The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Darkron2151]

Why is Gotenks so underrated? Based on the fact that Goku was so confident in fusion that he left the fate of the Earth and potentially universe, you would expect Gotenks to at least be stronger than Android 16 of all people. And why would Piccolo be so excited about Gotenks forming in the rosat if Gotenks was even weaker than Piccolo?

What do you mean underrated? SSJ Gotenks isn't far off from SSJ3 Goku and has the ability to beat Fat Buu. Base form however is lagging due to the 50x multiplier. And Piccolo was putting his faith in SSJ Gotenks in the time chamber, not Base, as he's already seen what Base Gotenks can do (nothing).

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Why is Gotenks so underrated? Based on the fact that Goku was so confident in fusion that he left the fate of the Earth and potentially universe, you would expect Gotenks to at least be stronger than Android 16 of all people. And why would Piccolo be so excited about Gotenks forming in the rosat if Gotenks was even weaker than Piccolo?

What do you mean underrated? SSJ Gotenks isn't far off from SSJ3 Goku and has the ability to beat Fat Buu. Base form however is lagging due to the 50x multiplier. And Piccolo was putting his faith in SSJ Gotenks in the time chamber, not Base, as he's already seen what Base Gotenks can do (nothing).

Based on reactions at the lookout, it's hard to imagine Piccolo and everyone so shocked to find someone weaker than Piccolo himself form. Also, Kuririn saw Majin Vegeta get stomped by Fat Boo, but even said he thinks Gotenks might pull it off, imagine someone only as strong as Piccolo going to fight Fat Boo and Kuririn saying he has a chance, likely? No. and Piccolo even said "this might have a chance" upon seeing Gotenks form in the rosat, prior to knowing he could transform.

[Darkron2151]

Based on reactions at the lookout, it's hard to imagine Piccolo and everyone so shocked to find someone weaker than Piccolo himself form. Also, Kuririn saw Majin Vegeta get stomped by Fat Boo, but even said he thinks Gotenks might pull it off, imagine someone only as strong as Piccolo going to fight Fat Boo and Kuririn saying he has a chance, likely? No. and Piccolo even said "this might have a chance" upon seeing Gotenks form in the rosat, prior to knowing he could transform.

And they were both proven wrong and retract their statements when Base Gotenks ACTUALLY FACES BUU and LOSES. Their expectations and hype mean nothing it's later shown on what actually happens when Base Gotenks fights Buu. This is why I don't even take the Buu Arc seriously sometimes.... Everyone seems to be stupid in this part of the series. They know perfectly well how strong Buu is and can sense Fat Buu and Super Buu's ki, yet they think Base Gotenks can do something? Heck, Super Buu was even treating SSJ Gotenks like a joke, aside from the SGK attack.

[singsing]

Why is Gotenks so underrated? Based on the fact that Goku was so confident in fusion that he left the fate of the Earth and potentially universe, you would expect Gotenks to at least be stronger than Android 16 of all people. And why would Piccolo be so excited about Gotenks forming in the rosat if Gotenks was even weaker than Piccolo?

50x is a bigger multiplier than people seem to realize.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Why is Gotenks so underrated? Based on the fact that Goku was so confident in fusion that he left the fate of the Earth and potentially universe, you would expect Gotenks to at least be stronger than Android 16 of all people. And why would Piccolo be so excited about Gotenks forming in the rosat if Gotenks was even weaker than Piccolo?

50x is a bigger multiplier than people seem to realize.

Except;

SSJ Gotenks pre >= SSJ3 Goku > Base Gotenks pre > SSJ2 Goku/Majin Vegeta

definitely means 50x doesn't work with Gotenks

[Saiga]

Bojack vs Dabra

Meta Cooler vs Mecha Freeza

Base Gotenks (Post ROSAT and no limit on fusion) vs Android 16, 17 and 18 (Gauntlet style)

Super Namek Piccolo (Post ROSAT) vs SSJ Vegeta (Post ROSAT)

King Cold vs Kaioken Namek Goku (Pre Zenkai)

Pefect Cell vs East Kai

Dabra spit-takes this. :V

Meta Cooler destroys him. As pointed out, he beat two Super Saiyans stronger than the one who wasted Freeza.

Gotenks gets destroyed. He's a lot stronger than the likes of Goku and Vegeta but Super Saiyan is such a large multiplier that his base doesn't need to be that high for him to do what he does as a Super Saiyan and beyond.

If it's after Vegeta's first trip, he loses to Piccolo. After Vegeta's second trip, he crushes Piccolo.

I don't think King Cold would be that much weaker than Freeza if Freeza's relying on his back up. He defeats even post-zenkai Kaio-ken Goku.

Do you mean East Kaioshin? Because East Kaio would get destroyed by anyone after the Saiyan arc. I think East Kaioshin would get his ass kicked quite soundly anyway,

[Darkron2151]

Except;

SSJ Gotenks pre >= SSJ3 Goku > Base Gotenks pre > SSJ2 Goku/Majin Vegeta

definitely means 50x doesn't work with Gotenks

That's only if you think that Gotenks is that strong in base. And you would also have to think that the boys got a stronger fusion boost in Base than they did as SSJs. And also that Goku doesn't know how strong Super Saiyan is at this point.

[Eternal Super Saiyan]

Why is Gotenks so underrated? Based on the fact that Goku was so confident in fusion that he left the fate of the Earth and potentially universe, you would expect Gotenks to at least be stronger than Android 16 of all people. And why would Piccolo be so excited about Gotenks forming in the rosat if Gotenks was even weaker than Piccolo?

Since the SSJ multipliers are still factored we need to be conservative with Base Gotenks. We need to also remember SSJ3 Gotenks was about equal to Super Buu (normal) or even slightly weaker than. If Base Gotenks is already in the billions, then that puts him way higher than Ultimate Gohan when in SSJ3 form.

Unless there's something I'm missing and Super Buu is indeed 10-20x stronger than his previous Fat form. Which is really high looking on a PL list. One reason we make them, it puts everything in check so we don't blow this out of proportion.

[Darkron2151]

Since the SSJ multipliers are still factored we need to be conservative with Base Gotenks. We need to also remember SSJ3 Gotenks was about equal to Super Buu (normal) or even slightly weaker than. If Base Gotenks is already in the billions, then that puts him way higher than Ultimate Gohan when in SSJ3 form.

Unless there's something I'm missing and Super Buu is indeed 10-20x stronger than his previous Fat form. Which is really high looking on a PL list. One reason we make them, it puts everything in check so we don't blow this out of proportion.

I personally see Super Buu, SSJ3 Gotenks, and Ultimate Gohan around 6-10x stronger than SSJ3 Goku at this point. Not too much, yet not too little. The multipliers are still in effect IMO. And as for SSJ3 Gotenks vs. Super buu, I actually see Gotenks as the stronger one (not by much), as shown where he kind of rules the fight until he times out of SSJ3.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

why do people always think Super Boo is the stronger one? Gotenks was kicking his ass. Anyway, I see the top tier fusion guys like 45-50x Goku/Kid Boo

[Lord Beerus]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tien and Yamcha (EOZ)

[Darkron2151]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

1. SSJ3 Gogeta could beat him, but barely.

2. You mean the Cell Games? Because the Cell Arc is from the Trunks Saga to the Cell Games.

3. Ultimate Gohan creams him.

4. Lord Slug dominates. Lord Slug was comparable to Freeza's Fourth Form, who beat Nail in only his First Form.

5. I'll give it to 16, because in the end, Meta Cooler actually lost to the two Super Saiyans, while Imperfect Cell, who was around the same level as 16, was toying with 17 and Kamiccolo.

6. Pui Pui loses to Krillin alone IMO.

[Eternal Super Saiyan]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

2. SSJ Vegetto beats SPC by looking at him. (okay, maybe he fights but a few punches does him in)

3. Ultimate Gohan wins with little contest. (he makes short work of Super Buu while SSJ3 Gotenks couldn't do the same thing.

4. This could be even. Slug is a little stronger than Turles (pre-fruit) but I'm hesitant to put him above Jheece/Burter level.

5. Android 16 wins, but maybe after a lengthy battle.

6. Krillin and Yamcha lose, but Tenshinhan tri-beams Pui Pui and decimates him.

#1 I'm not sure about. If Vegetto is far superior than dance fusion, they could have near equal power.

[Saiga]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

I think Boo's got this. I would assume that Gogeta doesn't get any longer on his SS3 timer than Gotenks (at least, not enough to last full thirty minutes) so Boo can outlast him if that's even necessary. Hell, even if Gogeta lasts the full 30 minutes, Boo can just stall both fusions out and then it's Piccolo Boo stomping Goku and Vegeta into the dirt.

Vegetto stomps this hard. Even though Goku and Vegeta aren't very compatible at this stage, they'd still end up faaaaar beyond Cell.

All comes down to the ghosts, I suppose, because Gohan has Gotenks beat in power and efficiency quite handily. It's hard to say how effective the ghosts would be against most people, they're slow to produce and rely on an enemy being fairly careless.

Lord Slug destroys Nail, effortlessly.

Hard to say. Metal Coola at his first seen level would probably go down.

I think Pui Pui is comparable to either an average Saiyan, or at most Saiyan arc Vegeta. Any of the humans can take him one-on-one.

[Eternal Super Saiyan]

And they were both proven wrong and retract their statements when Base Gotenks ACTUALLY FACES BUU and LOSES. Their expectations and hype mean nothing it's later shown on what actually happens when Base Gotenks fights Buu. This is why I don't even take the Buu Arc seriously sometimes.... Everyone seems to be stupid in this part of the series. They know perfectly well how strong Buu is and can sense Fat Buu and Super Buu's ki, yet they think Base Gotenks can do something? Heck, Super Buu was even treating SSJ Gotenks like a joke, aside from the SGK attack.

Actually Piccolo advised Base Gotenks not to face Fat Buu until he was SSJ before fusing. Instead Gotenks ignored Piccolo and rushed off to get smashed by Buu.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

1. Super Boo, easily

2. Vegetto, Cell to Boo arc differences are minimal

3. Ultimate Gohan stomps

4. Slug

5. 16

6. Pui Pui

[Darkron2151]

6. Pui Pui loses to Krillin alone IMO.

Actually, I change my mind. Pui Pui can beat Krillin IMO. But the trio would be too much for him though.

[DBZAOTA482]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

1. SSJ3 Gogeta wins by a margin.

2. Vegetto wins these with some trouble.

3. Gohan wins with some trouble.

4. Lord Slug stomps.

5. #19 wins fairly easy.

6. Pui-Pui is as strong as an average Saiyan. He loses instantly.

[Kaboom]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta
Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)
Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)
Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)
Android 16 vs Metal Cooler
Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

— Gogeta at regular Super Saiyan is already a roughly even match for this Boo. Super Saiyan 2 is all he needs to guarantee a win. Super Saiyan 3 makes it SUPER easy.
— If Goku and Vegeta are their Cell Games selves, then this is an easy win for Vegetto.
— Gohan wins. Despite his extreme affinity for failure, he's STILL more effective than Gotenks. He's a little stronger, to boot.
— Hard for me to properly nail down Slug's power. But I typically place his young self at around as strong as 1st-form Freeza, and... well, we saw how well Nail fared against that type of power already.
— I generally give PuiPui some extra credit and place him between 1st- and 2nd-form Freeza, which makes him several times stronger than any of these three humans and able to beat 'em all up at the same time pretty easily. He could still lose if he gets hit by a Kienzan or Shin Kikoho, but it's not likely.

[ZombieVito]

Super Boo w/SSJ3 Gotenks & Piccolo absorbed vs SSJ3 Gogeta

Super Perfect Cell vs SSJ Vegetto (Cell arc)

Ultimate Gohan vs SSJ3 Gotenks (No time limit on transformation of fusion)

Nail vs Lord Slug (In his prime)

Android 16 vs Metal Cooler

Pui Pui vs Krillin, Tenshinhan and Yamcha (EOZ)

1) Gogeta wins by Gotenks time limit.

2) Base Vegetto one shots.

3) Gohan manages to win.

4) Slug wins.

5) 16 pulls this off.

6) I personally have all 3 over 1 million. They all one shot him individually.