The dislike for SSJ Bardock

[Doctor.]

Gohan isn't special because he is Goku's son, he is special because he is a Saiyan/Earthling Halfling. Same goes for Goten & Trunks. So yes, if he was Nappa's & an Earthling woman's son, he would still be special.

And likewise, Goku is special compared to the Earthlings because he's from the Saiyan race, a race adept to fighting. That wasn't really the point. Having EoB into account, if Gohan was a saiyan/earthling hybrid but Nappa's son, he'd still be strong, but he wouldn't get AS strong, because he's not Bardock's grandson and, as such, wouldn't inherit the huge potential of the family. Trunks is stronger than Goten, because even though Goku is stronger than Vegeta, Vegeta's family has always had the potential to become stronger.

We never saw Bardock doing training, but he lived his life in the front lines, fighting all the time to near-death. If he was born special, he wouldn't have been a low-class warrior.

That sentence was referring to EoB, I'm well-aware that Bardock isn't special in the TV special. I'm saying that EoB MAKES him special by giving him a transformation that Goku (and any other Saiyan who transformed) had to surpass Saiyan limitations a bunch of time to achieve. EoB never made mention of Bardock's power increasing from the one he had in the TV special, it never made mention of Bardock surpassing Saiyan limitations, he just transformed; it makes him have this ridiculously huge potential, why did he transform when he was still in the same realm of power as every other Saiyan? Why didn't they transform instead?

Vegeta is different. Vegeta was born special, and his father was also born special. Both Goku & Bardock were born trash, and had to go through a lot to reach the levels they reached.

No, Bardock in EoB did not. Like I said above, he achieved a transformation whilst in the same realm of power as every other Saiyan in existence. He was a low class in the TV special and he was a low class in EoB because the story never said his power increased! Again, if HE transformed and stronger Saiyans in the mid-class and elite didn't, then HE's special. And, as such, that would make Goku have a lot of potential too, which is completely against what the manga portrayed Goku as.

[Luso Saiyan]

The moment he was the child of the legendary Super Saiyan, I think that's fairly obvious.

But he wasn't. He was the son of a Saiyan who was able to transform later on into a Super Saiyan.

Yes it does. If Bardock had the potential to transform,

Any Saiyan has the potential to transform, as long as he/she fills the requirements.

then Goku has the potential too because he's his son,

Again, Goku is the son of a low-class Saiyan who was able to transform later on. His power level didn't change because of the events of EoB, nor did his potential.

He was repeatedly stated to have surpassed the limitations of a normal Saiyan and went through Hell and back before he could transform.

And who knows what happened with Bardock to be revived and brought into the past.

It does? His death remains tragic right?

It does.

Nobody said he couldn't transform after.

Then what's the problem?

If EoB wasn't so badly written and he actually had a good reason to transform, then it would be easier to swallow.

His "reason" is no different from what we have previously seen in the series, so it should be good enough.

The point is that NOTHING changed from the TV special to Episode of Bardock.

Nothing that you've seen, but something did change. First, he's still alive. Second, he went back to the past. And third, we don't know what was the catalyst for it all.

The special never made reference to his power increasing, it never hinted at why he could go Super Saiyan now but couldn't before, he just achieved the transformation without explanation.

He achieved it because he fullfilled the requirements for it. And just because his power increase wasn't mentioned, doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Not being special is reserved to a select few like Goku and (pre-EoB) Bardock.

They weren't special but they became special. Why the double standards?

As is everyone's post here, so I'm not sure why this part of your post was necessary.

Because you stated it as fact.

[VegettoEX]

Let's please not do these excessive, single-line, point-by-point breakdowns. That's not a discussion.

[Luso Saiyan]

Let's please not do these excessive, single-line, point-by-point breakdowns. That's not a discussion.

I'm addressing things point by point just be clear in each argument, but I'll put it in a single quote next time.

[Doctor.]

But he wasn't. He was the son of a Saiyan who was able to transform later on into a Super Saiyan.

Again, Goku is the son of a low-class Saiyan who was able to transform later on. His power level didn't change because of the events of EoB, nor did his potential.

Yes, and what's the difference? No Saiyan ever transformed into Super Saiyan in their lifetime before so what makes Bardock so different? If Bardock CAN transform being in the same realm of power as the other Saiyans, when Goku, Vegeta, etc, had all to become dozens of times stronger than the average Saiyan to transform, then Bardock has a huge potential and, as such, Goku inherited it too. Bardock IS special if he can transform with such a low level of power. If EoB made the effort to increase Bardock's power a lot, then you'd have more of a point.

If Bardock was a Saiyan like the rest who never transformed, then so is Goku.
If Bardock was a Saiyan like the rest who did transform, then he had the potential to transform all along, which then Goku inherits.

Any Saiyan has the potential to transform, as long as he/she fills the requirements.

The requirements are "surpassing Saiyan's limitations" and "having a tranquil heart awakened by rage". Now let's walk this over through steps.

1. Bardock's crew dies, he doesn't transform.
2. Bardock's planet is being destroyed, he doesn't transform.
3. Episode of Bardock begins, no mention of Bardock's power increasing a lot to "surpass Saiyan limitations" has been made
4. He transforms

Why did he transform in Episode of Bardock? How did he fill the requirements? He COULD have filled the requirements, but did the story do a good job of portraying that? No, it didn't. You can ASSUME he became stronger, but the story (episode of Bardock) never made the effort to explain that he did, in fact, get stronger, it never made the effort to portray the SS transformation as this unfathomable ad unatainable legend even in dire situations like it did with Goku. It was a stupid transformation with no reasonable explanation.

And who knows what happened with Bardock to be revived and brought into the past.

It's not "who knows", that's damage control; it's poor storytelling, the story had the obligation to explain it properly, it had the obligation to make it sound reasonable and credible, and it had the obligation of not ruining Goku and Bardock's character and legacy. It did none of those things correctly.

It does.

He doesn't die, how can it remain tragic? He goes back into the past for some reason and is the sole creator of a thousand year legend. His story may be tragic because his friends died, but he didn't die himself, so how is it a "tragic death"?

Then what's the problem?

The problems are, like I explained earlier, the story never makes an effort to say Bardock's power increased. It never explains why Bardock couldn't transform before, but he can now. It never makes an effort of portraying the SS transformation as something legendary and unobtainable, it never makes an effort to explain why Bardock is so different from EVERYONE ELSE.

You can pull and stretch, and find your OWN explanations to why he transformed, you can ASSUME that his power increased, but the story itself doesn't bother; that's the problem.

His "reason" is no different from what we have previously seen in the series, so it should be good enough.

What's his reason? Anger? What made it so different now than when his friends were killed or when Freeza blew up the planet? As I've been saying a thousand times over, the story does not make a good job of making his transformation seem reasonable, it makes a good job of making it seem stupid and pointless, however.

Nothing that you've seen, but something did change. First, he's still alive. Second, he went back to the past. And third, we don't know what was the catalyst for it all.

"We don't know" sums it all up. That's the story's fault. Assumptions and fan theories are not supposed to cover up holes a story leaves behind. As such, the poor storytelling damages the character as well.

He achieved it because he fullfilled the requirements for it. And just because his power increase wasn't mentioned, doesn't mean it didn't happen.

I keep going back to the same point:

The requirements are "surpassing Saiyan's limitations" and "having a tranquil heart awakened by rage". Now let's walk this over through steps.

1. Bardock's crew dies, he doesn't transform.
2. Bardock's planet is being destroyed, he doesn't transform.
3. Episode of Bardock begins, no mention of Bardock's power increasing a lot to "surpass Saiyan limitations" has been made
4. He transforms

Why did he transform in Episode of Bardock? How did he fill the requirements? He COULD have filled the requirements, but did the story do a good job of portraying that? No, it didn't. You can ASSUME he became stronger, but the story (episode of Bardock) never made the effort to explain that he did, in fact, get stronger, it never made the effort to portray the SS transformation as this unfathomable ad unatainable legend even in dire situations like it did with Goku. It was a stupid transformation with no reasonable explanation.

As for "And just because his power increase wasn't mentioned, doesn't mean it didn't happen.":

"We don't know" sums it all up. That's the story's fault. Assumptions and fan theories are not supposed to cover up holes a story leaves behind. As such, the poor storytelling damages the character as well.

They weren't special but they became special. Why the double standards?

No, Goku has always been special if we take EoB into account because Goku inherited Bardock's potential to become strong, just like Gohan and Goten inherited Goku's potential, and Trunks inherited Vegeta's, who inherited King Vegeta's and so on and so forth.

As for Bardock being "generic", let's take other Shounen as examples: Naruto's father was one of the Hokages, Luffy's father is the leader of the revolutionaries, Gon's father is the world's best hunter, Ichigo's father is a top-class Shinigami, Toriko's adoptive father was the strongest man in the world, and it just goes on and on. What seems more generic, Bardock being a Saiyan like the rest, or him being the Super Saiyan? I think it's the second option.

Because you stated it as fact.

"In my opinion" is always implied in every post regarding literature, no post regarding literature is objective, it's all subjective and everyone should always have that in their mind. This seemed like you just didn't like someone hating something you like.

[vegeta623i]

Weird I never really heard of anyone who hated/dislike ssj bardock I mostly hear people complaining about how the story didn't make any sense and how frieza's death ball could send him to the past apart from that I don't really understand the dislike maybe its how the story was told

[Polyphase Avatron]

Well if you go by the TV Special, wasn't Bardock already the second strongest Saiyan behind Vegeta at the time he died? Why didn't anyone complain about that?

I don't remember that being stated anywhere in the special.

Well I based it on the fact that he was 10,000 or so at the beginning and got a zenkai after that... so he should be stronger than King Vegeta at least. I mean Nappa was considered elite among Saiyans and he was less than half as strong as Bardock.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

And likewise, Goku is special compared to the Earthlings because he's from the Saiyan race, a race adept to fighting. That wasn't really the point. Having EoB into account, if Gohan was a saiyan/earthling hybrid but Nappa's son, he'd still be strong, but he wouldn't get AS strong, because he's not Bardock's grandson and, as such, wouldn't inherit the huge potential of the family. Trunks is stronger than Goten, because even though Goku is stronger than Vegeta, Vegeta's family has always had the potential to become stronger.

What are you talking about? Neither Bardock nor Goku have anything to do with Gohan's dormant powers. It is repeatedly stated that Gohan is special because he is a Saiyan/Earthling Halfling. Trunks is slightly stronger than Goten because he is older than him.

That sentence was referring to EoB, I'm well-aware that Bardock isn't special in the TV special. I'm saying that EoB MAKES him special by giving him a transformation that Goku (and any other Saiyan who transformed) had to surpass Saiyan limitations a bunch of time to achieve. EoB never made mention of Bardock's power increasing from the one he had in the TV special, it never made mention of Bardock surpassing Saiyan limitations, he just transformed; it makes him have this ridiculously huge potential, why did he transform when he was still in the same realm of power as every other Saiyan? Why didn't they transform instead?

Bardock was at almost 10.000 in th TV Special, and he should have a near-death power-up after his fight with Freeza, since he was nearly dead when the Plantians found him. Goku was thought to be at 60.000, while he was actually at 90.000, and he was believed to be a mutant by Ginyu, and a Super Saiyan by Vegeta (who was at almost 30.000), and he had surpassed the Saiyan limits. If Goku could get from 90.000 to 3.000.000 after one near-death power-up, then Bardock should be able to get from ~10.000 to at least 60.000 after one near-death power-up.

[Doctor.]

What are you talking about? Neither Bardock nor Goku have anything to do with Gohan's dormant powers. It is repeatedly stated that Gohan is special because he is a Saiyan/Earthling Halfling. Trunks is slightly stronger than Goten because he is older than him.

Yes, I'm aware of that. What I asked was whether or not you believe Gohan would have gotten as strong if instead of being Goku's son, he were Nappa's (but still remaining a Saiyan/human hybrid)? Age doesn't affect a character's power, Pan was stronger than Gohan when they were both the same age, the same with Goten and Gohan. Trunks was stronger because he was Vegeta's son, that's it. Goten would be stronger if Goku's family had the potential like Vegeta's family does.

Bardock was at almost 10.000 in th TV Special, and he should have a near-death power-up after his fight with Freeza, since he was nearly dead when the Plantians found him. Goku was thought to be at 60.000, while he was actually at 90.000, and he was believed to be a mutant by Ginyu, and a Super Saiyan by Vegeta (who was at almost 30.000), and he had surpassed the Saiyan limits. If Goku could get from 90.000 to 3.000.000 after one near-death power-up, then Bardock should be able to get from ~10.000 to at least 60.000 after one near-death power-up.

That's what you assume and the story never bothers to address. The problem here is that the story never mentions Bardock's power increases, many fans make theories but the story doesn't bother. As such, this affects Bardock's character too.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Yes, I'm aware of that. What I asked was whether or not you believe Gohan would have gotten as strong if instead of being Goku's son, he were Nappa's (but still remaining a Saiyan/human hybrid)?

If he had followed the same training sure, why not? He might have been even stronger, since Nappa was an elite.

Age doesn't affect a character's power, Pan was stronger than Gohan when they were both the same age, the same with Goten and Gohan. Trunks was stronger because he was Vegeta's son, that's it. Goten would be stronger if Goku's family had the potential like Vegeta's family does.

Goten & Trunks had done the same training, and Trunks states that he was a little stronger only because he is older & knows how to fly. Do you have any proof that Trunks is stronger because he is Vegeta's son?

Goten is stronger than Gohan was at his age because he is more special than Gohan, as a tail-less Saiyan Halfling. Same for Trunks. As for Pan, we have no idea how strong she is in the end of the manga.

[Doctor.]

He might have been even stronger, since Nappa was an elite.

Ah-ha! There you go, there's where I was headed.

Now add SS Bardock into the equation. If Nappa's hybrid could have been stronger than Gohan because Nappa himself was an elite, then wouldn't Goku logically be stronger than any other Saiyan because his father was the legendary SS all along? Does it not, in fact, make Goku's achievements less impressive? If Goten achieved the same things as Goku, would you say it's ONLY because of hard-work, or mostly because his father is so powerful?

Goten & Trunks had done the same training, and Trunks states that he was a little stronger only because he is older & knows how to fly. Do you have any proof that Trunks is stronger because he is Vegeta's son?

Goten is stronger than Gohan was at his age because he is more special than Gohan, as a tail-less Saiyan Halfling. Same for Trunks. As for Pan, we have no idea how strong she is in the end of the manga.

Vegeta says it himself, really.

If it's all age-based, then when they're both in their 20s, do you think Trunks would be weaker? I think he'd still be stronger. Vegeta is older than Goku but he's always weaker.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Ah-ha! There you go, there's where I was headed.

Now add SS Bardock into the equation. If Nappa's hybrid could have been stronger than Gohan because Nappa himself was an elite, then wouldn't Goku logically be stronger than any other Saiyan because his father was the legendary SS all along? Does it not, in fact, make Goku's achievements less impressive? If Goten achieved the same things as Goku, would you say it's ONLY because of hard-work, or mostly because his father is so powerful?

Nappa was born an elite though, Bardock wasn't born a Super Saiyan. Even if you believe that the parent's current strength is related to the child, Bardock was weaker than 10.000 when Goku was born.

Vegeta says it himself, really.

Where?

If it's all age-based, then when they're both in their 20s, do you think Trunks would be weaker? I think he'd still be stronger. Vegeta is older than Goku but he's always weaker.

It matters when we are talking about young children who did the exact same training.

[Doctor.]

Nappa was born an elite though, Bardock wasn't born a Super Saiyan. Even if you believe that the parent's current strength is related to the child, Bardock was weaker than 10.000 when Goku was born.

You don't know if Nappa was born an elite, he could have achieved that status through hard-work, it's never really explained much. Bardock was born as trash yes, his parents were probably weak, he wasn't born a Super Saiyan but he was born with the potential to achieve it, kinda like Goku Jr. Goku Jr was nothing special, yet he still achieved Super Saiyan because he had the huge potential to do so. Likewise, somehow, Bardock also had that potential even though he was born as trash, and him having that potential makes Goku inherit it.

Where?

It matters when we are talking about young children who did the exact same training.

When Trunks beats Goten, It was more of a friendly boast though.

Like Kuririn and Goku...? Goku was younger yet was stronger because of his blood. How is Trunks any different?

[DBZGTKOSDH]

You don't know if Nappa was born an elite, he could have achieved that status through hard-work, it's never really explained much.

Given how Nappa treats Goku, I find it extremely unlikely that Nappa was born a low-class.

Bardock was born as trash yes, his parents were probably weak, he wasn't born a Super Saiyan but he was born with the potential to achieve it, kinda like Goku Jr. Goku Jr's special were nothing special, yet he still achieved Super Saiyan because he had the huge potential to do so. Likewise, somehow, Bardock also had that potential, and Goku inherits it.

What? Who says that you need to inherit the ability to become a Super Saiyan? Anyone can become a Super Saiyan if they can meet the conditions, guys like Goten, Trunks, or Goku Jr. can just do it far more easily because they are freaks of nature.

When Trunks beats Goten, It was more of a friendly boast though.

Quote?

Like Kuririn and Goku...? Goku was younger yet was stronger because of his blood. How is Trunks any different?

Goku was a Saiyan & Kuririn was an Earthling. Goten & Trunks were both tail-less Saiyan Halflings.

[Doctor.]

What? Who says that you need to inherit the ability to become a Super Saiyan? Anyone can become a Super Saiyan if they can meet the conditions, guys like Goten, Trunks, or Goku Jr. can just do it far more easily because they are freaks of nature.

And the conditions are:

1) Surpass the limitations of a normal Saiyan
2) Have a tranquil heart awakened by rage.

Bardock and Goku Jr never met 1), every other Saiyan who transformed met the two other requirements, however. See where the problem arises? If Bardock and Goku Jr CAN transform when they're in the same position as ANY other Saiyan, then they're special. Fans already acknowledge Goku Jr as special because of his heritage, but somehow the same can't be done with Bardock. And again, if Bardock is special, then so is Goku.

Quote?

Goku was a Saiyan & Kuririn was an Earthling. Goten & Trunks were both tail-less Saiyan Halflings.

Apologies for the fan-translation, but here.

That's why I said Goku was stronger because of his blood. Likewise, Vegeta was stronger than Goku because he was the son of King Vegeta while Goku was the son of trash (if we ignore EoB of course, if we take it into account, then Goku was weaker because he hadn't fulfilled his potential yet).

[DBZGTKOSDH]

And the conditions are:

1) Surpass the limitations of a normal Saiyan
2) Have a tranquil heart awakened by rage.

Bardock and Goku Jr never met 1), every other Saiyan who transformed met the two other requirements, however. See where the problem arises? If Bardock and Goku Jr CAN transform when they're in the same position as ANY other Saiyan, then they're special. Fans already acknowledge Goku Jr as special because of his heritage, but somehow the same can't be done with Bardock. And again, if Bardock is special, then so is Goku.

You don't know that. Like I said before, there is plenty of room for Bardock to have surpassed the Saiyan limits, since it is stated in EoB that he was found nearly dead, meaning that he should have gotten a near-death power-up. The fact that he transformed into a Super Saiyan indicates that Bardock should have surpassed the Saiyan limits.

Apologies for the fan-translation, but here.

I would find Trunks' statement more reliable than Vegeta being Vegeta.

[Doctor.]

You don't know that. Like I said before, there is plenty of room for Bardock to have surpassed the Saiyan limits, since it is stated in EoB that he was found nearly dead, meaning that he should have gotten a near-death power-up. The fact that he transformed into a Super Saiyan indicates that Bardock should have surpassed the Saiyan limits.

And this goes back to what I said before: the problem is in the story. The story doesn't bother to address this, it never states Bardock's power increases. Which leads people to assume it did, obviously, but it was never stated in the story. If it's never stated then the most logical assumption is that nothing has changed, and that devalues Bardock's character (and the transformation) when he achieves SS.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

You don't know that. Like I said before, there is plenty of room for Bardock to have surpassed the Saiyan limits, since it is stated in EoB that he was found nearly dead, meaning that he should have gotten a near-death power-up. The fact that he transformed into a Super Saiyan indicates that Bardock should have surpassed the Saiyan limits.

And this goes back to what I said before: the problem is in the story. The story doesn't bother to address this, it never states Bardock's power increases. Which leads people to assume it did, obviously, but it was never stated in the story. If it's never stated then the most logical assumption is that nothing has changed, and that devalues Bardock's character (and the transformation) when he achieves SS.

That's an entirely different case. We are told that Bardock was healed after he was nearly dead, and then we see Bardock becoming a Super Saiyan. This would mean that Bardock got a huge enough increase to make him strong enough to be a Super Saiyan. We don't have to assume that Bardock was a freak of nature because we are not told directly that he met the conditions when there is plenty of room for him to meet them. I mean, we weren't told directly that Vegeta & Gohan met the conditions either, should we assume that they are freaks of nature as well? It's basic knowledge that Saiyans get stronger after recovering from near death, and that you need to reach a certain level to become a Super Saiyan.

[Doctor.]

Vegeta and Gohan met the requirements. Goku was said to have surpassed the limits of a Saiyan at 90,000; both Vegeta and Gohan were logically above that when they transformed, you can't even assume they were, on-screen portrayal of their strength pretty much confirms it directly (with Vegeta saying he too surpassed the limits plenty of time, and then Gohan surpassing that same Vegeta by managing to damage Freeza a bit). If a story is badly written, then the characters suffer too because of the writing. This is a case where the transformation is bad and the character's worth is lowered because the story is badly written (not bad just because of the power thing, but plenty of other aspects as well).

Also, if I recall correctly, it was just stated that they found Bardock unconscious, not nearly dead.

[Luso Saiyan]

1. Yes, and what's the difference? No Saiyan ever transformed into Super Saiyan in their lifetime before so what makes Bardock so different? If Bardock CAN transform being in the same realm of power as the other Saiyans, when Goku, Vegeta, etc, had all to become dozens of times stronger than the average Saiyan to transform, then Bardock has a huge potential and, as such, Goku inherited it too. Bardock IS special if he can transform with such a low level of power. If EoB made the effort to increase Bardock's power a lot, then you'd have more of a point.

If Bardock was a Saiyan like the rest who never transformed, then so is Goku.
If Bardock was a Saiyan like the rest who did transform, then he had the potential to transform all along, which then Goku inherits.

2. The requirements are "surpassing Saiyan's limitations" and "having a tranquil heart awakened by rage". Now let's walk this over through steps.

1. Bardock's crew dies, he doesn't transform.
2. Bardock's planet is being destroyed, he doesn't transform.
3. Episode of Bardock begins, no mention of Bardock's power increasing a lot to "surpass Saiyan limitations" has been made
4. He transforms

Why did he transform in Episode of Bardock? How did he fill the requirements? He COULD have filled the requirements, but did the story do a good job of portraying that? No, it didn't. You can ASSUME he became stronger, but the story (episode of Bardock) never made the effort to explain that he did, in fact, get stronger, it never made the effort to portray the SS transformation as this unfathomable ad unatainable legend even in dire situations like it did with Goku. It was a stupid transformation with no reasonable explanation.

3. It's not "who knows", that's damage control; it's poor storytelling, the story had the obligation to explain it properly, it had the obligation to make it sound reasonable and credible, and it had the obligation of not ruining Goku and Bardock's character and legacy. It did none of those things correctly.

4. He doesn't die, how can it remain tragic? He goes back into the past for some reason and is the sole creator of a thousand year legend. His story may be tragic because his friends died, but he didn't die himself, so how is it a "tragic death"?

5. The problems are, like I explained earlier, the story never makes an effort to say Bardock's power increased. It never explains why Bardock couldn't transform before, but he can now. It never makes an effort of portraying the SS transformation as something legendary and unobtainable, it never makes an effort to explain why Bardock is so different from EVERYONE ELSE.

You can pull and stretch, and find your OWN explanations to why he transformed, you can ASSUME that his power increased, but the story itself doesn't bother; that's the problem.

6. What's his reason? Anger? What made it so different now than when his friends were killed or when Freeza blew up the planet? As I've been saying a thousand times over, the story does not make a good job of making his transformation seem reasonable, it makes a good job of making it seem stupid and pointless, however.

7. "We don't know" sums it all up. That's the story's fault. Assumptions and fan theories are not supposed to cover up holes a story leaves behind. As such, the poor storytelling damages the character as well.

8. Why did he transform in Episode of Bardock? How did he fill the requirements? He COULD have filled the requirements, but did the story do a good job of portraying that? No, it didn't. You can ASSUME he became stronger, but the story (episode of Bardock) never made the effort to explain that he did, in fact, get stronger, it never made the effort to portray the SS transformation as this unfathomable ad unatainable legend even in dire situations like it did with Goku. It was a stupid transformation with no reasonable explanation.

9. No, Goku has always been special if we take EoB into account because Goku inherited Bardock's potential to become strong, just like Gohan and Goten inherited Goku's potential, and Trunks inherited Vegeta's, who inherited King Vegeta's and so on and so forth.

10. What seems more generic, Bardock being a Saiyan like the rest, or him being the Super Saiyan? I think it's the second option.

11. "In my opinion" is always implied in every post regarding literature, no post regarding literature is objective, it's all subjective and everyone should always have that in their mind. This seemed like you just didn't like someone hating something you like.

1. The difference is that it refutes your argument that his character evolution is expected because of what happened to his father later on.

2. As you've noted, he fullfills the requirements, therefore his transformation is completely valid. It doesn't explain how he was able to surpass a Saiyan's limit, but he did (otherwise the transformation would be impossible). Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

And again, just because he wasn't able to transform in the TV special, doesn't mean he isn't able to transform in the future. You don't know what happened to him before he woke up in the past, therefore there's nothing that makes his transformation contradictory or impossible.

3. It's not "damage control" or "poor storytelling" if that's not the story they wanted to tell. You can pretend that nothing happened, but there's no evidence to support that claim. Nobody knows what happened, but something did happen.

4. We discover later on that he somehow survived, but that doesn't make his last stand any less tragic since the premiss is the same. People can be revived with the dragon balls in this franchise, does that make any instance where a character dies/died not tragic?

5. So, your problem is that you weren't given an explanation, not that there isn't one.

6. The difference is that he wasn't in the same condition that he was in the TV special.

7. It's not the story's fault if you're looking for something else.

8. The story did it's job in portraying some of the requirements. It doesn't explain every detail, but it doesn't need to for the purpose it's meant to serve.

9. Goku's status didn't change wether you count EoB or not. It all happened after he was born.

10. Him being the Super Saiyan is left open to interpretation.

11. You said "add to the fact that Episode of Bardock as a whole was quite literally garbage".

You didn't meant it? Fine, but the expression still has its meaning.