What made GT so bad ?

[Dyno]

Not to mention Hell itself. The way it appeared in Movie 15 is pretty much different than what we saw in Dragon Ball GT.

[Hellspawn28]

I think what made DB and DBZ so great is that they have memorable characters and story lines. You don't really get that in GT to me since almost everything in GT is pretty much forgettable. I even forgot on who most of the GT characters where until Heroes. If you look back on DB and DBZ, you always remember most of the stuff in those shows since Toriyama knew how to handle story telling and characters better then Toei did in my opinion.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

I really feel like half the people who call GT bad, haven't even seen the series, and just go along with what everyone else says. Or just the typical "Toriyama didn't make it. He said it's a side story, meaning he doesn't like it. Non canon."

[Basaku]

What I'd like to know is why GT is suddenly viewed as "non canon." How is a 64 episode program just disregarded by its fandom. People think BoG and RoF remove GT, but it doesn't. GT is after BoG and RoF. I think the hate of GT is weird.

That was still valid reasoning after BOG. ROF? You've got Goku & Vegeta having blue SS hair now. It's just hair yet it instantly renders GT incompatible

[Chuquita]

I think it's really interesting how of all things blueper saiyan was the one to override GT.

[SingleFringe&Sparks]

I really feel like half the people who call GT bad, haven't even seen the series, and just go along with what everyone else says. Or just the typical "Toriyama didn't make it. He said it's a side story, meaning he doesn't like it. Non canon."

Thats more of the attitude with the fanbase, when it seems as if the biggest thing is usually, if Toriyama isnt credited, it sucks... even if you can argue some of the modern stuff is regressively, actually worse writing wise in direct comparison.. and contrary to a lot of people, it can be compared. The bias towards GT in some cases seems to validate anything outside it for most people.

[Cipher]

I think what made DB and DBZ so great is that they have memorable characters and story lines. You don't really get that in GT to me since almost everything in GT is pretty much forgettable. I even forgot on who most of the GT characters where until Heroes. If you look back on DB and DBZ, you always remember most of the stuff in those shows since Toriyama knew how to handle story telling and characters better then Toei did in my opinion.

I can't speak for everyone, but can I conjecture there's some confirmation bias at play here? I went in to GT with as much enthusiasm as any previous part of the series (maybe more, since for a long time it was a relatively mysterious part of the franchise) and remember all the characters as easily as any others. I feel like going in expecting a lesser experience leads to being checked out as a viewer from square one.

Or maybe my nostalgia has heightened my memory of it. Who's to say?

[Dyno]

Or just the typical "He said it's a side story, meaning it is Non canon."

Fixed it.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Or just the typical "He said it's a side story, meaning it is Non canon."

Fixed it.

The word was gaiden, which can mean "side story" or just "tale"

[Lord Beerus]

I think it's really interesting how of all things blueper saiyan was the one to override GT.

I think if anything from the new movies overrides GT, it the fact that not only are Pilaf Gang are children but they now apparently changed their goal of world domination to great wealth. And wasn't one of the reason they went looking for the Dragon Balls in GT, which effectively kick-started the whole plot of the show, was so that they could take over the world again? But for what's it worth, they did achieve their goal of great wealth in RF, by wishing for 1,000,000 zeni.

[Dyno]

The word was gaiden, which can mean "side story" or just "tale"

It can means a lot of things, but not "hey, this is part of what I/it's accept/accepted in the main story". Many even uses "spin-off" and "what-if" to say something is non-canon. "Side-story" is in the same "bag".

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Except it doesn't have to mean "side-story", it can just mean "tale", so that's irrelevant.

[Cipher]

Any time spent dissecting the exact intent behind "gaiden" in that instance is the worst thing in the world.

Yes, he did choose to use that word over something more along the lines of a direct continuation, but it is and always was a spin-off, as far as his work was concerned. GT never lined up with the manga like it did the anime.

Basically, sure, yes, spin-off/side-story, but that doesn't tell us anything about GT's relationship to the manga that wasn't already evident. I guess it hinted at the idea that it didn't match his personal view on where the series would go, but ...

I'm actually just writing myself in circles now, since the idea of "canon" in this franchise has always seemed so arbitrary to me. Perhaps if it's of particular interest to you and is defined solely by how Toriyama envisions his world, that quote could be useful.

[Lord Beerus]

But the biggest thing is usually, if Toriyama isnt credited, it sucks... even with FnF having more plotholes... its GT.

RF does not have as many inconsistencies/plotholes as GT does.

[Zenkai]

GT is fine. It's on par with DBZ movies 1-13, yet I don't see many of the movies being hated on so much.

[Hellspawn28]

GT is fine. It's on par with DBZ movies 1-13, yet I don't see many of the movies being hated on so much.

Probably because GT was a sequel to DBZ and people where hype to see what the next big thing will be after DBZ. DBZ movies 1-13 where just movies made to cash in on the show while it was airing and where pretty much in their own stand alone timeline. No one really had any high hopes for them compare to GT.

[voltlunok]

The word was gaiden, which can mean "side story" or just "tale"

It can means a lot of things, but not "hey, this is part of what I/it's accept/accepted in the main story". Many even uses "spin-off" and "what-if" to say something is non-canon. "Side-story" is in the same "bag".

So this is just me noting something I've noticed over the years when people bring up that he called it a 'side story'. They always ignore everything around those words, mostly the word that comes before side story...GRAND. Not just that, the whole quote in general is ignored, why? Cause again it's him acknowledging that HE LIKED GT!

If you are able, along with me, to enjoy watching the original Dragon Ball's grand side-story Dragon Ball GT, you will be pleased.

The following is Toriyama's quote from the Dragon Box GT, the thing everyone cites when trying to denounce GT. Please read that, understand what he is saying in that quote. He isn't trying to say it's not canon or anything, he's conveying enjoyment and an honest thought that if people watch it, they'll be entertained too. If anything this quote is a Toriyama stamp of approval.

Furthermore on the discussion of side stories...enjoy this thread written up by good ol Kamiccolo.

Not only this but like many have said, across this entire thread & site (A lot more these days too!) Dragon Ball has no official canon. It has no official continuity or anything like that. It is left ENTIRELY up to the individual fan. No, Toriyama can't just make a blanket statement about what is and isn't canon because that burns both Toei and Shueisha. The three must agree on a canon/continuity! Toriyama can say what he personally thinks is in line with his work all he wants but that isn't him declaring canon, it should also not be treated as such! Specially when he adds phrases like "To me..." or "Personally I see..." this means it only applies to him. You can free follow what he thinks but don't push that as the canon because it isn't. It's his personal thoughts on said thing.

RANT! OVER!
_{Now if you'll excuse me I'm gonna go to a new thread...a better thread with hookers and blackjack.}

[Tohru Adachi]

Well a lot of people complained that characters appeared much weaker than they should have been. I mean Goku getting cut by glass hurt by a giant clock ect. I liked the concept of certain enemies like General Rildo, but I think the only ones fighting for GT are the ones that liked the new SSJ transformation, mainly 4, which for some reason is talked about like it's canon while still retaining to the belief that GT is not canon. Fanbases are weird like that. I think it's enjoyable as a spinoff series but not as direct canon to DBZ, kinda like Samurai X's movie that takes place several years int he future, well, despite what a downer that film was.

[Cetra]

Nothing made it bad and it is even more unbelievable that people still criticize GT for things that also happened in DBZ, including the movies (Goku and Vegeta are now leagues above others and can defeat them without even lifting a finger, Gohan has proven he can go Super-Saiyajin which was even said in vol. 41 anyway). GT is very enjoyable when someone watches it without pencil and paper to write down every single aspect that, in their opinion was "wrong"just because they wait for it. I also have my "ah, okay .... eh ... but why ..." moments but that would never make me wish for GT to not exist.

[VegettoEX]

Fixed it.

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