be weaker than Beerus and Whis, even with BlueGod, then it's going to get a little tight.
I think something like this:
Freeza(final form): 4.
Base Vegeta/Goku: 7.
Golden Freeza: 8.
Blue Vegeta/Goku: 9.
Another question is what happens to North City?
We know Freeza upon arriving on Earth takes out North City, but unlike the rest of the Earth, it wouldn't be brought back by Whis' time-shenanigans as it was destroyed more than 3 minutes ago.
I wonder, if this is going to be another detail neglected by Goku and co.
How strong is the red bull fighter? Apparently, he was able to give Kamicollo a good fight but was one shotted by MSSJ Gohan. So is he around Semi-Perfect Cell level?
dbgtFO wrote:Another question is what happens to North City?
We know Freeza upon arriving on Earth takes out North City, but unlike the rest of the Earth, it wouldn't be brought back by Whis' time-shenanigans as it was destroyed more than 3 minutes ago.
I wonder, if this is going to be another detail neglected by Goku and co.
It's the East City that gets destroyed, actually.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Bullza wrote:So if Super Saiyan God Goku was a 6, Beerus was a 10 and Whis a 15 then were do you think the following would stand?
Blue Goku
Blue Vegeta
Golden Freeza
Base Goku
Base Vegeta
White Freeza
Blue Goku - 7
Blue Vegeta - 7
Golden Freeza - 6
Base Goku - 6
Base Vegeta - 6
4th Form Freeza - 1, if that (from what I heard Goku stomps this version of Freeza in the movie)
Base Goku and Vegeta might be even lower considering Beerus was on the verge of killing them with a regular ki blast after just waking up.
If Beerus is 10 and Blue Goku is 9, the difference is still absolutely huge. You don't have to think about it in ratios, just that the absolute difference in power is probably still bigger than between Vegetto and Mr. Satan.
I know that's not how it typically works in DB, but it's one way to look at it...
Bullza wrote:So if Super Saiyan God Goku was a 6, Beerus was a 10 and Whis a 15 then were do you think the following would stand?
Blue Goku
Blue Vegeta
Golden Freeza
Base Goku
Base Vegeta
White Freeza
Blue Goku - 7
Blue Vegeta - 7
Golden Freeza - 6
Base Goku - 6
Base Vegeta - 6
4th Form Freeza - 1, if that (from what I heard Goku stomps this version of Freeza in the movie)
Base Goku and Vegeta might be even lower considering Beerus was on the verge of killing them with a regular ki blast after just waking up.
AvatarReiko wrote:How strong is the red bull fighter? Apparently, he was able to give Kamicollo a good fight but was one shotted by MSSJ Gohan. So is he around Semi-Perfect Cell level?
Judging by rumors he is Zarbon level. And to be fair he should be.
Marco Polo wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:Cool to see Gohan have a kill for once. He hasn't killed someone since Cell (or Broli if you want to count in General).
AvatarReiko wrote:How strong is the red bull fighter? Apparently, he was able to give Kamicollo a good fight but was one shotted by MSSJ Gohan. So is he around Semi-Perfect Cell level?
Judging by rumors he is Zarbon level. And to be fair he should be.
AvatarReiko wrote:How strong is the red bull fighter? Apparently, he was able to give Kamicollo a good fight but was one shotted by MSSJ Gohan. So is he around Semi-Perfect Cell level?
Judging by rumors he is Zarbon level. And to be fair he should be.
And he managed to get some hits on Piccolo...?
This is what bugs me the most. Sorbet and Tagoma are the elite Frieza's people, one of which even goes as far as to lead Frieza's army, yet as far as I remember Tagoma's power level is about Zarbon's level, so having someone in Frieza's army stronger than Zarbon doesn't make much sense.
Marco Polo wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:Cool to see Gohan have a kill for once. He hasn't killed someone since Cell (or Broli if you want to count in General).
So how big is the power gap between Goku and Golden Freeza. We see the former getting beaten to a pulp by the the latter in the trailer, but then I have seen people say that Goku was winning and only lost due to Serbet's interference?
AvatarReiko wrote:So how big is the power gap between Goku and Golden Freeza. We see the former getting beaten to a pulp by the the latter in the trailer, but then I have seen people say that Goku was winning and only lost due to Serbet's interference?
I suppose base Goku is weaker than Golden Frieza and Blue SSJ God Goku is stronger or equal to him.
Marco Polo wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:Cool to see Gohan have a kill for once. He hasn't killed someone since Cell (or Broli if you want to count in General).
Mystic Tien wrote:This is what bugs me the most. Sorbet and Tagoma are the elite Freeza's people, one of which even goes as far as to lead Freeza's army, yet as far as I remember Tagoma's power level is about Zarbon's level, so having someone in Freeza's army stronger than Zarbon doesn't make much sense.
They could have joined in on some of Freeza's training. Frankly it'd make sense. If Freeza's training gets him so strong, then if even 1% of his soldiers can survive the same type of training as he could, then I reckon they'd at least get to Piccolo level.
Mystic Tenshinhan wrote:This is what bugs me the most. Sorbet and Tagoma are the elite Freeza's people, one of which even goes as far as to lead Freeza's army, yet as far as I remember Tagoma's power level is about Zarbon's level, so having someone in Freeza's army stronger than Zarbon doesn't make much sense.
They could have joined in on some of Freeza's training. Frankly it'd make sense. If Freeza's training gets him so strong, then if even 1% of his soldiers can survive the same type of training as he could, then I reckon they'd at least get to Piccolo level.
In that case I just want to know what the heck was Frieza's training about at all. As it seems for now, it wasn't even mentioned in a movie at all
Marco Polo wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:Cool to see Gohan have a kill for once. He hasn't killed someone since Cell (or Broli if you want to count in General).
AvatarReiko wrote:How strong is the red bull fighter? Apparently, he was able to give Kamicollo a good fight but was one shotted by MSSJ Gohan. So is he around Semi-Perfect Cell level?
If he is equal to Piccolo I would put him around CG SSJ Goku.
...so the same one Nappa blew up all those years ago? Which didn't get wished back that time, either? Wow. East City is officially the unluckiest city in the world. XD
Mystic Tenshinhan wrote:This is what bugs me the most. Sorbet and Tagoma are the elite Freeza's people, one of which even goes as far as to lead Freeza's army, yet as far as I remember Tagoma's power level is about Zarbon's level, so having someone in Freeza's army stronger than Zarbon doesn't make much sense.
They could have joined in on some of Freeza's training. Frankly it'd make sense. If Freeza's training gets him so strong, then if even 1% of his soldiers can survive the same type of training as he could, then I reckon they'd at least get to Piccolo level.
I actually like to think that he might have been a new recruit since Freeza's revival. It seems very unlikely that word of Freeza's revival and training wouldn't spread across the universe, and I can easily see warriors flocking to join him as a result. Some to willingly be part of his armies, some maybe doing so in hopes of Freeza sparing their planet in the future (think Norrin Radd/Silver Surfer in relation to Galactus), or other reasons like that. That'd explain why he's seemingly so powerful, when the likes of Sorbet and Tagoma were weaklings in comparison.
Mystic Tenshinhan wrote:This is what bugs me the most. Sorbet and Tagoma are the elite Freeza's people, one of which even goes as far as to lead Freeza's army, yet as far as I remember Tagoma's power level is about Zarbon's level, so having someone in Freeza's army stronger than Zarbon doesn't make much sense.
They could have joined in on some of Freeza's training. Frankly it'd make sense. If Freeza's training gets him so strong, then if even 1% of his soldiers can survive the same type of training as he could, then I reckon they'd at least get to Piccolo level.
I actually like to think that he might have been a new recruit since Freeza's revival. It seems very unlikely that word of Freeza's revival and training wouldn't spread across the universe, and I can easily see warriors flocking to join him as a result. Some to willingly be part of his armies, some maybe doing so in hopes of Freeza sparing their planet in the future (think Norrin Radd/Silver Surfer in relation to Galactus), or other reasons like that. That'd explain why he's seemingly so powerful, when the likes of Sorbet and Tagoma were weaklings in comparison.
Yeah, I pretty much have the same thought. This way it makes sense, but only if this guy joined after Frieza died, and better, after/during the time he was resurrected, not at any point before it.
Marco Polo wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:Cool to see Gohan have a kill for once. He hasn't killed someone since Cell (or Broli if you want to count in General).
Polyphase Avatron wrote:Based on the spoilers I would guess the god scale power levels are like this:
4th form trained Freeza: 3
Base God Goku: 6
Base God Vegeta: 6
Golden Freeza: 7
Mastered SSJG Goku: 8
Mastered SSJG Vegeta: 8
Beerus: 10
Whis: 15
That seems right to me. Although, personally I'd rank them like this:
4th form trained Freeza: 2.5
Base God Goku: 5
Base God Vegeta: 5
Golden Freeza: 6
Mastered SSJG Goku: 7.5
Mastered SSJG Vegeta: 7.5
Beerus: 10
Whis: 15
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
-Freeza one-shots SS Gohan after he beats up Giant Red Bull Man. Form not specified. But it's probably 1st form Freeza. How pathetic. Also, still no mention of "Ultimate" Gohan, so I'm 99% sure the movie just took that power-up away.
-Goku and Vegeta have two forms: base and Blue Super Saiyan God.
-Goku is strong enough to tank a punch to the face from Golden Freeza. He only gets taken down by a sneak attack from Sorbet's ring. Therefore Sorbet > Freeza.
-Vegeta is also strong enough to beat down Freeza, though this is likely due to Freeza being wounded and worn out, since he nervously declines the offer of fighting Freeza when he's fresh. He loses because Freeza blows up the planet before Vegeta can stop him. Time-travelling Goku rectifies that by blasting Freeza into nothingness while Vegeta is toying with him.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
