Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[Doctor.]

Here's the thing which I find to be equal measures of hilarious and exasperating, Battle of Gods received such a negative response from the portion of fans who preferred Dragonball Z at its more action-orientated, as opposed to light, comic and plot-orientated extents, and it honestly feels like the very people who were calling for a mindless action flick are now berating the guy as being totally out of touch when that's exactly what he's given you.

I honestly get the feeling that Toriyama was under pressure from Toei to deliver something with much more action, so essentially, he's dialed it upto to 11 as a mischievous 'two fingers' to those people.

Hey I thought Battle of Gods was good and I still think this movie looks bad.

[Lord Beerus]

So, just finished listening to the podcast. Julian's opinions on the movie were welcomed, but I found one tidbit particularly interesting. That being Julian's statement that the film hints/suggests that Freeza was able to control/pick the color of his new form. I'm seriously wondering if he didn't go with gold in-universe just as an attempt to mock the Super Saiyans.

Oh please, let this be true.

Toriyama is a complete hack now.

Spoiler:

We spend two hours watching what is ostensibly the primary threat of the film flail his arms about impotently. Why bother resurrecting what is arguably the series' most maleficent antagonist if he's going to be so ineffectual? After all that, he can't beat Goku without a cheap shot? A feckless affair; the indignity of it all is astronomical. Heck, it's only marginally superior to GT and Fusion Reborn.

Well, for what it's worth Freeza did destroy the world, put up a damn good fight against Goku, lead his army to give the Z-Fighters a run for their money and one shot Gohan. So that already puts him way above effectiveness in comparison to his GT and Fusion Reborn counterpart. Both of which failed to even land one punch.

[TheGmGoken]

Here's the thing which I find to be equal measures of hilarious and exasperating, Battle of Gods received such a negative response from the portion of fans who preferred Dragonball Z at its more action-orientated, as opposed to light, comic and plot-orientated extents, and it honestly feels like the very people who were calling for a mindless action flick are now berating the guy as being totally out of touch when that's exactly what he's given you.

I honestly get the feeling that Toriyama was under pressure from Toei to deliver something with much more action, so essentially, he's dialed it upto to 11 as a mischievous 'two fingers' to those people.

Shouldn't put everyone in the same category. I didn't like BOG and I'm a TAD bit iffy on the summary. But I can't judge until my eyes see it. So what if this is more action. Doesn't really seem to add anything. I want something that entertains me. You should also know that most that dislike BoG also LIKES 2008 OVA special. So don't say "People who did this also did this" because it's simply not true. Not everyone's the same.

[fadeddreams5]

Question:

Does Freeza even age? His father lived for so long he knew of Majin Buu and Beerus.

So... why was Freeza trying to wish for immortality? I figured it was attributed to his fear of someone overtaking his throne or killing him (e.g. Super Saiyan). But clearly, that shouldn't be the case...

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Freeza's race may live long like Namekians or something, but that doesn't mean they are immortal or anything. Just because Cold knew of Beerus and Buu doesn't mean he lived for millions of years or anything either. The universe is old and vast, and stories are bound to be passed along.

[batistabus]

Toriyama is a complete hack now.

Spoiler:

We spend two hours watching what is ostensibly the primary threat of the film flail his arms about impotently. Why bother resurrecting what is arguably the series' most maleficent antagonist if he's going to be so ineffectual? After all that, he can't beat Goku without a cheap shot? A feckless affair; the indignity of it all is astronomical. Heck, it's only marginally superior to GT and Fusion Reborn.

To show just how far the Saiyans have come, to show how incredible Freeza's natural skill is, for the twisted sense of humor that Toriyama has taking such an uppity character and completely breaking him down, to show that many remnants of his army are still loyal to him and his cause, because Freeza is a popular character and people want more of him, so we can hear more delightful performances from Nakao/Ayers, to show that Freeza can't learn his lesson and always lets his arrogance get in the way even after being brought to the brink of death then sent to hell, to give Vegeta a shot at revenge, to hear some interesting conversations between the three of them...

I don't know about you, but all of that sounds good to me.

[Rocketman]

To show just how far the Saiyans have come, to show how incredible Freeza's natural skill is, for the twisted sense of humor that Toriyama has taking such an uppity character and completely breaking him down, to show that many remnants of his army are still loyal to him and his cause, because Freeza is a popular character and people want more of him, so we can hear more delightful performances from Nakao/Ayers, to show that Freeza can't learn his lesson and always lets his arrogance get in the way even after being brought to the brink of death then sent to hell, to give Vegeta a shot at revenge, to hear some interesting conversations between the three of them...

I don't know about you, but all of that sounds good to me.

Nearly all of that was covered by Movie 12.

[Mystic Tien]

I don't really see anything dumb about Resurrection F that hasn't been done before and done even dumber. I mean Dragon Ball as a whole relies on somewhat dumb logic, but that is part of its charm.

Don't get me wrong, that "dumb" aspect is indeed part of its charm and it is a positive thing/point, I agree.

But there is the negative point of the same word and they are:

- Leave out Son Goten, Trunks, Majin Buu, Mark and Yamcha for the sake of nothing, under the most idiotic reason.

Actually, they all something in common. They are gag characters, none of them are ever serious, and I guess Toriyama wanted Freeza 's return to be taken seriously and maybe even capture the tone of the Season 3.

All of them were pretty serious at least once, so no, just no. And Majin Buu was a villain of the last arc moreover.

[Blade]

Hey I thought Battle of Gods was good and I still think this movie looks bad.

Shouldn't put everyone in the same category. I didn't like BOG and I'm a TAD bit iffy on the summary. But I can't judge until my eyes see it. So what if this is more action. Doesn't really seem to add anything. I want something that entertains me. You should also know that most that dislike BoG also LIKES 2008 OVA special. So don't say "People who did this also did this" because it's simply not true. Not everyone's the same.

When did I say I was talking about everyone? I was speaking specifically of people who called out for a 'mindless action flick' whilst also berating Battle of Gods for its comedic plot elements - so I dunno, unless that was you, don't take offense?

[TheGmGoken]

Hey I thought Battle of Gods was good and I still think this movie looks bad.

Shouldn't put everyone in the same category. I didn't like BOG and I'm a TAD bit iffy on the summary. But I can't judge until my eyes see it. So what if this is more action. Doesn't really seem to add anything. I want something that entertains me. You should also know that most that dislike BoG also LIKES 2008 OVA special. So don't say "People who did this also did this" because it's simply not true. Not everyone's the same.

When did I say I was talking about everyone? I was speaking specifically of people who called out for a 'mindless action flick' whilst also berating Battle of Gods for its comedic plot elements - so I dunno, unless that was you, don't take offense?

Actually you called out both.

[quoteBattle of Gods received such a negative response from the portion of fans who preferred Dragonball Z at its more action-orientated, as opposed to light, comic and plot-orientated extents, and it honestly feels like the very people who were calling for a mindless action flick are now berating the guy as being totally out of touch when that's exactly what he's given you.]

[/quote]

Like you assumed that everyone who prefer Z didn't like Dragonball BoG. I'm not offended I just don't like when people say "People who did this doesn't do this".

[batistabus]

Nearly all of that was covered by Movie 12.

You mean where Freeza was on screen for 5 seconds and then got 1-shotted by Gohan?

[rereboy]

Nearly all of that was covered by Movie 12.

You mean where Freeza was on screen for 5 seconds and then got 1-shotted by Gohan?

Didn't that show how far the gang had come, while still having Freeza there for the delight of the fans and then the humiliation of Freeza when he loses and breaks apart? It even manages to show the loyalty of his army.

The differences are the length of his on-screen time and the lame "I'm a prodigy so with 4 months of training I can surpass SSJG Goku" excuse so that he wasn't one-shotted. Instead we have first form Freeza one-shotting Gohan when in movie 12 he one-shotted Freeza... Yeah...

[batistabus]

Nearly all of that was covered by Movie 12.

You mean where Freeza was on screen for 5 seconds and then got 1-shotted by Gohan?

Didn't that show how far the gang had come, while still having Freeza there for the delight of the fans and then the humiliation of Freeza when he loses?

It showed NO improvement on Freeza's part, showed nothing about the universe, and didn't have anything in terms of interesting character interactions. Gohan was able to one-shot Freeza...we all knew he could do that. He had absolutely no chance. In RoF, Freeza actually had a legitimate chance of beating the Saiyans if he had been less arrogant, but he blew it.

[fadeddreams5]

Instead we have first form Freeza one-shotting Gohan when in movie 12 he one-shotted Freeza... Yeah...

I just realized this. First Gohan one-shots him in his base form, and now Frieza one-shots him in his base/1st form. Karma. lol.

[TheGmGoken]

It showed NO improvement on Freeza's part, showed nothing about the universe, and didn't have anything in terms of interesting character interactions. Gohan was able to one-shot Freeza...we all knew he could do that. He had absolutely no chance. In RoF, Freeza actually had a legitimate chance of beating the Saiyans if he had been less arrogant, but he blew it.

How did ROF expand the universe? In movie 12 they showed HELL just like ROF. They showed the Earth just like ROF.
Movie 12 has one of the BEST character interaction ever. Freeza commanded Bojack. Unlike RoF we can assume Gohan has mystic not in RoF where's he's SSJ.

[fexus]

I still remember the day when I read the summary for BoG. I felt pretty disappointed afterwards because there isn't much to like about it. Then, I watched the movie itself. The movie is way better than the summary I read. From that day I learn that I really shouldn't shouldn't judge something based on the summary.

[Mystic Tien]

I know all that. My question is if base God (the state he uses against Beerus & Freeza) works like a transformation in the new movie, like it does in Dragon Ball Heroes.

Goku didn't transform into anything, he just lost (absorbed) SSJ God in a movie and continued fighting without even noticing it.

All he is saying is that he can't find a way to beat Beerus now. He is talking about present time, where Beerus is threatening them to destroy Earth.

He doesn't say that he is saiyng about the present moment, he specifically mentions that "No matter what he does, he ain't gonna be able..." which means that he is speaking about the future as well.

Anime-only. In Jaco The Galactic Patrpolman by Toriyama, Planet Vegeta is destroyed in age 739, just as it was said in Toriyama's BoG.

Doesn't matter. This movie is supposed to be a continuation of Buu arc from anime, and it is inconsistent with DBZ. Not only that, but according to Frieza in manga, Planet Vegeta was destroyed 30 years ago from Goku's battle with Frieza on Namek.

We don't know what Whis knows about Boo. We don't even know if Whis even knows that Boo was revived.

As far as things go, Whis doesn't even seem to know that Goku killed Buu, and if he knew about Buu, he would have mentioned it. What helps is that Old Kai (who had an argument with Beerus) knew Buu, yet Beerus for some reasons didn't.

You are making way too many assumptions, Freeza didn't live in Planet Vegeta for Vegeta to see that Beerus was superior to Freeza. He only knew that Beerus was stronger than King Vegeta, and Freeza has a dozen of men stronger than him in his ranks, and he had even surpassed him while he was still a kid.

When someone is making you feel fear, you'll remember it for your whole life, and will always remember the guy who scared you, as your strongest/scariest enemy. Vegeta doesn't look as a traumatized enough person for me.

Gohan was the only one shown to get rage boosts, but it wasn't stated that only him can do it.

It was shown that only him can do it. Vegeta never did it, Goku never did it (besides obvious transformation in SSJ), no one ever did it. So I don't see why Vegeta should be so special now.

And again, it sounds a lot to me that this is just a gag saying "Vegeta will even surpass Goku if you touch his wife!", since Watanabe calls it a silly scene.

Being it a gag, or not, it still doesn't make any sense. For some scene being "silly" doesn't explain its flaws.

When was that said?

When Vegeta couldn't sense Beerus, but when it was said doesn't matter, WHAT was said does matter.

He is the freaking dragon that can revive people back to life through his powers, I don't see why his powers wouldn't be great enough to say a tale.

Yet, he doesn't even know how his creator looks.

He was never supposed to know a lot about different races, he was just aware of things that the entire galaxy was aware (Planet Vegeta's destruction, Freeza's defeat by a Super Saiyan), and could know the details because of his powers (he can look back into the past).

Both him and Whis apparently seemed to know about saiyans, yet Whis for some reasons didn't know about SSJ God, while he is training two of them now. Yet he has a scepter which he never even used... to see what SSJ God is... Well, doesn't make sense to me.

Freeza also stated that his Final Form is actually his true form, the form he was born in, and that he created the other transformations to suppress his power. FnF also shows that Freeza can skip transformations.

What was the reason for Frieza to transform before Beerus? There were none. If he did it, he would have been vaporized by Beerus.

And you think that Goku was happy that Whis helped him?

Yes, he was. Because Kei said that the movie ended with Goku's smile. Not only he messed up once again, but he also used other peoples' power once again. He is just a hopeless guy.

I'm just not interested to this discussion. I don't care about how FnF contradicts the anime. The contradictions with the manga can all be explained easily.

Almost none of them can be properly explained without making up and imagining things. These are exactly what contradictions are. Something which needs to be explained, being excused by fans, rather than by creators.

Toriyama is obviously ignoring Boo then, because Boo is evil in a different sense. Toriyama's statement here also has nothing to do with reincarnartion.

Regardless, Toriyama says that Frieza was the only truly bad person. His previous statement was exactly about that, he said that Buu reincarnated quickly because he was pure evil. That means that Frieza should as well.

Of course it matters how much suppressed they are. If Piccolo had suppressed his power at 5, Kame-sennin could kill him.

No one in their right mind will supress power level during the fight this low, especially a guy like Piccolo. Trunks did it, but it was before the fight ever began, and he did it to fool grunts. Piccolo had no reasons to do it.

Maybe he thought that Piccolo wasn't suppressed and actually had trouble. Or maybe he wanted to act cool..

But Gohan can sense Ki! He should have known how exactly strong was this guy, the moment he appeared! Plus wouldn't it be a better way to show off, to turn into his Mystic form?

It was said from th 2chan comments that Beerus said that Freeza survived because he can survive in the vacuum of space, implying that Vegeta didn't die from the explosion.

Are they even legit? There were also comments about Sorbet saying "Everything's going according to the plan" after credit scene.

[fexus]

How did ROF expand the universe?

We now know that Freeza's organization didn't fall apart instantly when Freeza's dead. We learn that Freeza is a genius. Whis has time powers. There are other strong people in the universe such as the red bull guy.

[TheGmGoken]

How did ROF expand the universe?

We now know that Freeza's organization didn't fall apart instantly when Freeza's dead. We learn that Freeza is a genius. Whis has time powers. There are other strong people in the universe such as the red bull guy.

Freeza or Whis having development is not expanding universe. Nor is the Planet Trade since we already knew it existed. Freeza is a dumbass because he didn't learn that Golden Freeza drains his stamina. The exact reason why Goku kick his sorry ass. The Red Bull isnt strong. Piccolo was holding back.

[Lord Beerus]

Instead we have first form Freeza one-shotting Gohan when in movie 12 he one-shotted Freeza... Yeah...

I just realized this. First Gohan one-shots him in his base form, and now Freeza one-shots him in his base/1st form. Karma. lol.

It all comes full circle.