SSJ3 Multiplier

[Perfectionist-Cell]

http://www.kanzentai.com/guide/bp/seg-ssj2.png.

All you need to know.

Ssj 50 x Multiplier

Ssj2 2x Multiplier

Ssj3 4x Multiplier

[theherodjl]

http://www.kanzentai.com/guide/bp/seg-ssj2.png.

All you need to know.

Ssj 50 x Multiplier

Ssj2 2x Multiplier

Ssj3 4x Multiplier

I'm sorry, but this is hardly a constructive argument, simply putting the 'official' multipliers back out doesn't make them any more true.
This discussion is more about examining whether these multipliers actually are these numbers when the original manga doesn't make it clear what they are.

[singsing]

I think SS3 is just a way of bringing more of one Saiyan's hidden power that doesn't show up in normal circunstances. So, if he doesn't have too much power to bring on, the added power won't be so significant as multiplying battle power by 2 or 4 on top of SS2. In Goku's case I could accept that (SS2'BP x 4) formula, but regarding SS3 Gotenks I think a different formula (SS'BP x 2) doesn't contradict anything in the story. SS and SS2, though, might work the same way to all the Saiyans, at least between Vegeta and Goku, with minor differences.

I really don't like the multiplier concept but it's clear DBZ has them to clarify that characters do get stronger as stated in the guidebooks, I just don't know how accurate the given multipliers are.

I could see SSJ being stretched to be more like x40 base just because Goku and Freeza were more or less even when Goku used a Kaio-ken x20 while Freeza was at 50% and the result between SSJ vs 100% was even as well, initially anyways before Freeza started losing power.
It would also make more sense that the multipliers shrink as the forms get greater, gradually decreasing which is why I think SSJ3 shouldn't be above SSJ2 as a multiplier just equal at the very least.

Not really, in the anime they might have looked even, but in the manga Goku was trashing Freeza the entire time, no problem.

[dbgtFO]

Freeza is an outlier, his advanced physiology likely prevented him from being reduced to dust, and to a non-canonical extent Cooler was able to survive being placed on the sun's surface for a time despite Broly getting utterly incinerated by it.

Cooler was only on the sun's surface, while Broly could have been inside by the time he died, as the remains of the blast went all the way out to the other side of the sun.
Given that it's much hotter on the inside, than on the surface, these two examples don't really make it clear, that Cooler's durability is better than Broly's despite lower power.

[theherodjl]

I think SS3 is just a way of bringing more of one Saiyan's hidden power that doesn't show up in normal circunstances. So, if he doesn't have too much power to bring on, the added power won't be so significant as multiplying battle power by 2 or 4 on top of SS2. In Goku's case I could accept that (SS2'BP x 4) formula, but regarding SS3 Gotenks I think a different formula (SS'BP x 2) doesn't contradict anything in the story. SS and SS2, though, might work the same way to all the Saiyans, at least between Vegeta and Goku, with minor differences.

I really don't like the multiplier concept but it's clear DBZ has them to clarify that characters do get stronger as stated in the guidebooks, I just don't know how accurate the given multipliers are.

I could see SSJ being stretched to be more like x40 base just because Goku and Freeza were more or less even when Goku used a Kaio-ken x20 while Freeza was at 50% and the result between SSJ vs 100% was even as well, initially anyways before Freeza started losing power.
It would also make more sense that the multipliers shrink as the forms get greater, gradually decreasing which is why I think SSJ3 shouldn't be above SSJ2 as a multiplier just equal at the very least.

Not really, in the anime they might have looked even, but in the manga Goku was trashing Freeza the entire time, no problem.

In the manga they were even at first, the only reason why it appeared Goku was stronger was just because he took a punch from Freeza and shrugged it off saying "I hope that's not all you have". Goku has been taking hits all his life and it has become a part of his fighting style to catch a beating and then come back from it much like Rocky Balboa, he's accustomed to taking hits especially if it's just one hit but otherwise he's not immune to damage or that much stronger to have an advantage.

[theherodjl]

Freeza is an outlier, his advanced physiology likely prevented him from being reduced to dust, and to a non-canonical extent Cooler was able to survive being placed on the sun's surface for a time despite Broly getting utterly incinerated by it.

Cooler was only on the sun's surface, while Broly could have been inside by the time he died, as the remains of the blast went all the way out to the other side of the sun.
Given that it's much hotter on the inside, than on the surface, these two examples don't really make it clear, that Cooler's durability is better than Broly's despite lower power.

The family kamehameha sent Broly heading towards the sun and then it just blows up on the surface, it didn't go out the otherside. Cooler on the other hand could have been pushed into it because the kamehameha appears to stop and rest on the sun leaving him to reflect for several seconds that he let Goku live as a baby. Cooler's feat was greater however like I said, the natural physiology of both Freeza & Cooler appears to be greater than any other species to the point where they survive better.

[h0kuten]

The only things that come to mind are Gohan's performance against Perfect Cell as a MSsj and Ssj2, and Cell powering up like Gohan did. The other thing that comes to mind is the distinction made between Gohan's Ssj2 in the Buu Saga and his enraged power, which is probably his enraged boost. Furthermore, when Gotenks fought Super Buu in the RoSaT his Ssj transformation didn't seem to hinder a 50x power increase, it seemed to be more along the lines of 2-4x. His special abilities are what made the apparent difference, not necessarily the Ssj transformation itself.

So when these two things are laid out I guess it looks something like this:

The Cell Games

Kid Gohan
~Base 120,000,000
~Ssj 6,000,000,000
~Ssj2 12,000,000,000
~Enraged 24,000,000,000

Goku
~Base 80,000,000
~Ssj 4,000,000,000

Perfect Cell
~Silent Power Up 2,200,000,000
~Powered Up 4,400,000,000
~Real Speed 4,800,000,000
~Full Speed 6,600,000,000
~Full Power 9,000,000,000

Super Perfect Cell
~Full Power 18,000,000,000

[dragonballer]

Freeza is an outlier, his advanced physiology likely prevented him from being reduced to dust, and to a non-canonical extent Cooler was able to survive being placed on the sun's surface for a time despite Broly getting utterly incinerated by it.

Cooler was only on the sun's surface, while Broly could have been inside by the time he died, as the remains of the blast went all the way out to the other side of the sun.
Given that it's much hotter on the inside, than on the surface, these two examples don't really make it clear, that Cooler's durability is better than Broly's despite lower power.

The family kamehameha sent Broly heading towards the sun and then it just blows up on the surface, it didn't go out the otherside. Cooler on the other hand could have been pushed into it because the kamehameha appears to stop and rest on the sun leaving him to reflect for several seconds that he let Goku live as a baby. Cooler's feat was greater however like I said, the natural physiology of both Freeza & Cooler appears to be greater than any other species to the point where they survive better.

the natural physiology of freeza can keep him alive even when he is in pieces .

but we don't know what really killed Broly,the kamehameha made a hole in his chest before he was sent to to the sun.