New Animation VS Old Animation

[Metalwario64]

Honestly, I'd have liked to have seen that shot of Goku being hit by Beerus looking more like this shot from Seigasha:



That's always been one of my favorite expressions of pain the the entire series. Especially in motion with the screen zooming in and out quickly.

[Lord Beerus]

That's really damn good work, Metalwario64.

[Doctor.]

I'm curious about what you guys thought about this cut. I thought it was one of the nicest of the episode, along with the Kamehameha right after.

[Lord Beerus]

I'm curious about what you guys thought about this cut. I thought it was one of the nicest of the episode, along with the Kamehameha right after.

That cut actually looks quite good and certainly does have a good flow about it. I've watched this episode again, mostly due the subs being garbage first time round, and honestly, while the art and animation as a whole in EP 5 was pretty bad there were certainly some good cuts, mostly after Goku becomes a SSJ3. I think the worst stretch of animation and art in that episode was when SSJ Goku fought Beerus.

[Sayo-chan]

Are Beerus's eyes flickering because of the gif or is that in the scene? Aside from Goku looking like plastic, and the aura looking ugly, the animation has a nice flow to it.

[Doctor.]

Are Beerus's eyes flickering because of the gif or is that in the scene? Aside from Goku looking like plastic, and the aura looking ugly, the animation has a nice flow to it.

It's the gif, it's sped up for some reason, it was the only one I found of that scene. In th episode, he has his eyes opened then slowly closes them.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

I'm curious about what you guys thought about this cut. I thought it was one of the nicest of the episode, along with the Kamehameha right after.

That cut actually looks quite good and certainly does have a good flow about it. I've watched this episode again, mostly due the subs being garbage first time round, and honestly, while the art and animation as a whole in EP 5 was pretty bad there were certainly some good cuts, mostly after Goku becomes a SSJ3. I think the worst stretch of animation and art in that episode was when SSJ Goku fought Beerus.

I am not sure if they animate scenes in order but the fact that the SS Goku fight with Beerus looked so bad compared to SS3 leads me to believe that it was one of the last things needed to be done but they needed to rush the episode out to air hence why it looked so bad, also the fact we had some nice cuts and shots scattered through the episode shows if they maybe had an extra week it wouldn't have been so bad, I kind of get the feeling that Toei sort of misjudged how long they had on the episode.

[Noah]

Honestly, I'd have liked to have seen that shot of Goku being hit by Beerus looking more like this shot from Seigasha:

Spoiler:

That's always been one of my favorite expressions of pain the the entire series. Especially in motion with the screen zooming in and out quickly.

Also, I took another stab at the SS3 Goku shot, and I shrunk his mouth and altered his eyes in an attempt to capture the above Z shot. I also manually added line weight, and I added a gradient light source commonly seen in modern anime:

Spoiler:

I'll try not to keep doing this. I'm just trying to improve myself.

Amazing dude, that was exactly my thoughs when I did the comparison with Gohan eyes after being punched in DBZ ep 182

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

Quick, somebody hire Ryoo-Chimo as the character designer so we can get designs better than any previous look!

You...mean to tell me that Ryoo-Chimo took over Yamamuro's position to be Dragon Ball Super's character designer?

[Sayo-chan]

Quick, somebody hire Ryoo-Chimo as the character designer so we can get designs better than any previous look!

You...mean to tell me that Ryoo-Chimo took over Yamamuro's position to be Dragon Ball Super's character designer?

No. Yami boy is still there. He was saying somebody should hire him so we'll get better designs. Just about anything's better than what we have now.

[JulieYBM]

Quick, somebody hire Ryoo-Chimo as the character designer so we can get designs better than any previous look!

You...mean to tell me that Ryoo-Chimo took over Yamamuro's position to be Dragon Ball Super's character designer?

No, no, that would never happen, I was just making a joke about how people keep wanting to go back to an older character designer. The joke being, of course, that Chimo designs would look nothing like any of the previous character designers.

[Sayo-chan]

I can just hear Goku saying: "why me no hit you!?"

[LonelyShadow]

Spoiler:

Incredible work, if I didn't see that draw on this site first and somebody told that it's a screenshot from the show I would believe him with no doubt.

[Metalwario64]

I made one final attempt at that image, because my sloppy line work was really bothering me. I used the pen tool this time, so everything is steadier and smoother now.

I also went for a more realist approach by using Super's palette.



It's also in 1080p, so if you right click "view image", you can see it in the full resolution. I think if Toei does correct it (which I believe they will, but why waste the money to basically reanimate an episode when you wouldn't have to if you had better management?) it would look more like this.

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

So, I've made some observation on Super Saiya-Jin Goku versus Beerus in Dragon Ball Super #5, where Ken Ôtsuka presumably key animated the scene. He probably did the cut of Goku's Kamehame-Ha. I noticed that his art style is similar to chief animation supervisor Ide Takeo that kinda calls back from his olden days of Dragon Ball Z. I have to wonder if he influenced Ôtsuka. This is probably good news for you guys who prefer the old style from back then, even if it's for a brief time.

By the way, they still occasionally draw a line under nose. There's some in Episode #5.

[DarkPrince_92]

I made one final attempt at that image, because my sloppy line work was really bothering me. I used the pen tool this time, so everything is steadier and smoother now.

I also went for a more realist approach by using Super's palette.

Spoiler:

It's also in 1080p, so if you right click "view image", you can see it in the full resolution. I think if Toei does correct it (which I believe they will, but why waste the money to basically reanimate an episode when you wouldn't have to if you had better management?) it would look more like this.

Seeing that makes me miss the old color palette. Wish they kept it.

[Lord Beerus]

Here's something that may interest you guys. A French article about the production of DB Super. Here's the info I got from the article via google translate. I've interpreted a some of the information in the article a bit differently only because the translation wasn't the best. The stuff in bold is info I consider very enlightening:

- There are 7 animation teams working on Dragon Ball Super. In comparison, Studio Pierrot has 11 animation teams working on Naruto.
- Naoki Tate's role in the episode 5 Super Dragon Ball was not to animate or draw scenes but to correct the drawings of other animators.
- Tôei Animation studio is known for having very few animators to work on an episode. In the 80s and 90s, they employed 4 or 5 more rarely. Usually these days, they do not exceed 10 animators unlike other studios.
- Episode 3 of Super Dragon Ball was animated by a single person, as was Episode 24 of Go! Princess Precure. In comparison, Episode 27 Go! Precure Princess had only three key animators. Which is still not a lot.
- Episode 5 of Super had over 18 key animators. With this many key animators, this means there was clearly a very tight schedule and the budget was a non factor. There was good animators in this episode, though. Examples include the Kamehameha that was launched by Goku Super Saiyan 3 which was drawn by Ken Ôtsuka.
- Because of lack of time and tight schedule, Naoki Tate had to make a choice of whether he should give priority to second half of the episode where there is more action, specifically where Goku was a Super Saiyan 3, and then abandon plans where Goku was in different scenes and not in action. The second half of the episode had almost no reproach unlike the first half. Naoki Tate had done just that 3/4 of his job for that episode, and he ultimate chose the easy way out, and provided more animators to scenes where there is less action to correct the most possible scenes.
- The animation in the strict sense, where the images were moving, was not so bad. What was ugly, however, was the lack of uniformity during the fighting scenes and in the background.
- It is also important to note, that the animation director must wait until the animators finish the drawing, as the animation director is the person who works last.
- The pace of production has changed since the day that Toei animation painted cels, as with the arrival of colorization using computers, delays in the process of animation were reduced.
- Many people like the anime producers, directors or designers and production assistants are paid during the manufacturing process, planning is very punctuated to limit the overall cost of production. However, the majority of employees in the animation are freelance, as he cost to internalize facilitators and animators would be too unbearable. The only studio that could afford to do such a thing is Studio Ghibli. But the problem is not the fact that the studios are stingy. Japanese animation studios are small companies which still struggling with the budget allocated by customers. They do not have rights. In general, they do not make big profits and are not in a position to invest their own profits in an original license.
- Japanese animation in budgets are extremely low. In the 60s, to be successful producing weekly episodes was seen a crazy idea but a necessary one. Osamu Tezuka asked the animators to make many sacrifices: work very hard to pay a pittance. The standard period is always the same 50 years later.
- On a series of television production, a animator is usually paid around ¥5,000 to animate a cut (from the layout to the animated key).
- The people responsible for in-between animation are paid around ¥250 per drawing. To live survive by this standard wage, the animation leaders must work fast and can not afford to work exclusively on a single animated cut. Many animators are therefore freelancers working for several studios simultaneously.
- The problem is still the same today, as Japan's animation industry produces too many projects at a rate of an indecent speed. There are not enough talented and experienced animators to oversee production and train new young animators. The studios have no alternative but to work with animators from a low level, sometimes even amateurs who do it as a hobby. They also have no choice but to outsource certain functions in other countries, not only to contain costs but also to deliver the episode in time. In this industry, everybody is all the time is extremely busy, but also especially talented. But even the most mediocre animators, however, are solicited to regular intervals.
- It is fairly common that nobody starts work on an episode until the very last moment because they are already struggling on their deadline on another production. In this situation, it is quite common to hear about "miracle" when an episode airing in time. Sometimes the animation for an episode can begin only two weeks before the broadcast and the episode is finalized a mere few hours before before it has to air TV. The quality may be rotten, but what counts most is to have something on the screen.

[shinmaru]

I made one final attempt at that image, because my sloppy line work was really bothering me. I used the pen tool this time, so everything is steadier and smoother now.

I also went for a more realist approach by using Super's palette.

Spoiler:

It's also in 1080p, so if you right click "view image", you can see it in the full resolution. I think if Toei does correct it (which I believe they will, but why waste the money to basically reanimate an episode when you wouldn't have to if you had better management?) it would look more like this.

You should try to reanimate the ssj1 and 2 fights with your skills

[JulieYBM]

Animation is more than just drawing over other people's work, it's about movement and the timing of that movement, something you need an actual skill to understand.

[ParkerAL]

Here's something that may interest you guys. A French article about the production of DB Super. Here's the info I got from the article via google translate. I've interpreted a some of the information in the article a bit differently only because the translation wasn't the best. The stuff in bold is info I consider very enlightening:

A lot of the article reads like it could be true, but what source did the website receive all this inside information from? It's very dubious to make all these claims without backing them up with some kind of citation. That's journalism 101.