Is dragonball ruined now?

[JulieYBM]

The reason the new modern art and animation ruins Dragon Ball is because of how terrible the battle choreography is.

The only way we'll see that type of choreography is either in the movies or if they give Super the same amount of drawings DB&Z had which were 3500 unlike Super which has 2500-3000.

To say nothing of a good animator being allowed to do good work.

Kami to Kami and Fukkatsu no F had a good number of drawings yet thanks to its bad director and bad chief animation supervisor couldn't pull off anything interesting looking outside of Shida Naotoshi's short bit in the former. That's how important good staff can be. Both movies had great animators, yet next to none of them gave the high-level performances they give in other works.

[HybridSaiyan]

Vegeta vs Pui Pui stomps all over it.

You talk about choreography and then you say this, this one is better? How, in any way, shape, or form, is it better? Pui Pui tries to land a flurry of punches while Vegeta dodges. That's 95% of the fight right there, the rest is Vegeta killing Pui Pui, which is admittedly impressive, but nothing that could top Goku vs Beerus' best moments.

Epicness my friend, epicness. There was no epic fighting scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight in Super. Vegeta vs Pui Pui got me excited, plus with the BGM of Bruce the whole battle was gorgeous lol.

[Doctor.]

Epicness my friend, epicness. There was no epic fighting scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight in Super. Vegeta vs Pui Pui got me excited, plus with the BGM of Bruce the whole battle was gorgeous lol.

Nothing? Nothing at all?

Goku crushing Beerus' sphere of Ki?
Goku's Kamehameha destroying a bunch of Beerus' attacks?
Beerus stabbing Goku and then him rising up to the sky once again?

[SylentEcho]

Vegeta vs Pui Pui stomps all over it.

You can't be serious. Vegeta vs. Pui Pui was like almost every other DBZ filler fight. They're doing newer things now. I'd rather watch this than watch the same kind of thing over and over again. It might look a little childish, but both Goku and Beerus are that way, hence most of their fight is that way, too. When they're seriously fighting, it actually looks pretty good. I'd just like to see a few more martial arts styled moves, like a lot more blocking, hard jabs and throws. Apart from that, it's pretty neat.

Epicness my friend, epicness. There was no epic fighting scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight in Super. Vegeta vs Pui Pui got me excited, plus with the BGM of Bruce the whole battle was gorgeous lol.

Are you sure about that? I liked that music when I was 16. The whole Faulconer score seems out of place when I try to watch the show in English, now. Doesn't feel like Dragon Ball.

[HybridSaiyan]

Vegeta vs Pui Pui stomps all over it.

You can't be serious. Vegeta vs. Pui Pui was like almost every other DBZ filler fight. They're doing newer things now. I'd rather watch this than watch the same kind of thing over and over again. It might look a little childish, but both Goku and Beerus are that way, hence most of their fight is that way, too. When they're seriously fighting, it actually looks pretty good. I'd just like to see a few more martial arts styled moves, like a lot more blocking, hard jabs and throws. Apart from that, it's pretty neat.

Epicness my friend, epicness. There was no epic fighting scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight in Super. Vegeta vs Pui Pui got me excited, plus with the BGM of Bruce the whole battle was gorgeous lol.

Are you sure about that? I liked that music when I was 16. The whole Faulconer score seems out of place when I try to watch the show in English, now. Doesn't feel like Dragon Ball.

See, I'm different. I can only watch Dragon Ball with Bruce. The Japanese BGM just doesn't cut it for me. I need Bruce and I need the heavy metal BGM they added in the movies. That's just the way I feel. I love the Japanese openings and all but that's it. The rest goes to the American stuff.

As for the Pui Pui battle, I just loved the humiliation Vegeta gave to him and how he mocked him with the gravity before finishing him off. Don't get me wrong, some scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight were nice but when you compare it to Piccolo vs 17..well..

[HybridSaiyan]

Epicness my friend, epicness. There was no epic fighting scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight in Super. Vegeta vs Pui Pui got me excited, plus with the BGM of Bruce the whole battle was gorgeous lol.

Nothing? Nothing at all?

Goku crushing Beerus' sphere of Ki?
Goku's Kamehameha destroying a bunch of Beerus' attacks?
Beerus stabbing Goku and then him rising up to the sky once again?

I'll admit the Kamehameha destroying Beerus's godly balls were nice.

[Doctor.]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

[HybridSaiyan]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

What about the intense gut blows?

[Soppa Saia People]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

100% agree not to metion the sheer pointless of it.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

100% agree not to metion the sheer pointless of it.

I think it cant be taken out of the series, it's the last time we see piccolo do ANYTHING other then be a babysitter. The animation was perfect, the American track was part of what made it the most intense fight of the series. Plus it was the best fight in Z in terms of punch ratio. Most fights in Z lack hits % wise despite the fact the original ball was 99% hits an 1% energy attacks. It was very refreshing.

[Lord Beerus]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

100% agree not to metion the sheer pointless of it.

I think it cant be taken out of the series, it's the last time we see piccolo do ANYTHING other then be a babysitter. The animation was perfect, the American track was part of what made it the most intense fight of the series. Plus it was the best fight in Z in terms of punch ratio. Most fights in Z lack hits % wise despite the fact the original ball was 99% hits an 1% energy attacks. It was very refreshing.

The Piccolo/#17 fight, along with a large chunk of the Android/Cell arc, has aged poorly. Piccolo/#17 fight is one of the worst fights, in not just the anime, but in the manga, too.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

I think it cant be taken out of the series, it's the last time we see piccolo do ANYTHING other then be a babysitter. The animation was perfect, the American track was part of what made it the most intense fight of the series. Plus it was the best fight in Z in terms of punch ratio. Most fights in Z lack hits % wise despite the fact the original ball was 99% hits an 1% energy attacks. It was very refreshing.[/quote]
The Piccolo/#17 fight, along with a large chunk of the Android/Cell arc, has aged poorly. Piccolo/#17 fight is one of the worst fights, in not just the anime, but in the manga, too.[/quote]


I disagree,I think it only gets better with each viewing. Such fun memories. If I watch it tomorrow, it doesn't matter if on blu ray, or on the original funi DVDS,or even if I pull out and old VHS tape. I can see watch it on dragon box or even the orange bricks! Each and every time, even in Japanese with subtitles off I'll enjoy ever second of it. I don't even speak Japanese and it'll still be fun. But to each their own.

[BlazingFiddlesticks]

I may risk stoking the fire and say that I halfway agree (more on that later). I have not been a fan of the newer animation style, most of the new content we've received has been rather weak, and after Resurrection F does leave me wondering if he has another serious tale left in him; though I expect more Battle of Gods and that's fine by me! It feels like Dragon Ball is (not surprisingly) being expected to sell on its reputation (Kai? Kai), not because it has any new to offer.

Ruined forever? How? Nothing you enjoyed is gone. There are many other things you could say, some of which have already been said, but that's the moral.

[SylentEcho]

Goku crushing Beerus' sphere of Ki?
Goku's Kamehameha destroying a bunch of Beerus' attacks?
Beerus stabbing Goku and then him rising up to the sky once again?

Don't forget Beerus headbutting Goku over and over right out of the Earth's atmosphere. That was totally badass.

See, I'm different. I can only watch Dragon Ball with Bruce. The Japanese BGM just doesn't cut it for me. I need Bruce and I need the heavy metal BGM they added in the movies. That's just the way I feel. I love the Japanese openings and all but that's it. The rest goes to the American stuff.

As for the Pui Pui battle, I just loved the humiliation Vegeta gave to him and how he mocked him with the gravity before finishing him off. Don't get me wrong, some scenes in the Goku vs Beerus fight were nice but when you compare it to Piccolo vs 17..well..

Why are you comparing the two shows? You might enjoy Super a lot more if you think of Z as it's own thing. About the Faulconer thing; I admit the Faulconer score is really catchy and atmospheric, but personally, I don't think it fits into the mood of DBZ one bit, especially with it constantly playing in the background without stopping. I used to love that dub back when I was in college, but now I can't seem to stand the way they got most of the characters personalities wrong, the extra/changed dialogue and the fact that Goku is just not Goku in the dub. I try to watch the English dub now and then, but end up turning it off after an episode or two.

The Piccolo/#17 fight, along with a large chunk of the Android/Cell arc, has aged poorly. Piccolo/#17 fight is one of the worst fights, in not just the anime, but in the manga, too.

Hey, now! I've always thought that it was a pretty good fight. I watched the Kai version of it recently and thought it was still pretty cool. You don't see too many hard hitting fights like that in Anime these days, so I think it's aged nicely.

I know what everyone's cribbing about. The moment Beerus has a power-up that lasts half an episode and transforms into a bulkier, 80s-wrestler-steroid-monster version of himself, everyone will love the show.

[fadeddreams5]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

The novelty of seeing Piccolo go toe to toe with one of the main bad guys, Faulconer's OST, and the tension from the battle makes it awesome to me. Besides, it's still better than all but one fight that has come out of this franchise in the last 10+ years...

[Doctor.]

Piccolo vs 17 is a terrible fight... Its choreography is terrible, it has bad animation and it has no real memorable moments besides Piccolo's explosion attack.

The novelty of seeing Piccolo go toe to toe with one of the main bad guys, Faulconer's OST, and the tension from the battle makes it awesome to me. Besides, it's still better than all but one fight that has come out of this franchise in the last 10+ years...

He already went toe-to-toe with Cell; Faulconer's OST was really sub-par compared to his other works; and the entire fight makes Piccolo look incredibly dumb by fighting 17 and luring in Cell instead of hiding Goku and waiting. It's terrible in all accounts, the choreography was handled by the worst studios in the anime as well.

[fadeddreams5]

He already went toe-to-toe with Cell

The more the merrier. =D

Faulconer's OST was really sub-par compared to his other works

Dat Super Namekian theme that plays during his scatter attack tho.

and the entire fight makes Piccolo look incredibly dumb by fighting 17 and luring in Cell instead of hiding Goku and waiting.

This saga makes everyone look incredibly dumb. It might as well be considered a theme.

[DarkPrince_92]

The best part of Piccolo vs 17 was the exchange they had when they landed on the final island, right before Cell showed up. Think the choreography was just fine. Everything before that was whatever.

[shinmaru]

I'm shocked to see how many people here don't like the Piccolo vs 17 fight.
I personally like that battle very much.

[rereboy]

I'm shocked to see how many people here don't like the Piccolo vs 17 fight.
I personally like that battle very much.

I liked it too.