#NewRules According to Modern Toriyama

[fexus]

If Gohan could go fucking Super Saiyan and beat up a bunch of random bank robbers of earth without killing them, then I highly doubt he'll have a problem. He has no reason to use SSJ over his Ultimate state.

He has. SSJ doesn't let him kill his opponents and still let him fight with his without having him to hold back that much. Also the part where Gohan was asked if he ever kept up with is training. When Gohan answered that he could still go SSJ, he did meant that he lost enough power to make it a little bit hard to fight all those enemies without SSJ. Just gotta have context without trying to say "Boo hoo Gohan lost his powers and was given to Goku and Vegeta."
Again before anyone go crazy, the movie didn't state that in any way that he lost his Mystic form.

Gohan doesn't have a reason. He can control his power fine. He doesn't even need it for mooks that were called weak. Either Shisame is weak, Piccolo got super weak, and Gohan got super weak. Or Shisame is stronger than Freeza/ equal to Piccolo and they didn't need revive Freeza back at all.

Yes Gohan was good at controlling his power. The key word here is was. He didn't train after that. So, his powers declined, regressed or something like that. Shisame was never stated to be weak at all.

[jcogginsa]

If Gohan could go fucking Super Saiyan and beat up a bunch of random bank robbers of earth without killing them, then I highly doubt he'll have a problem. He has no reason to use SSJ over his Ultimate state.

He has. SSJ doesn't let him kill his opponents and still let him fight with his without having him to hold back that much. Also the part where Gohan was asked if he ever kept up with is training. When Gohan answered that he could still go SSJ, he did meant that he lost enough power to make it a little bit hard to fight all those enemies without SSJ. Just gotta have context without trying to say "Boo hoo Gohan lost his powers and was given to Goku and Vegeta."
Again before anyone go crazy, the movie didn't state that in any way that he lost his Mystic form.

Gohan doesn't have a reason. He can control his power fine. He doesn't even need it for mooks that were called weak. Either Shisame is weak, Piccolo got super weak, and Gohan got super weak. Or Shisame is stronger than Freeza/ equal to Piccolo and they didn't need revive Freeza back at all.

OR Shisame got stronger during Frieza's training period. Why does no one acknowledge that possibility

[fexus]

OR Shisame got stronger during Freeza's training period. Why does no one acknowledge that possibility

Imagine everyone in Freeza's army training with Freeza. That would be hilarious.

[dbzfan7]

Yes Gohan was good at controlling his power. The key word here is was. He didn't train after that. So, his powers declined, regressed or something like that. Shisame was never stated to be weak at all.

Nowhere does it state he wouldn't be able to hold back. In fact he did just that and was fine. Also his powers never declined in 7 years. He only couldn't access his hidden power through rage.

You have a flaw no matter what. Freeza's army was considered weak and pathetic, which is why they needed Freeza back. They didn't even need Freeza to train, just to be a power figure. Shisame could fight on par with Piccolo, a being who has far surpassed Freeza and was able to not get totally wrecked by a Cell Jr. That means Shisame would be far stronger than Freeza ever was, and there wouldn't be problems for the PTO. He can literally solo planets by himself. However if he were that strong, then bringing back Freeza is pointless as he's far weaker. Or Shisame is the suggested Zarbon tier and Piccolo got super weak for some reason.

OR Shisame got stronger during Freeza's training period. Why does no one acknowledge that possibility

So he's a fuckin prodigy now too? Colour me impressed. When's it Yamcha's turn? He surely deserves it.

[jcogginsa]

er weak for some reason.

OR Shisame got stronger during Freeza's training period. Why does no one acknowledge that possibility

So he's a fuckin prodigy now too? Colour me impressed. When's it Yamcha's turn? He surely deserves it.

The PTO makes a habit of recruiting mutants, so why not? Makes more sense the Piccolo randomly getting weaker

[dbzfan7]

er weak for some reason.

OR Shisame got stronger during Freeza's training period. Why does no one acknowledge that possibility

So he's a fuckin prodigy now too? Colour me impressed. When's it Yamcha's turn? He surely deserves it.

The PTO makes a habit of recruiting mutants, so why not? Makes more sense the Piccolo randomly getting weaker

Because we shouldn't even have to be thinking about this. There's a difference between inconsistent, and simply not explaining everything. Here is where an explanation could really be used. As much as I find Freeza's growth stupid beyond belief, it's explained he's a prodigy and never trained. It's dumb, but they give an excuse. Shisame has none. Even if he did he goes from Zarbon to Low Cell games tier/beyond. That's countless thousands of times stronger. He's not mentioned to be a prodigy. Also that means his gains are also even more ridiculous then Goku's were on Namek.

[fexus]

Yes Gohan was good at controlling his power. The key word here is was. He didn't train after that. So, his powers declined, regressed or something like that. Shisame was never stated to be weak at all.

Nowhere does it state he wouldn't be able to hold back. In fact he did just that and was fine. Also his powers never declined in 7 years. He only couldn't access his hidden power through rage.

You have a flaw no matter what. Freeza's army was considered weak and pathetic, which is why they needed Freeza back. They didn't even need Freeza to train, just to be a power figure. Shisame could fight on par with Piccolo, a being who has far surpassed Freeza and was able to not get totally wrecked by a Cell Jr. That means Shisame would be far stronger than Freeza ever was, and there wouldn't be problems for the PTO. He can literally solo planets by himself. However if he were that strong, then bringing back Freeza is pointless as he's far weaker. Or Shisame is the suggested Zarbon tier and Piccolo got super weak for some reason.

It's stated when he was asked if he was training or not. He than answered that he still think that he could turn SSJ because of the reason I already posted. How do you know his power never declined in 7 years? I and another poster have already thoroughly explained this in the movie thread. They didn't just need Freeza for his powers and strength. He wasn't stated to be as strong as Zarbon just that he is as useful as Zarbon. Didn't kei17 already explained about this?

[dbzfan7]

Yes Gohan was good at controlling his power. The key word here is was. He didn't train after that. So, his powers declined, regressed or something like that. Shisame was never stated to be weak at all.

Nowhere does it state he wouldn't be able to hold back. In fact he did just that and was fine. Also his powers never declined in 7 years. He only couldn't access his hidden power through rage.

You have a flaw no matter what. Freeza's army was considered weak and pathetic, which is why they needed Freeza back. They didn't even need Freeza to train, just to be a power figure. Shisame could fight on par with Piccolo, a being who has far surpassed Freeza and was able to not get totally wrecked by a Cell Jr. That means Shisame would be far stronger than Freeza ever was, and there wouldn't be problems for the PTO. He can literally solo planets by himself. However if he were that strong, then bringing back Freeza is pointless as he's far weaker. Or Shisame is the suggested Zarbon tier and Piccolo got super weak for some reason.

It's stated when he was asked if he was training or not. He than answered that he still think that he could turn SSJ because of the reason I already posted. How do you know his power never declined in 7 years? I and another poster have already thoroughly explained this in the movie thread. They didn't just need Freeza for his powers and strength. He wasn't stated to be as strong as Zarbon just that he is as useful as Zarbon. Didn't kei17 already explained about this?

Because it's in the Daizenshuu 2 entry. It states Gohan only lost access to his power through rage. However he didn't get weaker. Rusty skills, but not weaker.

http://web.archive.org/web/201111031656 ... ow_up#link

Many years after the battle with Cell, Gohan had become a high school student. Due to either Chi Chi's influence or him neglecting to train, his strength hadn't changed since he was a boy.

During the Tenkaichi Budoukai he transforms at Kibito's request. Because he couldn't gain power from anger and because he hadn't been training, he doesn't have the same battle power as when he defeated Cell.

Your missing the point. Even if he weren't Zarbon level and was higher, then the question is how much? If he's like Abo and Kado, then they wouldn't bother with Freeza. If Shisami could train to Cell games level or beyond, they wouldn't need Freeza.

[TheGmGoken]

Didn't kei17 already explained about this?

Kei17 said it depends on how you interpret the lines. It could be POWER related or Loyalty. However since most statements in the series is power based. I'm personally going for power (And the fact that it took a SSJ Gohan to kill in which Freeza called SSJ fearsome).

[fexus]

Because it's in the Daizenshuu 2 entry. It states Gohan only lost access to his power through rage. However he didn't get weaker. Rusty skills, but not weaker.

http://web.archive.org/web/201111031656 ... ow_up#link

Many years after the battle with Cell, Gohan had become a high school student. Due to either Chi Chi's influence or him neglecting to train, his strength hadn't changed since he was a boy.

During the Tenkaichi Budoukai he transforms at Kibito's request. Because he couldn't gain power from anger and because he hadn't been training, he doesn't have the same battle power as when he defeated Cell.

Your missing the point. Even if he weren't Zarbon level and was higher, then the question is how much? If he's like Abo and Kado, then they wouldn't bother with Freeza. If Shisami could train to Cell games level or beyond, they wouldn't need Freeza.

He didn't lose power but that doesn't mean he didn't regressed. The power to control ki isn't the same as raw power.

Again I and another poster already explained this in the movie thread.

[dbzfan7]

Because it's in the Daizenshuu 2 entry. It states Gohan only lost access to his power through rage. However he didn't get weaker. Rusty skills, but not weaker.

http://web.archive.org/web/201111031656 ... ow_up#link

Many years after the battle with Cell, Gohan had become a high school student. Due to either Chi Chi's influence or him neglecting to train, his strength hadn't changed since he was a boy.

During the Tenkaichi Budoukai he transforms at Kibito's request. Because he couldn't gain power from anger and because he hadn't been training, he doesn't have the same battle power as when he defeated Cell.

Your missing the point. Even if he weren't Zarbon level and was higher, then the question is how much? If he's like Abo and Kado, then they wouldn't bother with Freeza. If Shisami could train to Cell games level or beyond, they wouldn't need Freeza.

He didn't lose power but that doesn't mean he didn't regressed. The power to control ki isn't the same as raw power.

Again I and another poster already explained this in the movie thread.

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He did fine. He handled the mooks fine. If Gohan needs SSJ for Shisame, that means Shisame is on par with or stronger than Freeza was. Hence they didn't even need Freeza.

Yes and I disagree. Freeza ruled through his immense power. Cross him and your planet goes boom. It's serve or die. Rebel and you are dead.

[fexus]

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He did fine. He handled the mooks fine. If Gohan needs SSJ for Shisame, that means Shisame is on par with or stronger than Freeza was. Hence they didn't even need Freeza.

Yes and I disagree. Freeza ruled through his immense power. Cross him and your planet goes boom. It's serve or die. Rebel and you are dead.

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He regressed in ki control. Just like if you're doing something in real life. You don't suddenly lose those skills you never trained for years but you will get rusty at it. And Shisame being as strong as Freeza isn't a problem. They don't only need Freeza for his powers and strength.

[dbzfan7]

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He did fine. He handled the mooks fine. If Gohan needs SSJ for Shisame, that means Shisame is on par with or stronger than Freeza was. Hence they didn't even need Freeza.

Yes and I disagree. Freeza ruled through his immense power. Cross him and your planet goes boom. It's serve or die. Rebel and you are dead.

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He regressed in ki control. Just like if you're doing something in real life. You don't suddenly lose those skills you never trained for years but you will get rusty at it. And Shisame being as strong as Freeza isn't a problem. They don't only need Freeza for his powers and strength.

He at no point shows he has a problem. He's never had a problem over 7 years, so it's unlikely another 5 are gonna make him sloppy. He didn't even weaken over 7 years. Krillin and Yamcha haven't been training either, and they're fine.

Yes it is. Him being that powerful means he'd run things. Sorbet and Tagoma don't mean shit. They do need Freeza for his power and strength as that's what strikes fear into people. His cruelty and power. He holds worlds in check as he will without remorse blow them up. Once it became known Freeza's army was weak, they could fight back. They had no power players to keep worlds under control. With Shisame that'd be a non issue if he's that powerful. He'd nuke those worlds and overpower armies single handedly. Freeza calls the current state of his army pathetic. How would it be that bad if someone was stronger than him was on the team.

[fexus]

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He did fine. He handled the mooks fine. If Gohan needs SSJ for Shisame, that means Shisame is on par with or stronger than Freeza was. Hence they didn't even need Freeza.

Yes and I disagree. Freeza ruled through his immense power. Cross him and your planet goes boom. It's serve or die. Rebel and you are dead.

He didn't suddenly lose ki control. He regressed in ki control. Just like if you're doing something in real life. You don't suddenly lose those skills you never trained for years but you will get rusty at it. And Shisame being as strong as Freeza isn't a problem. They don't only need Freeza for his powers and strength.

He at no point shows he has a problem. He's never had a problem over 7 years, so it's unlikely another 5 are gonna make him sloppy. He didn't even weaken over 7 years. Krillin and Yamcha haven't been training either, and they're fine.

Yes it is. Him being that powerful means he'd run things. Sorbet and Tagoma don't mean shit. They do need Freeza for his power and strength as that's what strikes fear into people. His cruelty and power. He holds worlds in check as he will without remorse blow them up. Once it became known Freeza's army was weak, they could fight back. They had no power players to keep worlds under control. With Shisame that'd be a non issue if he's that powerful. He'd nuke those worlds and overpower armies single handedly. Freeza calls the current state of his army pathetic. How would it be that bad if someone was stronger than him was on the team.

Again ki control is a skill which could decline if it isn't trained constantly. No one ever said that Krillin and Yamcha haven't also declined in their ki control. You're just too fixated on the power aspect which make you lose all sight of reason.

Freeza isn't the only one that can blow up a planet. So, stop kidding yourself. If blowing up a planet is the biggest showing of might, than most of Freeza's top henchmen could do it. Freeza also didn't show his final form to just anybody. Making that his realm of power beyond his first form not very known to everybody. Which makes it stupid to believe that they need Freeza because of his powers because Freeza first form isn't exactly that much stronger.

[dbzfan7]

Yes it is. Him being that powerful means he'd run things. Sorbet and Tagoma don't mean shit. They do need Freeza for his power and strength as that's what strikes fear into people. His cruelty and power. He holds worlds in check as he will without remorse blow them up. Once it became known Freeza's army was weak, they could fight back. They had no power players to keep worlds under control. With Shisame that'd be a non issue if he's that powerful. He'd nuke those worlds and overpower armies single handedly. Freeza calls the current state of his army pathetic. How would it be that bad if someone was stronger than him was on the team.

Again ki control is a skill which could decline if it isn't trained constantly. No one ever said that Krillin and Yamcha haven't also declined in their ki control. You're just too fixated on the power aspect which make you lose all sight of reason.

Freeza isn't the only one that can blow up a planet. So, stop kidding yourself. If blowing up a planet is the biggest showing of might, than most of Freeza's top henchmen could do it. Freeza also didn't show his final form to just anybody. Making that his realm of power beyond his first form not very known to everybody. Which makes it stupid to believe that they need Freeza because of his powers because Freeza first form isn't exactly that much stronger.

Krillin not training at all, and we don't hear shit about him and having trouble with ki control. http://web.archive.org/web/201111031656 ... ow_up#link

After the battle with Cell, he peacefully lives with No. 18 at Kame House. Even having a daughter now, he has thoroughly distanced himself from battle.

No longer training, his hair has grown out.

Yamcha retires, and we don't hear any problems about him either.

Having fallen too far behind Goku and the others, as well as their enemies, Yamcha stops participating in battles. He still lives in West City with Puar.

Freeza is a thug. He's a land shark. He literally goes to other planets to forcibly recruit people. That's what he does. His power as well as the power of his minions kept people in line. It also forcibly added recruits to his army or else they'd lose their worlds. Freeza's average soldier is weak. Like Raditz weak and stated to be below 1500. Without Zarbon, Dodoria, The Ginyu's, The Saiyans, Abo Cado, and Freeza, the PTO has nothing. Freeza was not needed for intelligence. He was needed for his power so he could foricbly control other worlds, and forcibly enlist more soldiers.

He repeatedly conducted planetary invasions, collecting the outstanding warriors from various planets. He sold off the beautiful planets, and his hobby was collecting them. What's more, he acted as a land shark. Feared for his terrible band of followers, he is also the one who destroyed Planet Vegeta.

[fexus]

Krillin not training at all, and we don't hear shit about him and having trouble with ki control. http://web.archive.org/web/201111031656 ... ow_up#link

After the battle with Cell, he peacefully lives with No. 18 at Kame House. Even having a daughter now, he has thoroughly distanced himself from battle.

No longer training, his hair has grown out.

Yamcha retires, and we don't hear any problems about him either.

Having fallen too far behind Goku and the others, as well as their enemies, Yamcha stops participating in battles. He still lives in West City with Puar.

Freeza is a thug. He's a land shark. He literally goes to other planets to forcibly recruit people. That's what he does. His power as well as the power of his minions kept people in line. It also forcibly added recruits to his army or else they'd lose their worlds. Freeza's average soldier is weak. Like Raditz weak and stated to be below 1500. Without Zarbon, Dodoria, The Ginyu's, The Saiyans, Abo Cado, and Freeza, the PTO has nothing. Freeza was not needed for intelligence. He was needed for his power so he could foricbly control other worlds, and forcibly enlist more soldiers.

He repeatedly conducted planetary invasions, collecting the outstanding warriors from various planets. He sold off the beautiful planets, and his hobby was collecting them. What's more, he acted as a land shark. Feared for his terrible band of followers, he is also the one who destroyed Planet Vegeta.

Where in any of those statements that says that Krillin and Yamcha didn't fall behind in power. We specially talk about Gohan because it's said and asked in the movie if he did trained and got the response. We talk about Gohan because some people can't get behind the fact that his skills did get rusty over the years. Would we have the same complains if they say that about Krillin and Yamcha too. I don't think so.

We now know in this new movie that there are more people stronger than Saiyan Saga Vegeta. Which is already strong enough to blow up a planet. Abo Cado was already said to be at Freeza's level. What's stopping there being anymore people at Freeza's level. The fact is, even without Freeza the so called PTO had enough man power to scare the normal folks. They also had warriors that can blow up planets making the threat as if Freeza's alive still the same.

[dbzfan7]

Krillin not training at all, and we don't hear shit about him and having trouble with ki control. http://web.archive.org/web/201111031656 ... ow_up#link

After the battle with Cell, he peacefully lives with No. 18 at Kame House. Even having a daughter now, he has thoroughly distanced himself from battle.

No longer training, his hair has grown out.

Yamcha retires, and we don't hear any problems about him either.

Having fallen too far behind Goku and the others, as well as their enemies, Yamcha stops participating in battles. He still lives in West City with Puar.

Freeza is a thug. He's a land shark. He literally goes to other planets to forcibly recruit people. That's what he does. His power as well as the power of his minions kept people in line. It also forcibly added recruits to his army or else they'd lose their worlds. Freeza's average soldier is weak. Like Raditz weak and stated to be below 1500. Without Zarbon, Dodoria, The Ginyu's, The Saiyans, Abo Cado, and Freeza, the PTO has nothing. Freeza was not needed for intelligence. He was needed for his power so he could foricbly control other worlds, and forcibly enlist more soldiers.

He repeatedly conducted planetary invasions, collecting the outstanding warriors from various planets. He sold off the beautiful planets, and his hobby was collecting them. What's more, he acted as a land shark. Feared for his terrible band of followers, he is also the one who destroyed Planet Vegeta.

Where in any of those statements that says that Krillin and Yamcha didn't fall behind in power. We specially talk about Gohan because it's said and asked in the movie if he did trained and got the response. We talk about Gohan because some people can't get behind the fact that his skills did get rusty over the years. Would we have the same complains if they say that about Krillin and Yamcha too. I don't think so.

We now know in this new movie that there are more people stronger than Saiyan Saga Vegeta. Which is already strong enough to blow up a planet. Abo Cado was already said to be at Freeza's level. What's stopping there being anymore people at Freeza's level. The fact is, even without Freeza the so called PTO had enough man power to scare the normal folks. They also had warriors that can blow up planets making the threat as if Freeza's alive still the same.

Point is they are just like Gohan. Neither did any training of any kind, and yet they are not questioned at all to have lost ki control. Gohan didn't go Ultimate for the ritual as in that state his heart becomes more fierce as said from Piccolo's statement. Here he has no reason to not do that. He can control his power fine. Him going SSJ is simply a fuck up. Like how they didn't have SSJ3 Gotenks in Battle of Gods.

Know we don't. Freeza's mooks were called pathetic and weak. Shisami being that powerful is not pathetic or weak. That's an extreme difference. There would be no rebels if Shisami was that powerful. He could single handedly crush any resistance. The problem is the army is weak and not powerful enough to enforce other worlds no more. That was why Freeza was brought back. They needed someone powerful to take over worlds, and forcibly enslave new recruits. That is what he does. He's a mob boss. They don't rule through some intelligence. They rule through strength and fear. Freeza and his men eliminate inhabitants of planets, and then forcibly recruit soldiers with promise.

[fexus]

Point is they are just like Gohan. Neither did any training of any kind, and yet they are not questioned at all to have lost ki control. Gohan didn't go Ultimate for the ritual as in that state his heart becomes more fierce as said from Piccolo's statement. Here he has no reason to not do that. He can control his power fine. Him going SSJ is simply a fuck up. Like how they didn't have SSJ3 Gotenks in Battle of Gods.

Know we don't. Freeza's mooks were called pathetic and weak. Shisami being that powerful is not pathetic or weak. That's an extreme difference. There would be no rebels if Shisami was that powerful. He could single handedly crush any resistance. The problem is the army is weak and not powerful enough to enforce other worlds no more. That was why Freeza was brought back. They needed someone powerful to take over worlds, and forcibly enslave new recruits. That is what he does. He's a mob boss. They don't rule through some intelligence. They rule through strength and fear. Freeza and his men eliminate inhabitants of planets, and then forcibly recruit soldiers with promise.

What's with you and losing ki control. They never lost it. It's just that their skills got rusty. Krillin and Yamcha's skill may got rusty but we didn't know that because no one asked them. Someone asked Gohan. We could just conclude that anyone that doesn't train much will become like Gohan. So, because his skills got rusty, he may feel it is a little hard to fight the mooks. He also didn't turn mystic because he could potentially kill them by accident. So, he settled with SSJ because that way he it wouldn't be hard to fight the mooks and he wouldn't accidentally kill them like if he went mystic. Unless, Toriyama state the contrary. This makes sense without trying to sacrifice that much and we also don't need to yell "DAMN YOU TORIYAMA!"

Yes we do. Shisami is just one example. Abo Cado is another. Tagoma is also another one. We just need them to be stronger or at least on par with Saiyan Saga Vegeta for them to blow up a planet. Even Piccolo before Raditz could already destroy the moon. So, mooks at Raditz level would be quite scary. This is all without Freeza. As a conclusion, Freeza's power isn't the thing that they need.

[dbzfan7]

Point is they are just like Gohan. Neither did any training of any kind, and yet they are not questioned at all to have lost ki control. Gohan didn't go Ultimate for the ritual as in that state his heart becomes more fierce as said from Piccolo's statement. Here he has no reason to not do that. He can control his power fine. Him going SSJ is simply a fuck up. Like how they didn't have SSJ3 Gotenks in Battle of Gods.

Know we don't. Freeza's mooks were called pathetic and weak. Shisami being that powerful is not pathetic or weak. That's an extreme difference. There would be no rebels if Shisami was that powerful. He could single handedly crush any resistance. The problem is the army is weak and not powerful enough to enforce other worlds no more. That was why Freeza was brought back. They needed someone powerful to take over worlds, and forcibly enslave new recruits. That is what he does. He's a mob boss. They don't rule through some intelligence. They rule through strength and fear. Freeza and his men eliminate inhabitants of planets, and then forcibly recruit soldiers with promise.

What's with you and losing ki control. They never lost it. It's just that their skills got rusty. Krillin and Yamcha's skill may got rusty but we didn't know that because no one asked them. Someone asked Gohan. We could just conclude that anyone that doesn't train much will become like Gohan. So, because his skills got rusty, he may feel it is a little hard to fight the mooks. He also didn't turn mystic because he could potentially kill them by accident. So, he settled with SSJ because that way he it wouldn't be hard to fight the mooks and he wouldn't accidentally kill them like if he went mystic. Unless, Toriyama state the contrary. This makes sense without trying to sacrifice that much and we also don't need to yell "DAMN YOU TORIYAMA!"

Yes we do. Shisami is just one example. Abo Cado is another. Tagoma is also another one. We just need them to be stronger or at least on par with Saiyan Saga Vegeta for them to blow up a planet. Even Piccolo before Raditz could already destroy the moon. So, mooks at Raditz level would be quite scary. This is all without Freeza. As a conclusion, Freeza's power isn't the thing that they need.

Gohan didn't turn Saiyko no Senshi as he is far above the mooks simply in base. So far above that he, or even Piccolo could solo all 1000 by themselves. Gohan never had a problem with control, hence he went SSJ against bank robbers and was fine. He wouldn't accidentally kill anyone as he's not that incompetent or that rusty. He holds back all the time as Saiyaman. This is nothing new to him. It seems he didn't use it cause he simply doesn't have it anymore. He's not so rusty he could hurt someone. He's rusty that he'd have a harder time taking on skilled people. Hence why he had a hard time with Dabura, because his skills were rusty.

Where do you think Freeza gets his recruits? Other planets have strong warriors too. Hence they can fight off Freeza's army. Vegeta isn't exactly the strongest being ever at the time. Several planets could have someone like Nail on their side. Freeza recruits warriors by strong arming them. It says so in his bio he collects strong warriors from various planets. They work for him, or they die. He doesn't fucking pay anyone and they have no reason to join him beyond not being killed. This has nothing to do with blowing up planets, it has to do with killing those who don't join him. You refuse Freeza, you die. That's why people feared and worked for him. They had no choice. His first appearance is literally killing namek children to force people to do as he says. He's a thug who uses his power to control. Not just his power, but the power of his army. The army was faultering because it had no power players. No one strong enough to force their will onto others. Rebellions are slaughtered. That's the PTO way. They kill all those who threaten or oppose them. Freeza kills his minions all the time just from annoying or fucking up. He's a thug.

Too add more to this

Freeza’s organization
The next question asks how many planets Freeza and co. had, and what their organization was like. Toriyama says he thinks they ruled hundreds of planets, not including the ones they destroyed. The Saiyans were a fighting race who since ancient times had lived a violent and inhuman lifestyle, raiding planets to accumulate wealth. Freeza and co. ruled them by force, as big kingpins. They were all a violent bunch though, so their organization wasn’t like an actual company.

On Ginyu

The captain of Freeza's trump card, the Ginyu Special-Squad. He boasts the greatest strength out of all Freeza's underlings, including the Ginyu Special-Squad, and what's more is one of the few men who pure-heartedly reveres Freeza

They are brutes who force people to work under them as big kingpins and could no longer do that to other planets and races once their powerful members were dead, leaving them with weaklings. Ginyu is also one of the few men who actually likes and respects Freeza. Everyone else not so much considering they work for him or die.

[Faustus]

But how is it different?

Different from what? From the manga? The manga was nothing like that. Goku being the main character didn't stop others from getting to look good, and I'd be truly surprised if people honestly can't see the difference.

Now, towards the end of the manga, with everyone being ignored so Goku and Vegeta can have the focus, is a bit similar. But that's probably the worst part of the manga, so it's not much of a defense of the movies to say it's similar to the manga's pitfalls.

Yeah, the manga could have been better about how it used its side characters, but the new material is even worse in this regard. It takes the focus further away from everyone that isn't Goku/Vegeta, and I would honestly expect after all this time that they improve things if the flaws from years ago are so obvious.

Mistakes made a decade ago aren't an excuse to repeat them again. Nor to take them further.

Different from the manga, yes.

That the focus be evenly spread so that every character you happen like gets to "look good" is by no means a requirement of good writing (I elaborate on this in further detail in my earlier posts). Again, characters aren't entitled to any sort of in-universe "respect" from their author; all that matters when it comes to characterization is whether, when the story prominently features a character, they're used well and in worthwhile ways (for something I do take great issue with, see Gohan's development in the Boo arc, which is gradually built up only to lamentably fall through).

Gohan and co. aren't the main characters here though, and that's not a storytelling flaw in and of itself. And again, I do take some issue with some of the specific ways in which they are used (e.g. Gohan jobbing to Freeza) - but there's nothing particularly outrageous here; Julian even notes on the podcast that every character getting their own little moment in F was one of the more enjoyable parts of the film.

Also, nowhere have I said anything was an excuse for anything; all that I'm contending is that it's not especially worse than the manga in this regard. Every time I try to probe someone for answers on this point all I get are increasingly nebulous remarks about Goku getting fellated - when that's just not true. The characters with whom he shares center stage don't look particularly worse than he does (these being Vegeta, Beerus, and Whis), and two of them remain overwhelmingly stronger than he is.

I realize that setting Gohan up for protagonist from the Saiyan arc onward made the original feel a little more ensemble, but are you honestly surprised that after Gohan was discarded as main character in the Boo arc the focus would settle back a little bit more firmly onto Goku? Even then, it's still less Goku-centered than most everything pre-Raditz; and much less have these new films transgressed outright into GT levels of Goku-worship, which to me is a plainly absurd claim to make. In fact, the basic plot-structures of BoG and F follow virtually the same everybody-keeps-the-bad-guy-busy-by-getting-their-butts-schooled-until-Goku-gets-back-from-training/healing/drinking-water formula we'd seen used no less than four times from Piccolo to Freeza (and here, at least Goku shares some of his spotlight with Vegeta).

I don't think this cult-of-Goku nonsense is really a thing. What frankly has me more concerned from a story standpoint is that - even 20 years later - Toriyama's still repeating himself!