Complete list of plotholes/continuity issues in the manga?

[Eire]

This is also 2015, and perish the thought people actually want some consistency in the story telling.

This is 2015 and Internet had already changed entertainment for better or worse.
Back in 90s you watched in weekly schedule, knowing that unless you spend ridiculous amount of money for VHS you are not going to see it any time soon. After that you could discuss it in close circle of friends. Fast forward and you can record/download/buy on BR whatever you want. And even before the episode ends you have tons of revives, recap and analyses from every possible POV and fora are already full of questions discussions and thoughts. And from some reasons writing that you just like the show is not enough anymore. If it doesn't create ideal climate for nitpicking I don't know what does.
But that's just us the eldery. Kids enjoy DB as they did in their cheerful, native way. Judging from stories and thread about an age, average Kanzenshuu user is in his 20s and had been in touch with franchise for some years- it would have been naive to think that they love it the same way the children who watch it for the first time does. I think that (over)analyse, and complaining about good old says is a stage that awaits for every fan. The only think that we must understand is that nitpicking and even poking fun doesn't mean that somebody stopped caring.

[Doctor.]

Adding to all DBZGTKOSDH said, I'd say that Cell not knowing about Piccolo's regen is a massive error as well.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

10 years of writing for a manga in the 80's and 90's (Different time, different standards) vs a few new things that don't have nearly as much work in them. Yeah...real fair comparison. No shit the Manga has more holes cause it's waaaay longer than the movies and Jaco. This is also 2015, and perish the thought people actually want some consistency in the story telling. Another thing that bugs people is the minor things are so easy to either fix or change, you kinda wonder why they even exist.

• Toriyama makes mistakes in a manga that lasted for a decade. Makes sense, he can't be consistent for 10 years.
• Toriyama makes mistakes in his stories after returning to the franchise that he hadn't been writting stories for 18 years. What a motherfucking asshole.

Adding to all DBZGTKOSDH said, I'd say that Cell not knowing about Piccolo's regen is a massive error as well.

From what I recall, Cell assumed that Piccolo couldn't regenerate because he didn't know that he was a Namekian, since Piccolo kept telling him that he isn't Piccolo.

[Cetra]

I still fail to understand how Saiyajin Saga Goku is like 7 times faster than Boo Saga Gohan.

For everyone who does not understand what I mean:

Snake Path is about 1 Million km long.

Goku made it in 2 days. That makes about 21000 km/h. And we do not even take breaks into consideration. If we do he has to be even faster.

Goku was like half way through snake way when he fell to the underworld. Then when he found the way out by taking those stairs it led him back to King Yemmas office, back to the beginning of snake way! Lol so yea, he so would of made it sooner, though the forbidden fruit he ate off the tree helped him tremendously.

That has nothing to do with what I said though.

From what I recall, Cell assumed that Piccolo couldn't regenerate because he didn't know that he was a Namekian, since Piccolo kept telling him that he isn't Piccolo.

But Cell should be able to read minds just as Piccolo did in his very first tournament so that should have been no problem. Just as Piccolo should have read of Boo's plan to absorb him.

Seriously many people can read minds in Dragon Ball.

- Goku (Kuririn) -> Cell, but okay, let's assume it works different
- Roshi (Nam)
- Piccolo (Kami, who can probably do the same thing) -> Cell -> Boo with Piccolo
- The Elder Namekian can read minds if I remember correct, but probably he also needs to touch a person for that
- Kaiohshin (Vegeta), if all Kaiohshins can read minds, then Boo can read minds anyway but let's leave that aside

[Zephyr]

Toriyama's new material only seems glaringly "off" because people have had time to construct their own internal consistencies based on the author's own not-too-terribly-consistent work. There is nothing new under the sun.

It really feels like this is what's going on. If the original series was immediately capped by Battle of Gods, Resurrection F, and Dragon Ball Minus, people would be defending those now, as they would have factored those into their extrapolations and headcanons that they've been reinforcing for decades.

Well I think the opposite. These inconsistencies in the movies and Minus are way bigger than all of the sagas combined. Most of the inconsistencies the old Toriyama made can be overlooked and figured out while the ones in the new movies are inexcusable. Baby Goku wearing clothes when he should've been naked, Bulma's age, Goten and Trunks' not looking older when they should be(heck, they could've made their faces a little more refined and have Goten's hair different or longer, idc), DENDE'S PHYSICAL APPEARANCE AND VOICE(how could ANYONE not notice that), the Super Saiyan God backstory, and the list goes on.

If those are supposed to be the "big bad scary plotholes of the new material", you're overblowing the hell out of them. What, explicitly shown in the manga, does little Goku coming to Earth wearing clothes contradict? Remember, Goku was short as hell until he was 16, Goten and Trunks could simply be taking a while to hit their growth spurt. I'm not seeing what the Super Saiyan God backstory explicitly contradicts. Dende's voice has nothing to do with Toriyama.

Fair point on Bulma's age and Dende's physical appearance, but the former has the easy explanation of being a carry over from the original script which was missed, which at the very least would preclude calling Toriyama's contemporary competence into question (or Bulma was just lying; older women stereotypically do that, you know).

You haven't done a very good job of demonstrating how these ones are "inexcusable", in contrast to the ones in the manga that "can be overlooked" and "figured out".

[Mystic Tien]

Let's see...

• The Dragon Balls are turned into stones for 1 year after they are used. In the end of the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai, they were active once again. However, only 8 months had passed between the last wish & the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai.
• In the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai, Goku uses the Super Kamehameha to kill Piccolo, and Kami with him, and says that they can bring back Kami with the Dragon Balls after that. However, he later says that if Kami dies, the DBs are gone too. He somehow forgets about this before that revelation.
• The narrator says that regular Kaio-ken doubles the power of the user. However, Goku uses Kaio-ken x2 as if it was a level above the regular Kaio-ken in the same chapter.
• When Goku blasted Vegeta with his Kaio-ken x4 Kamehameha, Vegeta was having a monologue in his head, and he says that he is the strongest in the universe. However, we later learn that there are many others much stronger than him in Freeza's forces.
• Vegeta's battle power when he got to Namek was 24.000. After getting a near-death power-up through his 1st fight with Zarbon, he obviously got stronger. However, Jheese's scouter reads Vegeta's battle power as being close to 20.000, which is obviously false. This one is fixed in a latter edition of the Kanzenban release, where his battle power is now close to 30.000, instead of 20.000.
• Freeza is surprised that a guy like Goku existed, who was stronger than Ginyu. Vegeta, Piccolo, and Gohan had surpassed Ginyu during their fight with Freeza, so Freeza shouldn't be surprised at that point.
• When Trunks came to warn Goku about the Artificial Humans, he says that the Artificial Humans from the future are #19 & #20. However, we later learn that they are actually #17 & #18, and Trunks doesn't recognize #19 & #20 when he sees them.
• During Cell's explanation about his identity to Piccolo, he says that Trunks' DNA during his fight with Mecha Freeza & Cold wasn't collected because they already had enough Saiyan DNA. However, Trunks never fought Mecha Freeza & Cold in his timeline, Goku was the one who killed them.
• Goku blows up Cell's upper body, and he was able to regenerate. Later, we learn that Cell won't be able to regenerate if his nucleus in his head is destroyed. Goku's attack should have destroyed the nucleus.
• Kaioshin says that Majin Boo killed the other 4 Kaioshin. However, he later says that the 2 of them weren't killed, but absorbed.
• Goku says that he told Boo to wait for an opponent stronger than him (SS Gotenks), and that he looked happy about it. Goku never said that this opponent would have been stronger than him.
• When Gotenks & Boo were fighting inside the Room of Spirit and Time, Goku didn't know where they were, and he found it strange that he couldn't sense Gotenks' & Boo's ki. He should have been searching for Goten's & Trunks' ki, since the kids began fighting Boo & merged after they got inside the RoSaT, not before.

There are also strength/speed feats that are inconsistent with feats of much stronger characters in later arcs, there are small errors in the art at times, and the colors in colored pages are not always consistent (we've seen Karin in various colors, for example). Gags aren't included.

Extra - Contradictions in Toriyama's new stories:

• Toriyama said in an interview that there are 3 Kaioshins, and that they work in shifts. However, the manga shows that there are 5 Kaioshins, and they are divided into the Kaioshins of the North, East, West, and South respectively, with the Dai Kaioshin supervising them all.
• Toriyama said in an interview that Beerus destroyed Kaio's planet after losing in a car-racing video-game. However, Whis says in DBZ: Battle of Gods that Beerus destroyed the planet after losing in hide-and-seek.
• In DBZ: Battle of Gods, it is said that Vegeta has a brother in another planet (a reference to Tarble from DB: Heya! Son Goku & Friends Return!!). However, Vegeta says in the manga (when trying to figure out how Trunks was a Super Saiyan), while speaking in his head, that he, Goku, and Gohan were the only remaining Saiyans.
• In DBZ: Battle of Gods, Bulma says that she is 38 years-old, while she actually should be 45. Mai also says that she is 41, which would make her 12 years-old in her first appearance in the manga, but she looks much older than that, which makes it impossible for her to be 41.
• In DBZ: Battle of Gods, Mr. Satan doesn't know who Dende is and doesn't know that he is the Kami of Earth, while he met him & learned that he is the Kami of Earth in the manga.
• In Jaco The Galactic Patrolman, Omori says that Bulma went after the Dragon Balls after graduating the university. However, Bulma is still shown going to school in the manga.
• In DBZ: Battle of Gods, we learn that the gods' ki like Beerus, Whis, and the Super Saiyan God can't be sensed by mortals, and in DBZ: Resurrection "F", Goku says that he can't use Shunkan Ido because he can't sense Beerus' & Whis' ki, since they are gods. However, we've seen mortals sensing the ki of gods in the manga, such as when Gohan & Piccolo could sense Kami Dende's ki, and Goku traveled to Kaio numerous times by using Shunkan Ido.

Did I miss anything?

Marvelous. Just add another one:

In manga Frieza states that Planet Vegeta was destroyed by him 30 years prior to his fight with Goku on Namek. It doesn't make sense, and doesn't fit with anything.

[LuckyCat]

Adding to all DBZGTKOSDH said, I'd say that Cell not knowing about Piccolo's regen is a massive error as well.

Not really. Stage 1 Cell isn't perfect and makes stupid decisions (using a kamehameha to "shock" Trunks after he knew Trunks saw his perfect form was another mistake). Cell probably just thought Piccolo had effectively conceded and was then surprised that Piccolo could regenerate AND had a reserve of power that could still dominate Cell.

[Doctor.]

Adding to all DBZGTKOSDH said, I'd say that Cell not knowing about Piccolo's regen is a massive error as well.

Not really. Stage 1 Cell isn't perfect and makes stupid decisions (using a kamehameha to "shock" Trunks after he knew Trunks saw his perfect form was another mistake). Cell probably just thought Piccolo had effectively conceded and was then surprised that Piccolo could regenerate AND had a reserve of power that could still dominate Cell.

But the scene heavily implies Cell DIDN'T know Piccolo could regen, as Piccolo even says "You have my cells, shouldn't you know I can regenerate my limbs?".

[Faustus]

[*]In DBZ: Battle of Gods, we learn that the gods' ki like Beerus, Whis, and the Super Saiyan God can't be sensed by mortals, and in DBZ: Resurrection "F", Goku says that he can't use Shunkan Ido because he can't sense Beerus' & Whis' ki, since they are gods. However, we've seen mortals sensing the ki of gods in the manga, such as when Gohan & Piccolo could sense Kami Dende's ki, and Goku traveled to Kaio numerous times by using Shunkan Ido.

I'm not sure this qualifies as an error. "God ki" is a fan invention as far as I'm aware, and of the "gods" we've seen in the series only Beerus and Whis seem to possess the kind of ki that's so refined it can't be sensed.

It appears to be more a question of power than title, too. Remember, SSG Goku isn't actually a god in any official capacity, yet his ki can't be detected either. And if a mortal can come under possession of this special type of ki without necessarily becoming a "god" themselves (in the official sense), then I suspect the actual gods we see in the series, Dende and Kaio included, don't just suddenly get to have it because they happen to have been appointed to their specific position. I seriously doubt Goku would have immediately gotten this "God ki", as it is so called, had he just taken God's offer after his match with Piccolo at the 23rd.

Did I miss anything?

Oh, what about the number of wishes in BoG?

[Baggie_Saiyan]

10 years of writing for a manga in the 80's and 90's (Different time, different standards) vs a few new things that don't have nearly as much work in them. Yeah...real fair comparison. No shit the Manga has more holes cause it's waaaay longer than the movies and Jaco. This is also 2015, and perish the thought people actually want some consistency in the story telling. Another thing that bugs people is the minor things are so easy to either fix or change, you kinda wonder why they even exist.

About time somebody says this! Take SSG for example, people expected better from this form, what do we get, a STUPID SKINNY KAIOKEN KNOCKOFF! If that ain't lazy and oversimplified, then I dunno what is. I'm not asking for an "over the top" form, all I'm saying is have the form live up to its name.

Err that has nothing to do with the topic nor what dbzfan7 even said Super Saiyan God does not contradict anything at all...

Did I miss anything?

Oh, what about the number of wishes in BoG?

Well they didn't really wish anything in BoG, Shenron just got scared answered and then disappeared.

[Faustus]

Well they didn't really wish anything in BoG, Shenron just got scared answered and then disappeared.

Oh, right. What about the number of wishes in RoF then (2 as opposed to 3)?

[Doctor.]

Well they didn't really wish anything in BoG, Shenron just got scared answered and then disappeared.

Oh, right. What about the number of wishes in RoF then (2 as opposed to 3)?

I think Shenlong did answer one in BoG, got scared of Beerus and disappeared; these 2 are the remaining ones.

[LuckyCat]

But the scene heavily implies Cell DIDN'T know Piccolo could regen, as Piccolo even says "You have my cells, shouldn't you know I can regenerate my limbs?".

I think he says "You forgot I could regenerate" in the japanese manga. Cell was overconfident and made a dumb mistake. That's Cell's mistake, and its consistent with other mistakes Cell makes.

[Mystic Tien]

I'm not sure this qualifies as an error. "God ki" is a fan invention as far as I'm aware, and of the "gods" we've seen in the series only Beerus and Whis seem to possess the kind of ki that's so refined it can't be sensed.

It appears to be more a question of power than title, too. Remember, SSG Goku isn't actually a god in any official capacity, yet his ki can't be detected either. And if a mortal can come under possession of this special type of ki without necessarily becoming a "god" themselves (in the official sense), then I suspect the actual gods we see in the series, Dende and Kaio included, don't just suddenly get to have it because they happen to have been appointed to their specific position. I seriously doubt Goku would have immediately gotten this "God ki", as it is so called, had he just taken God's offer after his match with Piccolo at the 23rd.

But Kaio and Kaioshin sensed Beerus' energy, and they were the only ones who could.

[Lord Beerus]

Well they didn't really wish anything in BoG, Shenron just got scared answered and then disappeared.

Oh, right. What about the number of wishes in RoF then (2 as opposed to 3)?

I think Shenlong did answer one in BoG, got scared of Beerus and disappeared; these 2 are the remaining ones.

Yeah. And it was already established you could save your wishes for another occasion. So the two wishes he didn't grant in BOG were the two wishes he granted in ROF.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

But wouldn't the wishes revert back to 3 after a year? Unless Freeza was resurrected before the the year ended?

[Doctor.]

But wouldn't the wishes revert back to 3 after a year? Unless Freeza was resurrected before the the year ended?

The events of RF take place just a year after BoG, so yes, he was resurrected before a year passed.

[dbzfan7]

10 years of writing for a manga in the 80's and 90's (Different time, different standards) vs a few new things that don't have nearly as much work in them. Yeah...real fair comparison. No shit the Manga has more holes cause it's waaaay longer than the movies and Jaco. This is also 2015, and perish the thought people actually want some consistency in the story telling. Another thing that bugs people is the minor things are so easy to either fix or change, you kinda wonder why they even exist.

• Toriyama makes mistakes in a manga that lasted for a decade. Makes sense, he can't be consistent for 10 years.
• Toriyama makes mistakes in his stories after returning to the franchise that he hadn't been writting stories for 18 years. What a motherfucking asshole.

Of course 10 years of consistency for a weekly deadline manga series is harder than than an hour in a movie.

Way to over exaggerate. Besides if you want to be consistent you can reread an familiarize yourself with the story (Which I think he said he did), and also have people around to help craft the stories. Like an editor. Hell I believe he said Naho Ooishi knows Dragon Ball better than him. Not to say she could make a better story, just that she's more knowledgeable. Have her around or someone like her to help him out.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

But wouldn't the wishes revert back to 3 after a year? Unless Freeza was resurrected before the the year ended?

The events of RF take place just a year after BoG, so yes, he was resurrected before a year passed.

Ahh nice one, that two wishes theory sounds good to me then! I assumed Freeza was resurrected a year later and "F" happened 6 months after that.

[VegettoEX]

Way to over exaggerate.

Do not speak like this to other people.