What phrases/opinions/things bring out your irate fanboy?

[nickzambuto]

It's the blatant superiority of certain fans that comes off as patronizing, they don't even give the dub actors a chance, they're just used to the Japanese cast and laugh at the dub cast because it's something different.

I would argue that here at Kanzenshuu the opposite is true. I grew up with the dub and later grew to prefer the original. If I were a gambling man, I would assume that it would be the same for most Kanzenshuu members who prefer the original.

I too, have seen the virtue of the Japanese cast and script since coming to Kanzenshuu. But too many people just dismiss the dub as a joke. Can't people understand that others LIKE the dub and the dub actually does a pretty good job?

[Lunatic Fringe]

they don't even give the dub actors a chance, they're just used to the Japanese cast and laugh at the dub cast because it's something different.

That sounds rather ignorant. What if they HAVE given the dub actors a chance and still think they're bad? What then?

I don't think that's in anyway ignorant since he's not speaking on behalf of all sub fans who like the original more, just ones that dismiss any other interpretation as bad without truly letting the performance be analyzed on its own merits. It's the same thing when FUNi fans immediately dismiss Nozawa's Goku after only hearing a few lines and deciding she sucks because she's a woman that "screeches" too much and is too high pitched.

[Doctor.]

Can't people understand that others LIKE the dub and the dub actually does a pretty good job?

People can understand that others like the dub. It has been a long while before I saw someone (here at least) saying "The dub is shit and you should feel bad for liking it because you have shit taste" (obviously an hyperbole, but you get the idea, something along those lines). People usually just stick with "the dub is shit". Understanding that "the dub actually does a pretty good job" isn't something you can force onto people, though. That has nothing to do with respecting people, it's a fully 100% opinionated subject, just like you think the dub does a pretty good job, I think the dub does a pretty terrible job. It's not a fact that the dub does a pretty good job and, as such, people won't and shouldn't be forced to understand that.

[VegettoEX]

When we have entire threads of people just talking about how bad they think the dub actors are

May I point you to the exact opposite where we have entire threads of people talking about exactly how bad they think Masako Nozawa is, and how Joji Yanami should just hurry up and die so he can be recast?

Cherry-picking / selectively choosing based on what you want to be reality may be going on here, whether you are intentionally doing so or not. Please be aware, please understand. Disgusting things are said on all "sides". They shouldn't be, and we'll do everything in our power to take care of it when reported to us... but also recognize people have different opinions and they're entitled to express them, regardless of whether you like it or not.

Of course, that's the whole "brings out your irate fanboy" question at hand... (Can you see mine shining through?)

[Big Green The Yoshi]

I'm not really a fanboy anymore (I'm still an all time fan), but I hate when Dubtards or Anime Fans use the Dragon Ball Wiki as a source.

[voltlunok]

Been a while since I posted here but I think I hit gold on one recently. Canon debates/dismissals. They just...get my jimmies all rustled cause really why should we care? The series doesn't, Toei doesn't, Toriyama doesn't. So why should we? Sure it can be fun and cool to try and put the puzzle together, connect the dots and all that and having your own little head canon is cool too, but when people use "That's not canon!" as a way to dismiss or invalidate someone's argument or enjoyment of something, it just gets me freaking pissed! Who are you to decide what is and isn't canon eh?! Really that's my two cents on the topic of canon.

Also any deragotory term towards other fans that involves the word 'tard' cause seriously? That's not cool. Dubtards, Brolytards, Weebtards, any of them. It's all stupid and just continues to dig the rabbit hole of using words that are offensive and harmful to others as catch-all insults and jabs at people. It's disgusting...

Of course, that's the whole "brings out your irate fanboy" question at hand... (Can you see mine shining through?)

Yes but does it glow with an awesome power?

[ABED]

Since established/official canon is what is officially determined to be canon, and there has been no word on that, that's an easy conclusion

There is an official canon - it's called the manga. You don't need to be told that. Why do you need to be told that the original source material is canon?

Toriyama could easily define at least part of the manga as non-canon (and he could do this regarding any part of the manga he feels like). This alone proves the difference between your expectations for what would be canon and what in fact could be defined as canon, but you continue to not see the difference and you actually argue that our assumption regarding canon is the same as actual canon (aka whatever is officially defined to be canon).

That in no way proves there is no canon. It would simply mean a redifinition of what constitutes DB canon. What you don't grasp is the ridiculousness of what that means to say "there is no canon". That literally means there is no continuity. The events in the story didn't happen in the story unless someone said they did. How do I know Bulma and Goku meeting after Goku went fishing is canon? Because it happened in the story. I'm not arguing an assumption, i'm arguing truth. Canon arguments only come up in issues where there are things like adaptations or continuations by a different author, etc. If there were no movies or anime, this wouldn't even be an issue, except maybe in the case of the alternate ending, but that new ending is not a big change and it doesn't throw out 10 or so years of continuity.

[VegettoEX]

There is an official canon - it's called the manga. You don't need to be told that.

Insert here: my long-winded explanation filled with countless examples of rewrites in the manga (Gohan's age being changed, the new kanzenban ending), then how the kanzenban was mostly phased out for re-releasing the tankobon as the "established" in-print version, the extra information inserted into Jaco which in turn references new movies which in turn have now been re-told in Super...

You can't just say "the manga is the canon" because that's a meaningless statement in 2015.

[voltlunok]

Since established/official canon is what is officially determined to be canon, and there has been no word on that, that's an easy conclusion

There is an official canon - it's called the manga. You don't need to be told that.

Where? Show us where this is stated? Show us a direct quote from Toei, Shueisha, and Toriyama where they declare this official canon? Source it please. Until then, no there is no official or declared canon. You may consider the original manga as the canon, that's fine. But there is no officially declared or established canon by anyone who has the power to do so.

[Big Green The Yoshi]

Since established/official canon is what is officially determined to be canon, and there has been no word on that, that's an easy conclusion

There is an official canon - it's called the manga. You don't need to be told that.

Where? Show us where this is stated? Show us a direct quote from Toei, Shueisha, and Toriyama where they declare this official canon? Source it please. Until then, no there is no official or declared canon. You may consider the original manga as the canon, that's fine. But there is no officially declared or established canon.

So you consider Special Of Bardock canon then?

[ABED]

There is an official canon - it's called the manga. You don't need to be told that.

Insert here: my long-winded explanation filled with countless examples of rewrites in the manga (Gohan's age being changed, the new kanzenban ending), then how the kanzenban was mostly phased out for re-releasing the tankobon as the "established" in-print version, the extra information inserted into Jaco which in turn references new movies which in turn have now been re-told in Super...

You can't just say "the manga is the canon" because that's a meaningless statement in 2015.

That doesn't mean there is NO canon. 1 - that ending doesn't negate 10 years worth of story and when was Gohan's age changed? That could simply be a continuity error. None of this means there's no canon.

Where? Show us where this is stated? Show us a direct quote from Toei, Shueisha, and Toriyama where they declare this official canon? Source it please. Until then, no there is no official or declared canon. You may consider the original manga as the canon, that's fine. But there is no officially declared or established canon.

Do you need to be told that? Isn't it self evident that the original story is canon to itself? Look up where the term originated and you should get a good idea of what it actually means. You don't need to be explicitly told the original work is canon, it's understood (generally anyway) that the original work is in continuity because it created the continuity to begin with. The issue comes up in cases like Buffy. It started as a movie, then became a TV and then a comic book series. The movie is disregarded from the series, so the series is canon.

[Doctor.]

There is an official canon - it's called the manga. You don't need to be told that.

Insert here: my long-winded explanation filled with countless examples of rewrites in the manga (Gohan's age being changed, the new kanzenban ending), then how the kanzenban was mostly phased out for re-releasing the tankobon as the "established" in-print version, the extra information inserted into Jaco which in turn references new movies which in turn have now been re-told in Super...

You can't just say "the manga is the canon" because that's a meaningless statement in 2015.

That doesn't mean there is NO canon. 1 - that ending doesn't negate 10 years worth of story and when was Gohan's age changed? That could simply be a continuity error. None of this means there's no canon.

Gohan was 3 years old in the original chapter released in Weekly Shounen Jump but that was later changed to 4 in the tankoubon release.

[voltlunok]

So you consider Special Of Bardock canon then?

W-what? Where...huh? Ok so I'm gonna need you to elaborate because that question is so out of left field, especially in concern to my post. It honestly feels antagonistic if anything. And do you mean Episode of Bardock?

[ABED]

Gohan was 3 years old in the original chapter released in Weekly Shounen Jump but that was later changed to 4 in the tankoubon release.

So that trivial change/error negates all continuity? That's akin to a rounding error.

[VegettoEX]

While I'm obviously part of the problem here, let's do our best to not turn every single thread into "BUT MY CANNONS".

[ABED]

Fair enough, but I answered what opinion brings out my inner fanboy, and there are few things that scream "fanboy" more than canon debates.

[LightBing]

Why is there a need for a "official canon"? Dragon Ball is a franchise that incorporates various medias, with more than just an author... I understand wanting to build the World in a logical fashion, but we must treat everything with the same regard. If you prefer Minus instead of Bardock's story so be it. The only necessary element for a canon perspective is a timeline that isn't impossible, with that we can be happy and discuss everyone's canon's, without forcing anyone to accept anything and enjoy the freedom of Dragon Ball.

[ABED]

Why is there a need for a "official canon"? Dragon Ball is a franchise that incorporates various medias, with more than just an author... I understand wanting to build the World in a logical fashion, but we must treat everything with the same regard. If you prefer Minus instead of Bardock's story so be it. The only necessary element for a canon perspective is a timeline that isn't impossible, with that we can be happy and discuss everyone's canon's, without forcing anyone to accept anything and enjoy the freedom of Dragon Ball.

For me, it's more of a curiosity more than anything else. I do like to know what's considered canon versus what isn't. That doesn't mean i don't like things that aren't in continuity. However, for things that aren't, i give them more leeway with those stories. For instance, if a character does something in the movies that is contradictory to whatever canon is, I don't care that much about it. If Gohan has a tail in movie 5, it doesn't bug me since it's not in continuity. No one said you aren't free to enjoy it if it's not the official story.

To take an example from a different series - Smallville. After Green Arrow appeared on Smallville, some department at WB did an animated web series called the "Oliver Queen Chronicles" which explored Oliver's time on the island where he learned archery. 2 years later, the series proper did an episode that contradicts the events of that web series because they don't consider it part of their story. The contradiction doesn't bug me like it would when the show committed continuity errors with its own series.

[Ree]

While it is a very derogatory term, Broly fanboys are some of the most hated of the DB fandom and don't help their cause for people to stop using the term either.
Still dosen't give anyone the right to use it.

[VegettoEX]

Please use the quote option when directly quoting other users; it's very difficult to understand what you're saying and responding to.